Caley Jim Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 8 hours ago, TurboSnail said: @Skinnylinny has drawn up a couple of nice Gloucester(ish) wagons, so I'm building a couple to add a bit more variety to the Guilford Colliery stock. Will be experimenting with transfers too... This one's a stone/quarry wagon, possibly providing some building materials for bits of the colliery that haven't quite been finished yet. Forgive me commenting, but the metal strapping around the end of the dumb buffer was normally let into the wood so that it was flush all round and set back an inch or two with the end of the buffer chamfered. Jim 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurboSnail Posted July 12, 2021 Author Share Posted July 12, 2021 Quite possibly. On the SER ballast wagons the strapping wasn't flush, but was set back. It's not like @Skinnylinnyto miss details, so maybe they have a pic of the prototype or drawing? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinnylinny Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 I'm not at home at the moment, but I do have a very grainy side-on photo of one of the wagons on which the 5-plank one is based (a Honeyball & Son private owner). It is hard to tell, but the strapping does appear (based on shadows) to stand proud of the woodwork. Plus, it makes it easier to pick out with a paintbrush! The wood does extend slightly beyond the strapping on the model. The 3-plank wagon is a flight of fancy, bodged from the five-plank, so I accept criticisms on that one! 4 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurboSnail Posted July 13, 2021 Author Share Posted July 13, 2021 From this... To this! It's not the most dramatic conversion ever, but this sort of simple, easy modelling is pretty fun. It's had one compartment changed to a Guard's, seats repainted, no smoking signs removed, compartment dividers added, electric lighting gear removed, a repaint and new lettering. It will at some point (I'm out of 3D printer resin at the moment) get gas lighting vents, replacement buffers, possibly lower footboards and alarm gear on the ends. But I'm happy with it for now looking a bit less 'Hornby' - the RTR 6-wheel brakes are only available with duckets as a 3-compartment, so just a bit different and closer to the prototype's Midland origin to have a 4-comp without duckets. (As an FYI, the main reason I've been doing these coaches is that they're cheap - Jadlam can't seem to get rid of them at the moment so they've been £15 to £20 on there for ages. https://www.jadlamracingmodels.com/railways/clearance/?search_query=&page=1&limit=80&sort=priceasc&category=674&is_category_page=1) 5 1 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mpeffers Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 Lovely. Between that and the price you’ve found, I’m very tempted. Working theory for my EGR was that non-bogie stock had largely been withdrawn by my post-WWI period (this was the case on the M&SWJR, which is steering a lot of my decisions) but perhaps I could retain a full set or two for some of the unglamorous local traffic... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurboSnail Posted July 13, 2021 Author Share Posted July 13, 2021 14 minutes ago, mpeffers said: Lovely. Between that and the price you’ve found, I’m very tempted. Working theory for my EGR was that non-bogie stock had largely been withdrawn by my post-WWI period (this was the case on the M&SWJR, which is steering a lot of my decisions) but perhaps I could retain a full set or two for some of the unglamorous local traffic... Thanks - it's fun modelling for not much outlay! It might not just be passenger traffic these could be used for... Does your line have an industry that runs workman's trains? Or engineers trains might consist of a couple of ballast wagons and an old coach converted to a workshop/shelter. I'm sure there are other excuses to run them too! 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 49 minutes ago, mpeffers said: Lovely. Between that and the price you’ve found, I’m very tempted. Working theory for my EGR was that non-bogie stock had largely been withdrawn by my post-WWI period (this was the case on the M&SWJR, which is steering a lot of my decisions) but perhaps I could retain a full set or two for some of the unglamorous local traffic... One thought is how typical the M&SWJR was for a line of its size in that regard? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mpeffers Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 1 hour ago, TurboSnail said: It might not just be passenger traffic these could be used for... Does your line have an industry that runs workman's trains? Or engineers trains might consist of a couple of ballast wagons and an old coach converted to a workshop/shelter. I'm sure there are other excuses to run them too! I think the Cotswolds mostly just dealt in milk and livestock. The MSWJR did open their own quarry at Foss Cross (I’m fairly sure they used it for their ballast, not sure if any was sold on also) and there were exchange sidings for a short-lived quarry at Charlton Kings, both of which would have been on EGR metals had they opened the Cheltenham-Oxford route in advance of the BCDR and MSWJR. 34 minutes ago, Edwardian said: One thought is how typical the M&SWJR was for a line of its size in that regard? Possibly not very? It’s difficult to say. They even fairly extensively rebuilt their non-bogie stock (new roof profile, electric lights) not long before disposing of it. My best guess is that the company simply had enough bogie stock to cover for the timetable (possibly as the number of through services were reduced?) and the non-bogie stock became surplus to requirements. I’m not aware that any of it was sold on, though? 