LMS 3 plank

[hmrspaul]

The 4-plank wagons were the successor design to the 3-plank wagons, with 24,208 built 1887-1902; these had conventional brakes. These were followed by the 200 4-plank wagons with DC brakes, diagram O5 (the subject of the Coopercraft kit) before the advent of the first 5-plank design, diagram O4 (also Coopercraft), of which a mere 2,706 were built 1901-1904.

 

Prior to the 3-plank design, Atkins lists 4,904 2-plank wagons (of the same depth I believe), built 1871-1878 and even deeper into antiquity, 1,790 1-plank wagons built 1868-1871, so there's a steady progression towards higher-sided merchandise wagons through the last third of the nineteenth century.

 

These are all standard gauge wagons (though including some conversions from broad gauge); some at least of the 1-plank wagons were built at Saltney.

 

I did have time on my hands about a year ago - I even made my abstract of Atkins available as a pdf.

 

Apologies, we've wandered well off topic...

Atkins et al ignore and misidentiify the three plank wagons. As I've just published

 

Bartlett, Paul (2018) Taff Vale Railway 7851 – 7949 drop-side wagons – their GWR/BR Usage. Journal of the Historical Model Railway Society vol 23 (1) p 5- 10.

 

the GWR inherited thousands of three plank wagons from the TVR alone, batches being built until the eve of the Grouping The GWR used them for various traffics, but mainly as container carrying wagons. Some lasted for a decade into BR days. The main research is available at

https://hmrs.org.uk/media/wysiwyg/journal/JHMRS_vol23_no01_p007_TVR_wagons_extra_table.pdf

 

To get back on topic. Like the MRly and LMS, BR found the LMS design very useful, including for containers. BR copied the MR in using them as spoil and ballast wagons - This is very dense and it was too easy to overload 5 plank high wagons. 

 

https://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/lms3plankopen

 

https://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/brmediumwood

 

Paul

Edited October 21, 2018 by hmrspaul

[The Johnster]

That depends on the wagon. The LNWR D103 1-plank wagons that were modified for container traffic, with drop sides and AVB, were 7'4" wide internally.

 

EDIT: What I'm getting at here, as someone who doesn't know much about BR-designed wagons, is that these terms "Medfit" and "Highfit" may not be relevant to the late LMS period (which I think is where the Johnster sits? - or at least is the period of the livery of the model in question). These sound to me to be generic terms, denoting, I infer, a 3-plank and a 5-plank wagon with AVB - the LMS had a multitude of different diagrams of these; its own designs and those inherited from its constituents. They by no means had common internal dimensions. But I await correction!

 

Apologies, Stephen, I am so used to using the terms that I fail to remember that not everyone understands them!

 

You have the basic principle by inference; it's pretty self-explanatory.  I believe the terms are rooted in telegraphic code abbreviations, and were a general description of a type of wagon rather than a precise one of a particular design.  FLAT is self-explanatory, CONFLAT is adapted with chain pockets for containers, LOW is a 1 plank dropside/end, MED is a 3 or 4 plank. and can be either dropside/end or central door, HIGH is the standard 5 plank or steel bodied equivalent, MIN is a 7 or 8 plank mineral.  FIT suffix denotes automatic brakes, vacuum by default, and there are variants such as HYBAR, a 5 plank with a tarpaulin bar.  Internal and external dimensions, wheelbases, and load capacity tonnage could vary within each type.

 

I do not know when the terms came into use, and they may well be a BR thing as David M says.

 

I model a South Wales BLT in the early 50s, time period being 'between 1948 and 1958', so feel happy to include vehicles with Big 4 liveries, especially the later ones; indeed, one of the attractions of modelling this period is the variety of liveries that could be seen on coaches and especially wagons.    I try to weather the older liveries more heavily than the more recent ones, and like the occasional juxtaposition of wagons or vans of the same design in Big 4 next to the same in BR liveries.  I am keen to preserve this MED in the LMS dark red/brown as bought because it is the only vehicle I have in this livery.

 

I have several vehicles in LMS livery, as the biggest contributor to BR's general merchandise wagon pool on nationalisation was the LMS, understandably since this was the biggest big 4 company by a considerable margin, followed in order by the LNER, GWR, and Southern.  I have no GW or Southern opens at the moment, in original or BR livery, and hope to rectify this soon.

 

Naturally, as a South Wales modeller, the bulk of my wagons are minerals of various types and in different liveries, but there is room for an interesting selection of general merchandise.

[gwrrob]

A bump for this thread after finding this rather nice photo of one at Weymouth. Photo credit J B Bucknall.

 

[Enterprisingwestern]

 

Another bump for this thread!

A heads up for anyone contemplating doing what I am doing.

Having unearthed a body  in the depths of the roundtuit 40' container (third one along, fourth one up!) and having a Peco PA36 and various Lanarkshire goodies in stock I thought I'd give it a go, all as simple as you might expect, other than the fact that the body is about 1 and a bit mm  too long, so if it bothers you, fillets will be required at the end of the solebars, especially if like me you fabricate your own (not provided in PA36) buffer beams out of C channel.

 

Mike.

[gwrrob]

25 minutes ago, Enterprisingwestern said:

 

and various Lanarkshire goodies in stock I thought I'd give it a go,

 

Which of Dave's products in particular @Enterprisingwestern

[Enterprisingwestern]

32 minutes ago, gwrrob said:

 

Which of Dave's products in particular @Enterprisingwestern

 

Buffers, coupling hook, vac pipe, vac cylinder and operating lever.

 

Mike.

[Enterprisingwestern]

 

It's nice to have a quick project which goes according to plan for once.

The upside down view shows which and where Uncle Daves bits go.

Tie bars will be added when I've done the painting and suchlike due to sausage fingers!

 

Mike.

[gwrrob]

You didn't use much from the Parkside PC16 chassis kit then, solebars and brakes/ levers,  which buffers did you use ?

Edited October 1, 2023 by gwrrob
info.

[Enterprisingwestern]

3 hours ago, gwrrob said:

You didn't use much from the Parkside PC16 chassis kit then, solebars and brakes/ levers,  which buffers did you use ?

 

There's not that much usable in a PA36 TBPH!

Buffers are B003.

 

Mike.