GTR Timetable Change 2018

[The Stationmaster]

Overall what  is taking place, or in many instances not taking place, would appear to amount to a major lack of attention in forward planning and training.  Quite who is responsible for that is probably anybody's guess but its increasingly clear that something has gone desperately wrong and no doubt (as has happened elsewhere recently) some experienced, but retired, railway operator will be called in to try to establish what has gone wrong and how it might be possible to put it right.

[31A]

On the GN end, everything seems to have reverted to running to / from King's Cross today rather than going through the tunnels.

[Mike Storey]

Overall what  is taking place, or in many instances not taking place, would appear to amount to a major lack of attention in forward planning and training.  Quite who is responsible for that is probably anybody's guess but its increasingly clear that something has gone desperately wrong and no doubt (as has happened elsewhere recently) some experienced, but retired, railway operator will be called in to try to establish what has gone wrong and how it might be possible to put it right.

 

They've already done that - Chris Gibb - Gibb Report - The Sequel (or The Force Re-awakens). That is why the phasing has gone from 2 to 4 phases, and why DfT has (apparently) just upped the driver recruitment budget (following six years of Treasury - he say no), having been told about this 6 years ago (allegedly), somewhat after the Class 700 delivery schedule had already "slipped".

 

Quick on their feet? You betcha! No doubt the Minister has already announced it has been a total success, but with more to do, hrumff.

 

But as we are constantly told, it's all the fault of those bleeding privateers, innit?

 

Wonder why Georgey-Porgey and his Evening Standard, has been a little reticent to apportion blame on this one????

[roundhouse]

We have taken the long way round from Doncaster to Peterborough via Lincoln for beer then via Sleaford and Spalding.

 

On arrival at Peterborough one option was to take a Thameslink if East Coast was wedged. However the Thameslink service was announced as very delayed and passengers for Huntingdon and St Neots advised to take a replacement bus service.

 

Luckily the East Coast service from Leeds has plenty of seats available for the non stop run to the Cross. We have a room in central London tonight to avoid having to do battle home and then back into work tomorrow. A short walk across London Bridge will be far more pleasant in the morning.

[Fenman]

... However the Thameslink service was announced as very delayed and passengers for Huntingdon and St Neots advised to take a replacement bus service.

 

...

At lunchtime today, roughly every other TL train at St Pancras was cancelled, while half of those that were operating were running late.

 

The infection has spread to GN - undefined “operational incidents” meant my King’s Lynn to KX train was running late; was short-formed (no joining to a waiting set at Cambridge); then the “non-stop” run was abandoned with stops at Royston, Letchworth, Hitchin and Stevenage. 1st class was declassified to try to accommodate all the heaving masses on what is always a busy line.

 

What a mess.

 

Paul

[mdvle]

Mainly a lot of political speculation regarding how the issues could influence an early election but of interest are the performance figures for the first week of Thameslink as well as public statements from 3 different MPs that have been quoted https://www.londonreconnections.com/2018/the-politics-of-thameslinks-troubles/

[The Great Bear]

So today it seems and presumably for the foreseeable future the timetable has been amended on my line to delete the trains they can't run, East Grinstead to Bedford. Presumably that means you can't then make claims for cancelled trains?

[Wheatley]

Overall what  is taking place, or in many instances not taking place, would appear to amount to a major lack of attention in forward planning and training.  Quite who is responsible for that is probably anybody's guess but its increasingly clear that something has gone desperately wrong and no doubt (as has happened elsewhere recently) some experienced, but retired, railway operator will be called in to try to establish what has gone wrong and how it might be possible to put it right.

The short version is that the timetable planning process (and subsequent route/traction training , preparation of station workings etc) has been done in 4 months rather than the usual 9-12 months.

Edited May 29, 2018 by Wheatley

[roundhouse]

Luckily I had a pleasant short journey from the hotel near Monument to LBG this morning.

our normal commute from Redhill looked OK this morning

 

However it's starting to go wrong now.

 

Drparture board for Redhill

[The Stationmaster]

The short version is that the timetable planning process (and subsequent route/traction training , preparation of station workings etc) has been done in 4 months rather than the usual 9-12 months.

 

So no surprise whatsoever that it doesn't work, a 12 year old could have told 'them' that would be the case.

 

Although 12 months would be grossly excessive for detail timetable planning (but broadly correct for basic agreement).  And that still assumes that the plan is actually right (which could be difficult to prove in view of the other factors but the way it is going suggests that it has some major flaws irrespective of its short notice preparation).

[Wheatley]

True Mike, in normal circumstances, but this is the largest timetable overhaul I can remember in 30 years and in some cases they were almost starting again at the 'basic agreement' stage.

