Covid - coming out of Lockdown 3 - no politics, less opinion and more facts and information.

[alastairq]

13 minutes ago, Nearholmer said:

I just listened to a string of senior representatives and officials from the areas in question on the radio, all spitting feathers

All of whom will have their own agendas, methinks?

[Reorte]

1 minute ago, alastairq said:

 Far too many people in the Lake District....it's like Asda on a Saturday morning?

In my mind, something is wrong when paths over mountains get so worn as to garner reports concerning potholes? 

Or when Human poo is more prevalent than that of any other beast?

Sadly true that most of it is far too busy. And the path "repairs" are often as or more obnoxious than what they replace. My grandparents might've been in trouble if a fire engine ever needed to get to their house on a bank holiday, thanks to all the badly parked cars (and often the rest of the year wasn't much better). Fortunately human waste doesn't yet exceed sheep, although the level should still be zero (at least noticeable - occasionally someone will get caught short miles from a toilet, but at least find some suitably out of the way spot please).

 

Still, there are some quieter parts, although they're not the most dramatic. Bowscale Fell from Mungrisedale's always a pleasant walk and never all that busy even on an otherwise heaving weekend.

[alastairq]

1 minute ago, Reorte said:

Fortunately human waste doesn't yet exceed sheep, although the level should still be zero

 it was an issue raised by locals [in the Lakes, and elsewhere] some years ago. But somehow it stuck in  my memory.

 

I like[d] the Lakes.  Although I would now struggle to find a time of the year to visit, when there are no full carparks, or pavement parking, or hoards of motorcars and motorcycles clogging up the view, and polluting the aural environment?

[Reorte]

1 minute ago, alastairq said:

 it was an issue raised by locals [in the Lakes, and elsewhere] some years ago. But somehow it stuck in  my memory.

 

I like[d] the Lakes.  Although I would now struggle to find a time of the year to visit, when there are no full carparks, or pavement parking, or hoards of motorcars and motorcycles clogging up the view, and polluting the aural environment?

The Lakes is a place very close to and dear to my heart. As I hinted at my grandparents lived there (not from there, but moved before I was born), and since we moved around a lot when I was a child it was one of the few fixed places for me. I find the crowds and some of the developments quite depressing. I can't exactly fault the crowds for wanting to go there, since IMO it's one of the most wonderful places in the world, but it certainly has its downside. Tourism can become very drug-like for some places.

 

Best time to go for a walk there is to start late afternoon in the middle of summer. Most of the crowds will be finishing as you get started, and with light until 10 o'clock that gives plenty of time with hardly anyone even on the unusually busy spots. Early morning may be the same but I'm less inclined to try that

[Nearholmer]

Should have listened to that Wordsworth bloke: he said that the coming of the railways would ruin the place.

 

Add cheap cars and cheap air flights, and that’s pretty much the story of how tourism bnggers-up almost everywhere anyone wants to tour to.

 

Put the windbreak up and pass that old oxo tin with the fish-paste sandwiches in it, will you dear?

[alastairq]

1 minute ago, Nearholmer said:

fish-paste sandwiches

 Ughh! Fish paste!!

 Much prefer marmite!

 

Could never understand a local fascination with brawn, either?

[Reorte]

Tourism is a tricky one, it's a fine line between it providing a very nice boost to the local economy and completely taking over and dominating a place.

[Oldddudders]

10 minutes ago, Reorte said:

Tourism is a tricky one, it's a fine line between it providing a very nice boost to the local economy and completely taking over and dominating a place.

Port Isaac, aka Port Wenn, comes to mind. My parents went there if dad was on leave in the war. Remote and quiet. But since Doc Martin.....

[AY Mod]

1 hour ago, Ben B said:

it doesn't help the hotel in Scarborough, the arcade in Margate, the chippy in Bridport, or the shop selling buckets and spades and lilos in Pwhelli.  Our usual holiday destination is North and West Wales, quite a lot of last Spring Porthmadog was considerably hotter than most of Southern Europe! 

 

I'm as much of a Europhile as anyone I know (culture and food rather than sun and Sangria) but I very much feel it's a year to get the tourist trade at home back on its feet (bang goes a quiet West Country holiday in the early autumn). However, I've just spoken to a friend this morning with several holiday lets and he said "our visitors so far this year don't know how to behave, they think they're on holiday on the Costa del Sol" so I shall be careful what I wish upon the domestic holiday trade!

[Oldddudders]

1 hour ago, alastairq said:

All of whom will have their own agendas, methinks?

I infer you mean the fact that the areas concerned have Labour MPs and/or councils? So perhaps this BBC quote is relevant :

 

'Blackburn's director of public health Prof Dominic Harrison says the affected areas "were not consulted with, warned of, notified about, or alerted to this guidance".' I do not see political gain as an obvious part of his ambition, do you? 

[RedgateModels]

19 minutes ago, AY Mod said:

 

I'm as much of a Europhile as anyone I know (culture and food rather than sun and Sangria) but I very much feel it's a year to get the tourist trade at home back on its feet (bang goes a quiet West Country holiday in the early autumn). However, I've just spoken to a friend this morning with several holiday lets and he said "our visitors so far this year don't know how to behave, they think they're on holiday on the Costa del Sol" so I shall be careful what I wish upon the domestic holiday trade!

