RMweb Premium jjb1970 Posted January 12 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 12 (edited) If people understand the structure of shipping there are multiple ways to drill down and look at ship routing (ships serving Israeli ports such as Ashdod, Haifa and Eilat), ownership and management. There is indeed evidence that ships associated with Israel or Israeli interests or those countries actively supporting Israel are being identified and targeted. You don't need spyships to do that, perhaps more troubling for those countries supporting military action it seems some ship operators (with official approval) have stated they will not serve Israeli ports in order to secure safe passage. For example this week there's been a lot of noise about COSCO and OOCL. The industry seems to have split between operators associated with the NATO bloc and the rest of the world, with the second group taking a position that it's not their war so do what's necessary to avoid being unduly affected. Edited January 12 by jjb1970 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium jjb1970 Posted January 12 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 12 19 hours ago, KeithMacdonald said: Case in point: https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/technology/will-turkish-built-calmac-ferries-isle-of-islay-and-loch-indaal-be-completed-before-glen-sannox-and-glen-rosa-at-ferguson-marine/ar-AA1mBLJb The joke in shipbuilding circles was that Ferguson did more to damage British shipbuilding than the Luftwaffe. And it's not just hindsight, when the order was announced I listened to numerous predictions of what would happen which were pretty prescient. 3 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium J. S. Bach Posted January 12 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 12 4 hours ago, jjb1970 said: The joke in shipbuilding circles was that Ferguson did more to damage British shipbuilding than the Luftwaffe. ...snip... True, but the Luftwaffe was random and, from what I read here, Ferguson is daily. 🙂 4 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeithMacdonald Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 5 hours ago, jjb1970 said: If people understand the structure of shipping there are multiple ways to drill down and look at ship routing (ships serving Israeli ports such as Ashdod, Haifa and Eilat), ownership and management. Indeed, it's trivially easy with AIS tracking using "open source" data. e.g. https://www.vesselfinder.com/ or https://www.marinetraffic.com/en/ais/home/centerx:34.7/centery:31.9/zoom:10 and https://www.marinetraffic.com/en/ais/home/centerx:47.9/centery:13.3/zoom:6 Any ancient old duffer (like us, with just a casual interest) could do it in a few minutes. So, just consider how much more could/would/might be done by a single highly-motivated person. Would have to be willing to spend many hours a day viewing traffic, logging ships details, cross-referencing the beneficial owner origins, etc. But actually simple to do, if you had the willingness to do it. 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium jjb1970 Posted January 13 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 13 The commercial intelligence sources which can tell you an awful lot are the likes of Clarksons and IHS. Their services aren't cheap but paying for access is chump change to a state player or well funded organization. 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alastairq Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Legend Posted January 19 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 19 Interesting . An aspect of the Red Sea issue and ships going round the Cape of Good Hope is that Containers are being tied up/utilised for longer meaning that containers are once again in short supply . I hadn’t thought of this , although it seems very logical that longer sea times will lead to a lack of availability of empty containers . Apparently container rates have doubled since the new year ! I’ll wait for that as an excuse to increase prices , despite the fact there was no reduction from the last peak . 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium jjb1970 Posted January 20 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 20 I guess the question is what next? Air strikes haven't stopped the attacks on ships, they've made things worse. Do we keep launching air strikes indefinitely? Do we consider putting boots on the ground? Do we talk to ansarallah? Do we just send ships associated with Israel, US, UK and other countries the Yemenis don't like round the Cape and wait? The obvious question before we embarked on air strikes was what we would do if they didn't work. 1 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 4630 Posted January 20 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 20 Rather unfortunate. Fortunately though no injuries reported, other than just pride. Two Royal Navy warships collide off coast of Bahrain 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Kris Posted January 20 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 20 55 minutes ago, 4630 said: Rather unfortunate. Fortunately though no injuries reported, other than just pride. Two Royal Navy warships collide off coast of Bahrain The video of it shows it being quite an impact. 4 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deeps Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 1 hour ago, 4630 said: Rather unfortunate. Fortunately though no injuries reported, other than just pride. And, possibly, the end of at least one promising career. 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 4630 Posted January 20 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 20 56 minutes ago, Kris said: The video of it shows it being quite an impact. Yes. Not a gentle 'kiss' was it. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Legend Posted January 20 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 20 1 hour ago, Kris said: The video of it shows it being quite an impact. Ooops Left hand down a bit ! Quite a crunch . Are these GRP? 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Kris Posted January 20 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 20 56 minutes ago, Legend said: Ooops Left hand down a bit ! Quite a crunch . Are these GRP? I believe that they are GRP. There is quite a hole! Just found this photo in the Sun (sorry). 1 4 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hroth Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 I note that Bangor was due to be "decommissioned" next year. Perhaps that will be accellerated... And the Navy shrinks again. 3 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben B Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 Sneaky behind-the-scenes filming of a reboot of The Navy Lark? ;) 3 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