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 11 minutes ago, mpeffers said: I think the Cotswolds mostly just dealt in milk and livestock. The MSWJR did open their own quarry at Foss Cross (I’m fairly sure they used it for their ballast, not sure if any was sold on also) and there were exchange sidings for a short-lived quarry at Charlton Kings, both of which would have been on EGR metals had they opened the Cheltenham-Oxford route in advance of the BCDR and MSWJR. Possibly not very? It’s difficult to say. They even fairly extensively rebuilt their non-bogie stock (new roof profile, electric lights) not long before disposing of it. My best guess is that the company simply had enough bogie stock to cover for the timetable (possibly as the number of through services were reduced?) and the non-bogie stock became surplus to requirements. I’m not aware that any of it was sold on, though? Midland & Great Northern, 183 route miles, built and ran 4-wheel mainline stock. 6-wheelers tended to be those gifted by the supporting companies from c.1903. No bogie coaches, so far as I recall, until Grouping. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted July 13, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 13, 2021 43 minutes ago, Edwardian said: Midland & Great Northern, 183 route miles, built and ran 4-wheel mainline stock. 6-wheelers tended to be those gifted by the supporting companies from c.1903. No bogie coaches, so far as I recall, until Grouping. Yes, but the long-distance journeys were, I would suspect, largely made by passengers travelling on or off the system in the Great Northern or Midland through carriages. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mpeffers Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 17 minutes ago, Compound2632 said: Yes, but the long-distance journeys were, I would suspect, largely made by passengers travelling on or off the system in the Great Northern or Midland through carriages. Therein could lie the answer? The MSWJR seemed to mainly deal in through services - even sold on most of their tank engines. I fear we’re digressing a little bit, much as I am enjoying the discussion. Might either start my own topic (gulp) or move this over to the freelance PG thread. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 Well, there was the MR's 'Leicester', otherwise I suspect short coaches all the way. The MGN might have been an extreme example in the other direction. Most lines of the size would probably have been a mix, e.g. the Cambrian, building both bogies and 6-wheelers in the late '90s. My point is, unless the freelance line is a proxy MSWJR, handling the same traffic flows in the same way, it's not necessarily a representative prototype to copy too slavishly in this regard. If it isn't just a freelance version of the MSWJR, it is legitimate to ask how typical the M&SWJR was in relation to any given feature? So, another question might be whether your line is sending its coaches off system on long-distance through services, or, whether larger neighbours are sending their coaches onto your system? In the former case, you will probably want some bogies, with 6-wheelers on local journeys, assuming, like most lines, you have local services running within the confines of your own system. If the latter, you might not have call for bogie coaches, which, I suggest, would be an unlikely extravagance for one of the smaller companies without a definite traffic need for them in the 1900s and 1910s. But, yes, we are rather hi-jacking Tom's topic! 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurboSnail Posted July 14, 2021 Author Share Posted July 14, 2021 Digressions welcome - this thread is enough of a backwater that it's not going to annoy anyone too much! The EKR got away with using smaller, older coaches as it was mainly a coal traffic railway. They started with basic ex-KESR carriages (which in turn were ex-CLC) with the only bogie coaches being the ex-KESR Pickering ones. Then they "upgraded" to ex-LCDR 4 and 6 wheelers - by 1945, the most modern coach on the line (excluding the 1905 built Pickerings) was of 1893 vintage! Then finally in 1946 a couple of ex-LSWR bogie coaches were used until passenger workings stopped in 1948. Which all gives the impression of passenger traffic not being the highest priority! Most through traffic would have been quicker going via the main lines to Dover and Ramsgate, so not many visitors either from what I can work out. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamsRadial Posted July 14, 2021 Share Posted July 14, 2021 13 hours ago, TurboSnail said: Which all gives the impression of passenger traffic not being the highest priority! During the short period they ran them, the workman's trains to the (unauthorised) halt in Tilmanstone yard were probably the most-frequented coaches. 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurboSnail Posted July 25, 2021 Author Share Posted July 25, 2021 I accidentally paid a visit to Threlkeld Quarry whilst the steam gala was warming up on Friday, I was expecting one loco in steam so was pleasantly surprised to find four! If you're into stuff that anyone in their right mind would call scrap (and I mean this in the nicest possible way!) then they have yards and yards of it, all over the place. Ideal for someone who's got a narrow gauge layout in the pipeline, I've taken loads of photos for detritus inspiration, and some more close ups of a BEV to revise my CAD drawing slightly. 