Proceedings of the Castle Aching Parish Council, 1905

[drmditch]

I am old enough to remember the origins of the title 'Grauniad'. (Although not quite old enough to remember the Mancunian precursor.)

 

The naming of 'The Torygraph' is self evident.

 

Is anyone aware of a suitable alternative title for the 'Mail'?

 

Times were when one could trust 'The Times', and the 'Independant' was exactly that.

 

I tend to use the BBC News web site rather than any of the broadcast versions. The layout and attribution of sources (can be/is re-assuring.

 

As Mr Edwardian said above, thank heavens for Radio3 which has been my basic listening since 2016. I wonder how long it will last under the regime of Ms Dorries and those like her?

Edited August 26, 2022 by drmditch

[woodenhead]

I was watching this the other day, it's quite chilling how close some 'democratic' countries are to this.

 

 

[Andy Hayter]

1 hour ago, drmditch said:

 

 

Is anyone aware of a suitable alternative title for the 'Mail'?

 

 

 

 

The Daily Heil is the term used round here which given their views pre WW2 and it seems ever since is not that much of an exaggeration.  

[monkeysarefun]

22 hours ago, Phil Parker said:

FWIW, I've seen TV in Australia as mentioned earlier, and it's horrible (Canada wasn't any better). But that is the way we are going

I dunno, seen some pretty dire stuff with  the BBC watermark on it  lately on YouTube to be honest.

Exhibit one, story about the UK drought, BBC reporter standing in the cracked mud of some kind of dried out pond "This time last year, I would not have been able to do this without getting my feet wet!"

  Then reveals she is standing beside some poor drought boffin who is wondering what he is doing there when they could have done the interview from the carpark. "Can you describe to me just what this place we are standing in would have been like, just 6 months ago?" Boffin with AreYouSerious? look on his face: "Well, we'd have been standing in 18 inches of water".

 

BBC reporter nods wisely with satisfied look on her face like she's got  the Pulitzer in the bag. 

 

Exhibit 2 -  Studio interview with hot weather boffin when recent high temps were pending. BBC reporter to hot weather boffin:  "Can you describe, for the rest of the world who might have no concept, what 40 degrees looks like or feels like?"

Actually, much of the rest of the world is well aquainted with what 40 and  more looks like and feels like and thinks "hmm, 40 degrees again, better get the grass cut early before the cricket starts.."

 

Edited August 27, 2022 by monkeysarefun

[Edwardian]

9 hours ago, Andy Hayter said:

 

 

The Daily Heil is the term used round here which given their views pre WW2 and it seems ever since is not that much of an exaggeration.  

 

I also rather like Daily Hate, because that is essentially what the paper does, has always done; it finds a succession of punch-downable victims to blame and hate on in order to sell papers to the those with a discontented sense of unfulfilled entitlement and to deflect readers' blame and hate from the elites who are actually the cause of our suffering.

[Compound2632]

11 hours ago, drmditch said:

As Mr Edwardian said above, thank heavens for Radio3 which has been my basic listening since 2016. I wonder how long it will last under the regime of Ms Dorries and those like her?

 

That was me. He listens to Radio 4.

[Compound2632]

12 hours ago, Caley Jim said:

To vote for the 'Not-tory' party most likely to win here would mean voting for the S** and no amount of nose-holding would allow me to do that!

 

I have told this tale before but that's never stopped me: my uncle and aunt who live in Glasgow for many years never voted, as their votes would cancel each other out. When the SNP came on the scene, they both started voting - and not SNP! 

 

I was in the fortunate position at our last local council election that although the candidate I voted for came third, the candidate I believe my wife voted for won, defeating the incumbent Tory by a decent margin. So I had voted according to conscience, the public good, and my personal well-being.

Edited August 27, 2022 by Compound2632

[wagonman]

15 hours ago, Edwardian said:

 

I think for me it's more a concern about rule by the Commissars; having seen how his fan-base behaved within the party, they may as well have been Bolsheviks. And the Magical Thinking was a species of populism.

 

 

If you're looking for Commissars in the Labour Party you need look no further than Starmer and his Gauleiters Akehurst and Evans et al. They are trying to purge the party of every last trace of socialist thought. The latest victim seems to be Sam Tarry whose crime was to stand on a picket line with RMT members. Given that the Labour Party was founded with the express intention of securing parliamentary representation for the Trade Union movement, and is explicitly a Democrat Socialist organisation – it says so on the membership card – it's the present leadership that are out of step.