 

Either all 20-odd train operators have had a collective brain fart twice in a) agreeing to a massive cascade of rolling stock which relied on all Network Rail's key infrastructure projects being delivered on time and b) not noticing that they weren't going to be, or some other party which isn't publicly accepting the blame has pushed it through knowing that the TOCs and Network Rail will get all the grief.

 

[Edited for spelling]

Edited May 30, 2018 by Wheatley

[jonny777]

I don't think any stopping services are operating to/from Peterborough. I have been watching the cameras for a while (since the weather turned miserable) and have not seen a single 700 or 365 unit. 

[Darius43]

The Peter Principle seems to be working well at the top level in so many places in British life today, DfT, No.10, TSB, GTR etc. etc.

 

Darius

Edited May 29, 2018 by Darius43

[The Stationmaster]

True Mike, in normal circumstances, but this is the largest timetable overhaul I can remember in 30 years and in some cases they were almost starting again at the 'basic agreement' stage.

 

Either all 20-odd train operators have had a collective brain fart twice in a) agreeing to a massive cascade of rolling stock which relied on all Network Rail's key infrastructure projects being delivered on time and b) not noticing that they weren't going to be, or some other party which isn't publicly accepting the blame has pushed it through knowing that the TOCs and Network Rail will get all the grief.

 

[Edited for spelling]

 

Interesting to compare that with what originally happened on what was then 'Thameslink 2000' where work on timetable options began about 1996 and continued until at least 2002 (I know the latter date as I was hired to do some  timetable validation work on the scheme in that year).  I think I might still have somewhere one of the draft TTs - which were done in detail, fully timed and pathed - from the late 1990s although I definitely ditched a couple.  And of course by then the planning affected a number of operators - hence me getting copies of the proposed timetable drafts.

 

Although the people involved are gone nothing should have happened to prevent that process being kept up to date as the scheme developed into what it has become - in fact it would be odd if it was not led to some extent by timetable feasibility studies.  Equally a trainplan must surely have been prepared at some time, albeit perhaps only with outline timings, because how else would anybody know the fleet size required to operate whatever service was being thought about and developed?  And if you have a trainplan you also have something to work from in terms of crew diagramming, recruitment and training programmes plan.  So yes - I can understand the detail going into a timetable conference type of start about 12 months out - that makes sense but equally unless there were major conflicts between operators much of that should have been sorted even before that stage.

 

Overall and from what you have said it looks as if preliminary work was either inadequate or non-existent while the final part didn't even keep in sync with the standard production schedule.  Although May is a 'subsidiary' change date now there is still plenty of time in the process - for example the Production Schedule  required that NR should publish the WTT for the May 2018 change on 17 November 2017. i.e. 6 months before commencement date and there had been a 3 month preparation period before that including the Change Risk assessment date on 01 September 2017.   Some of the process is nowadays in my view far too long with what we used to achieve during the preparation period but the publication date, at a 6 month horizon, has been long established (although in my experience Railtrack were next to useless at achieving it; I don't know how good NR are but experience last December with engineering work driven TT changes suggests they too 'have their problems').

 

So several important questions emerge the first of which has to be why the WTT publication date was apparently missed while second is the matter of resource planning coming, seemingly, so late in the process as to be non-effective.  Clearly if the publication date is missed downstream activities will also be delayed.  All of which begs the most important question of all - why did the entire trainplanning and timetable planning process run so late and why wasn't the introduction deferred to take account of that delay (or late start).  But as I said above - I doubt we'll ever get any answers (let alone any objective ones?)  but I think it's about time a Parliamentary Select Committee stuck its nose very deeply into tracing what went so wrong as to create this shambles.

[roundhouse]

I saw this on the BBC:

 

Chris Grayling says GTR 'failed passengers' - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-44299902

[roundhouse]

And another normal day out of LBG to East Croydon

[mdvle]

BBC reporter has tweeted the actual letter from Chris Grayling https://twitter.com/tombarton/status/1001499768051421191

[Claude_Dreyfus]

Unfortunately statements like this from Chris Grayling are as helpful as the RMT-coined 'Meltdown Monday', which the BBC (amongst others) have gleefully seized upon.

 

Talking to a couple of more 'in the know' commuters, it sounds like it could be as long as 3 months before the rosters are finally sorted out (something to do with roster cycles?). Issues around signaller familiarisation should be resolved in about a month.

 

From a purely selfish point of view, my services have been pretty reliable. The split and join at Horsham for the London Bridge services have, as expected, resulted in delays, but all in all the service runs and is more or less on time...which given the issues elsewhere is something to be thankful for.