billbedford Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 1 hour ago, Kris said: I believe that they are GRP. There is quite a hole! I'm sure a couple of tins of Isopon will fix that... 1 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockershovel Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 17 hours ago, jjb1970 said: I guess the question is what next? Air strikes haven't stopped the attacks on ships, they've made things worse. Do we keep launching air strikes indefinitely? Do we consider putting boots on the ground? Do we talk to ansarallah? Do we just send ships associated with Israel, US, UK and other countries the Yemenis don't like round the Cape and wait? The obvious question before we embarked on air strikes was what we would do if they didn't work. I think we're about done, when it comes to "putting boots on the ground" in the Aden/Suez area.... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnofwessex Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 14 hours ago, rockershovel said: I think we're about done, when it comes to "putting boots on the ground" in the Aden/Suez area.... Now we are on to putting holes in our own ships............ 3 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
billbedford Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 The odd thing about the video is the time it takes to shut down the engines. I thought a minehunter would have had bridge control of the engines. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnofwessex Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 36 minutes ago, billbedford said: The odd thing about the video is the time it takes to shut down the engines. I thought a minehunter would have had bridge control of the engines. With the original engines we could have restarted Balmorals and had them running for several minutes before the impact occurred, and thats with Direct Reversing engines 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium jjb1970 Posted January 21 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 21 16 hours ago, rockershovel said: I think we're about done, when it comes to "putting boots on the ground" in the Aden/Suez area.... My fear is that the current lot in American and European capitals seem to have forgotten what diplomacy is and seem incapable of considering anything other than escalation. I can't help thinking we have crossed another Rubicon and will end up in another quagmire. The Saudi led coalition bombed Yemen intensively for years and ended up desperate to find a face saving way out. 1 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alastairq Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 Re-the collision...I know little of modern ships' mechanical problems [having been a Navigation Cadet all very much in the era of the sextant]...but I do wonder, watching the video, whether there had been an issue with the control of the engines...and in which direction they went? Others who are professionally involved may know different, but I recall certain makes of ships main diesel engines actually having a trait of folk not being certain which way they'd turn [for sure?] when re-stating from 'engine stop?' The name 'Doxford' somehow springs to mind? My experience was solely with shtim and Burmeister & Wain...But I do recall having had the hammering home of '''when ringing down for full astern, confirm [make damned sure] the rev counter started swinging in the desired direction....'' Obviously those older folk on the bridge had suffered harrowing experiences in this direction? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeithMacdonald Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 On 20/01/2024 at 01:54, jjb1970 said: I guess the question is what next? Air strikes haven't stopped the attacks on ships, they've made things worse. Why air strikes with bombs? To preserve (if possible) the limited number of AD and cruise missiles our ships can carry, before needing to return to base to replenish from our limited supply. It's another NATO blundering classic, starting another whack-a-mole action with a very limited supply chain that cannot be sustained. Recommended reading for more in-depth analysis from the International Institute for Strategic Studies (IISS) : https://www.iiss.org/online-analysis/military-balance/2024/01/houthi-anti-ship-missile-systems-getting-better-all-the-time/ Note also the MSM obfuscation on why the Houthis are doing this now, and their history. Stock library pictures portrays the Houthis as a sandal-wearing ragtag army with hand-me-down weapons. Not so much mentioned is they have years of practice fighting Saudi Arabia (etc) and are well-practiced in the tactics. Quote Neighbouring Saudi Arabia feared the Houthis would take over Yemen and make it a satellite of its rival, Iran. It formed a coalition of Arab countries that intervened in the war. But years of air strikes and ground fighting have not dislodged the Houthis from most of the territory they seized. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67614911 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeithMacdonald Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 1 hour ago, billbedford said: The odd thing about the video is the time it takes to shut down the engines. 36 minutes ago, johnofwessex said: With the original engines we could have restarted Balmorals Ironically (in a railway forum) the original engines in the Hunt-class ships were Napier Deltics. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hunt-class_mine_countermeasures_vessel https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napier_Deltic 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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