8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlfaZagato Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 You say scrap, but I'd wager that little battery job you posted last would grind away with some water in the cells & a charge. Plenty of videos on YT of people reviving old diesels like those cranes and the face shovel with a few hour's fussing with the motor. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurboSnail Posted July 26, 2021 Author Share Posted July 26, 2021 6 hours ago, AlfaZagato said: You say scrap, but I'd wager that little battery job you posted last would grind away with some water in the cells & a charge. Plenty of videos on YT of people reviving old diesels like those cranes and the face shovel with a few hour's fussing with the motor. I say scrap in a slightly facetious way - I'd much rather they were available somewhere to see like this than actually being scrapped. Some were definitely beyond help though with the amount of bits rusted away - still useful as a modelling resource and for historical interest though. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Regularity Posted July 26, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 26, 2021 22 minutes ago, TurboSnail said: Some were definitely beyond help though with the amount of bits rusted away Given the number of prototype “rebuilds” where not much more than the wheel centres (for example) were used, that is not an obstacle to restoration. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted July 26, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 26, 2021 5 hours ago, Regularity said: Given the number of prototype “rebuilds” where not much more than the wheel centres (for example) were used, that is not an obstacle to restoration. Most vintage railway carriage restorations seem to involve replacing the surviving woodwork, then the surviving metalwork, then refitting the interior with entirely new materials. The pieces that are discarded have served as templates for the new material. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurboSnail Posted July 28, 2021 Author Share Posted July 28, 2021 Another wagon rolls off the production line, this time a D1419 van - I've based it on the 1874 Ashford-built ones (I think) without roof vents. It's fairly small compared to later wagons! Needs a few painted details picking out, and transfers - the normal ones I use are too big to fit correctly in the panels! 6 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Regularity Posted July 28, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 28, 2021 On 26/07/2021 at 16:50, Compound2632 said: Most vintage railway carriage restorations seem to involve replacing the surviving woodwork, then the surviving metalwork, then refitting the interior with entirely new materials. The pieces that are discarded have served as templates for the new material. And then mounting the body on the under frame of a former parcels van… 32 minutes ago, TurboSnail said: Another wagon rolls off the production line, this time a D1419 van - I've based it on the 1874 Ashford-built ones (I think) without roof vents. It's fairly small compared to later wagons! Needs a few painted details picking out, and transfers - the normal ones I use are too big to fit correctly in the panels! That’s very nice, and a nice surface finish to it. 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caley Jim Posted July 28, 2021 Share Posted July 28, 2021 And then mounting the body on the under frame of a former parcels van… Which had been built on the underframe of a withdrawn coach..... Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CKPR Posted July 28, 2021 Share Posted July 28, 2021 Given the number of prototype “rebuilds” where not much more than the wheel centres (for example) were used, that is not an obstacle to restoration I have one part of a Gresley non-corridor coach, a small cast plate showing on/off for a valve of some kind - I'm wondering if my rebuild / restoration plans might be a bit over-ambitious ? 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Regularity Posted July 28, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 28, 2021 On 26/07/2021 at 16:50, Compound2632 said: Most vintage railway carriage restorations seem to involve replacing the surviving woodwork, then the surviving metalwork, then refitting the interior with entirely new materials. The pieces that are discarded have served as templates for the new material. 1 hour ago, CKPR said: I have one part of a Gresley non-corridor coach, a small cast plate showing on/off for a valve of some kind - I'm wondering if my rebuild / restoration plans might be a bit over-ambitious ? Too much has been discarded: nothing left to use as templates. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wainwright1 Posted July 28, 2021 Share Posted July 28, 2021 8 hours ago, TurboSnail said: Another wagon rolls off the production line, this time a D1419 van - I've based it on the 1874 Ashford-built ones (I think) without roof vents. It's fairly small compared to later wagons! Needs a few painted details picking out, and transfers - the normal ones I use are too big to fit correctly in the panels! That looks the part. When's the order book open ? All the best Ray 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now