Edited May 30, 2018 by Claude_Dreyfus

[mdvle]

So several important questions emerge the first of which has to be why the WTT publication date was apparently missed while second is the matter of resource planning coming, seemingly, so late in the process as to be non-effective.  Clearly if the publication date is missed downstream activities will also be delayed.  All of which begs the most important question of all - why did the entire trainplanning and timetable planning process run so late and why wasn't the introduction deferred to take account of that delay (or late start).  But as I said above - I doubt we'll ever get any answers (let alone any objective ones?)  but I think it's about time a Parliamentary Select Committee stuck its nose very deeply into tracing what went so wrong as to create this shambles.

 

I suspect somebody somewhere said the government has spent £6 billion on this infrastructure upgrade so we need to be seen to be using it now.

 

But the cynical can also speculate now that the government seem to be blaming everything on NR that it is an excuse to justify re-privatizing NR.

[chrisf]

The expression "Physician, heal thyself" comes to mind.

 

Chris

[locoholic]

I feel so sorry for people who have apparently lost their jobs because they keep being late due to the chaos on the railways.

 

Grayling is a useless transport minister and ought to resign.

[The Stationmaster]

BBC reporter has tweeted the actual letter from Chris Grayling https://twitter.com/tombarton/status/1001499768051421191

 

Some good comments on there - plus few idiots (but they always know better of course).

I suspect somebody somewhere said the government has spent £6 billion on this infrastructure upgrade so we need to be seen to be using it now.

 

But the cynical can also speculate now that the government seem to be blaming everything on NR that it is an excuse to justify re-privatizing NR.

 

NR is what Govt has made it.  Recent issues suggest that its timetable organisation is either understaffed or lacking in professional competence or both because of its  seeming inability to achieve its deadlines.  But the GTR debacle goes way beyond that because there would clearly (from delay causes) appear to be issues which are within the TOC's remit and which might well be traced back back to DafT (note I did say 'might').  Grayling's comments are basically an a*se covering job and mean absolutely nothing without any relevant specific detail.

 

However I remain of the view that NR's decision to remove its timetable work from its previous close relationship with the operational railway was downright stupid as it destroyed a level of close liaison and this was componded by its even more stupid decision to base the organisation in a location which had offered little incentive for experienced staff to move with the work and to be able to train newcomers.  This has reacted in all sorts of ways including I strongly suspect possession planning for GWML electrification plus the case in Scotland of lack of urgency in clearing routes for a well known steam engine as well as resulting in appalling delays in getting timetable data out at the required 26 week horizon.  If NR have also reduced staff (I'd be surprised if they hadn't) then things would appear to be self inflicted  No doubt some of it has to be down to both Railtrack's and NR's failure to put in charge of that part of their organisation people with the relevant experience of how the job needs to be done and what is needed to do it (a problem I suffered from a train operator's operations planning viewpoint back in Railtrack days when they put somebody with no operational or timetable planning experience in charge of the timetable process, and he didn't understand the word 'customer' either).

 

BUT that will only be one part of what has gone wrong with this timetable.  

[The Stationmaster]

Unfortunately statements like this from Chris Grayling are as helpful as the RMT-coined 'Meltdown Monday', which the BBC (amongst others) have gleefully seized upon.

 

Talking to a couple of more 'in the know' commuters, it sounds like it could be as long as 3 months before the rosters are finally sorted out (something to do with roster cycles?). Issues around signaller familiarisation should be resolved in about a month.

 

From a purely selfish point of view, my services have been pretty reliable. The split and join at Horsham for the London Bridge services have, as expected, resulted in delays, but all in all the service runs and is more or less on time...which given the issues elsewhere is something to be thankful for.

I'd be interested to know why it will take 12 weeks to sort a roster - that sounds like juvenile managers trotting out excuses about something they don't understand.  How the heck do they think BR managed introducing major service changes?

[roundhouse]

Until today we had a 17.00 and a 17.21 but not now shown and the 17.30 is cancelled.

And to prove its not just the online timetable Re the 17.21 service to Gatwick via Redhill

Edited May 30, 2018 by roundhouse

[phil-b259]

I saw this on the BBC:

 

Chris Grayling says GTR 'failed passengers' - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-44299902

 

Given the actions of his department over the past 5 years, it would be more truthful to say that Chris Grayling / Paul Wilkinson / the DfT have 'failed GTR' - with somewhat predictable results for passengers.

 

Not for the first time I find myself wondering whether had a certain referendum produced a different result, whether things would have got quite this bad......