 

 

[wagonman]

12 hours ago, Schooner said:

I'm about to say something incredibly stupid...

 

...but...

 

...what happened to voting for the candidate we think best able to represent us in Parliament?

 

It got screwed by First Past The Post, as did the rest of the so-called democratic process.

 

 

[Edwardian]

Just now, wagonman said:

 

If you're looking for Commissars in the Labour Party you need look no further than Starmer and his Gauleiters Akehurst and Evans et al. They are trying to purge the party of every last trace of socialist thought. The latest victim seems to be Sam Tarry whose crime was to stand on a picket line with RMT members. Given that the Labour Party was founded with the express intention of securing parliamentary representation for the Trade Union movement, and is explicitly a Democrat Socialist organisation – it says so on the membership card – it's the present leadership that are out of step.

 

 

 

Which is why the Labour Party can never be a truly national progressive party; it's the political wing of the Trades Union movement. Only by trying to deny that or weaken that by turns have leaders on its right come close to making it electable.

 

And for balance, as David Dimbleby pointed out this morning in reference to Maitliss's reference to Robbie Gibb, Muriel Grey, an avowed Labour supporter, is also on the BBC Board.  

 

 

[wagonman]

12 hours ago, drmditch said:

 

Is anyone aware of a suitable alternative title for the 'Mail'?

 

 

Another name for the Mail is/was "The Forgers' Gazette" – harking back to Zinoviev and Red Robbo among others, though they left the Hitler Diaries to the Sunday Times.

 

[wagonman]

10 minutes ago, Edwardian said:

 

Which is why the Labour Party can never be a truly national progressive party; it's the political wing of the Trades Union movement. Only by trying to deny that or weaken that by turns have leaders on its right come close to making it electable.

 

Clearly it no longer is the political wing of the TU movement – that ended with the abolition of the Block Vote, and the disaffiliation of most of the unions.

 

I do worry about the concept of 'electable'. It usually means 'acceptable to the Establishment and unlikely to rock the boat' – Tory Party B Team.

 

That unimpeachably Conservative commentator Peter Oborne has frequently defended Corbyn as a decent man vilely traduced by ... just about everybody. His 'electability' was demonstrated in 2017.

 

10 minutes ago, Edwardian said:

And for balance, as David Dimbleby pointed out this morning in reference to Maitliss's reference to Robbie Gibb, Muriel Grey, an avowed Labour supporter, is also on the BBC Board.  

 

 

 

The appointment of James Purnell, an exLabour MP, to the BBC Board was recently blocked by the non-execs fearful of the reaction of Johnson's so-called government. Grey has been there since before the present regime so is not strictly relevant.

 

[Edwardian]

18 minutes ago, wagonman said:

 

Clearly it no longer is the political wing of the TU movement

 

 

Not sure Len McCluskey got that memo

[Edwardian]

20 minutes ago, wagonman said:

 

Grey has been there since before the present regime

 

 

So, a time when there was Labour influence and not Conservative. Not sure how that makes things better from the impartiality standpoint.

 

20 minutes ago, wagonman said:

so is not strictly relevant.

 

 

I'm sure she'd be delighted to learn that.

 

[wagonman]

1 hour ago, Edwardian said:

 

Not sure Len McCluskey got that memo

 

Len who? Sharon Graham is Gen Sec of Unite.

[wagonman]

1 hour ago, Edwardian said:

 

So, a time when there was Labour influence and not Conservative. Not sure how that makes things better from the impartiality standpoint.

 

 

I'm sure she'd be delighted to learn that.

 

My error. Ms Grey is actually a recent appointment – to represent Scotland (I was under the impression she had been appointed during the Cameron regime...)

[Edwardian]

6 minutes ago, wagonman said:

 

Len who? Sharon Graham is Gen Sec of Unite.

 

I'm sure you remember Labour's last King-Maker. As one of the more blatant wielders of Trades Union power in the Labour Movement, he may still serve as a warning.

 

 

[alastairq]

Oh how the effluent classes hate the Trades Unions..and by extension, anyone who admits openly to being a member of a Trade Union?

How dare the proles that run our railways, or whatever, interfere with the wishes of those who can afford to purchase tickets?

 

As I recall, having been a Trades Union member for all my working life, on many occasions I have had the opportunity to express my views [and vote] on the political affiliation of the Union of choice at the time.

I would rather have a political party that has trades union support, than a political party that has the support of 'big business',  or, for that matter, the ''establishment.''

 

[Edwardian]

1 hour ago, alastairq said:

Oh how the effluent classes hate the Trades Unions..and by extension, anyone who admits openly to being a member of a Trade Union?

How dare the proles that run our railways, or whatever, interfere with the wishes of those who can afford to purchase tickets?

 

As I recall, having been a Trades Union member for all my working life, on many occasions I have had the opportunity to express my views [and vote] on the political affiliation of the Union of choice at the time.

I would rather have a political party that has trades union support, than a political party that has the support of 'big business',  or, for that matter, the ''establishment.''

 

 

I remain of the view that neither are ideal; leading to a futile tug of war that has done nothing but harm to this country.

 

It is precisely their respective links that make the two main parties part of the problem. Stating one interest group is not so bad as, or more to your taste than, the other is no answer. 

[monkeysarefun]

The Daily Mail Australia arrived here a couple of years ago fully-formed as some pervy online site that seems to be  a mish mash of celebrity gossip where stars are always "showcasing" their bits ("Kim Kardashian showcases toned abs in satin bra!" "Penelope Cruz showcases incredible figure in latex dress!") when they aren't "flaunting" them, sicko animal snuff movies ("Distressing video catches moment man boils puppy alive - warning contains disturbing images!") and puff pieces about  pranks that are always "hilarious"  and Dumb Things People Do that are always "heart-stopping" ("Watch laugh out loud moment man mistakes deadly brown snake for stick and picks it up!")

 

If details of these stories are googled it usually turns out to have happened in 2013 in Russia rather than yesterday in Wollongong as claimed so all up the Daily Mail Australia seems to  exist mainly in order  to trawl  Hollywood fansites,  youtube and Tic Toc then add its own made up  bollox  to what it finds there. 

 

Politically it doesn't seem to have a noticeable  left or right bias, any political stories seem to get a run depending on if they are scandalous, or contain "heartwarming" kiddy, koala cuddling  or grandparent  pictures.

Certain to get a run would be a story about  some politician of whatever persuasion "showcasing" their enviable curves while performing a "hilarious" stunt getting towed on a skateboard past a "heartbreaking" bunch of kittens who have been found glued to a duck. Or similar.

 

Basically it seems to be mainly aimed at the "young ones" to rack up the clicks.

Edited August 28, 2022 by monkeysarefun

[burgundy]

1 hour ago, monkeysarefun said:

The Daily Mail Australia arrived here a couple of years ago fully-formed as some pervy online site

So if it is only available on line, it is not even any use when you run out of toilet paper?

Best wishes 

Eric

Edited August 27, 2022 by burgundy
coherence

[monkeysarefun]

14 minutes ago, burgundy said:

So if it is only available on line, it is not even any use when you run out of toilet paper?

 

Yeah its a pain in the bum having to print it out when I need some. And it costs a fortune.

Edited August 27, 2022 by monkeysarefun

[Nearholmer]

17 hours ago, Edwardian said:

I remain of the view that neither are ideal; leading to a futile tug of war that has done nothing but harm to this country.

The tug of war is the product of gross conflicts of interest in society, and the way parties form and act is a secondary product of that, not the primary problem, so unless whichever party you consider ideal has a deliverable plan to eradicate conflict of interest, the unseemly and unbalanced contest is likely to continue.

 

My bleak assessment is that the only things that ever mask, certainly not remove, the conflicts of interest are very large, proximate external threats, invasion, pandemic, that sort of thing. The threat posed by the unsustainability of our consumption habits ought to get us all pulling in one direction, but that threat seems not to be proximate enough to do so.

 

 

 

 

[CKPR]

Seeing as how we are discussing current affairs of 2022 on a forum that has a cut off of 1922, perhaps a return of the old pre-1914 Liberal Party is something we would agree was a good thing. Well, until the inevitable split occurred... 

[burgundy]

3 hours ago, Nearholmer said:

The tug of war is the product of gross conflicts of interest in society, and the way parties form and act is a secondary product of that, not the primary problem, so unless whichever party you consider ideal has a deliverable plan to eradicate conflict of interest, the unseemly and unbalanced contest is likely to continue.

 

You may be right that the political parties reflect conflict in society, but the two party system does nothing to reduce that. Proportional representation might help to reflect the diversity of views that do not fall at the extreme ends of the spectrum. 

Best wishes 

Eric