 

I'm the opposite, would always choose the UK over Europe on hols (don't even have a passport) but I also think that it's not fair Spain et al having to put up with the "Costa Brigade" either LOL They might be glad of the break from it, apart from the Pounds Sterling

 

Me, I'm off the Cornwall for a fortnight in July, so I'll be a Grockle down there for a bit. Hope it's not too busy, but will avoid St Ives and Newquay, used to be lovely, but far too popular/busy now

 

[alastairq]

19 minutes ago, Oldddudders said:

I infer you mean the fact that the areas concerned have Labour MPs and/or councils? So perhaps this BBC quote is relevant :

 

'Blackburn's director of public health Prof Dominic Harrison says the affected areas "were not consulted with, warned of, notified about, or alerted to this guidance".' I do not see political gain as an obvious part of his ambition, do you? 

 I wasn't thinking of purely 'political' agendas....but now you mention it?

 

However, laying 'blame' or 'criticism' on central government is all part of the inventory of any local authority figure.  

 

Since it is only advice [which probably was well meant?], and certainly advice I , for one, would be heeding.....where is the need for consultation?

 

I think it's all symptomatic of society's new way of thinking?

IE, 'wait till we're told', rather than 'seeking information?'

Edited May 25, 2021 by alastairq

[Oldddudders]

6 minutes ago, RedgateModels said:

Me, I'm off the Cornwall for a fortnight in July, so I'll be a Grockle down there for a bit.

Er no. Not a Grockle - that's in Devon - but an Emmet, which is Cornish for ant, of which they see an army creeping across the Tamar..... 

[Reorte]

8 minutes ago, alastairq said:

I think it's all symptomatic of society's new way of thinking?

IE, 'wait till we're told', rather than 'seeking information?'

Maybe I'm too cynical but I do wonder if "confusing" arises from it being advice - "you're not telling me absolutely whether I should or shouldn't!"

[RedgateModels]

2 minutes ago, Oldddudders said:

Er no. Not a Grockle - that's in Devon - but an Emmet, which is Cornish for ant, of which they see an army creeping across the Tamar..... 

 

I stand corrected  Will be at full speed at 70mph officer over the Tamar on the A30 though ......

 

[hayfield]

3 hours ago, Ben B said:

 

 As a foster parent, I've actually had rows with Social Services before because it's been implied we've somehow been neglecting the kids by not taking them on foreign holidays every year, and only going camping in Northumberland or stopping in a caravan in Snowdonia. 

 

You must be joking, the fact that you take them on an adventure teaching them how to look after and amuse themselves surely must be commended. You sometimes wonder how some people got their jobs?  Or are they willing to squander tax payers money on foreign jollies ?

[hayfield]

3 hours ago, Reorte said:

"Confusing" was mentioned quite a lot on the radio this morning, not that I could see anything confusing about it.

 

3 hours ago, burgundy said:

“But look, you found the notice, didn’t you?”
“Yes,” said Arthur, “yes I did. It was on display in the bottom of a locked filing cabinet stuck in a disused lavatory with a sign on the door saying ‘Beware of the Leopard.”

From the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, with apologies to Douglas Adams.  

Best wishes 

Eric 

 

3 hours ago, alastairq said:

All of whom will have their own agendas, methinks?

 

1 hour ago, Oldddudders said:

I infer you mean the fact that the areas concerned have Labour MPs and/or councils? So perhaps this BBC quote is relevant :

 

'Blackburn's director of public health Prof Dominic Harrison says the affected areas "were not consulted with, warned of, notified about, or alerted to this guidance".' I do not see political gain as an obvious part of his ambition, do you? 

 

1 hour ago, alastairq said:

 I wasn't thinking of purely 'political' agendas....but now you mention it?

 

However, laying 'blame' or 'criticism' on central government is all part of the inventory of any local authority figure.  

 

Since it is only advice [which probably was well meant?], and certainly advice I , for one, would be heeding.....where is the need for consultation?

 

I think it's all symptomatic of society's new way of thinking?

IE, 'wait till we're told', rather than 'seeking information?'

 

A communication was issued, however it needs reading and perhaps on a Friday these officials have other things on their minds. the old saying comes to mind You can take a horse to water but you cannot make it drink. !!!

 

Sadly we are in an age where we all expect to be contacted rather than check ourselves if anything has altered, but it seems they all have belatedly found the guidance advice where it should be on a government website. Perhaps keeping up to date with this site should be a higher priority ?

 

"The directors of public health of the eight areas where additional caution was advised on a government website have issued a joint statement.

They say: "Following the national coverage of recently revised guidance we have met with national officials and confirmed there are no restrictions on travel in or out of each of our areas: there are no local lockdowns."

 

Now after this reassurance will I be rushing to any of these areas, or will I take the sensible approach and stay away and not adding to the problem. What has happened to common sense ?

[Nearholmer]

1 hour ago, alastairq said:

Since it is only advice [which probably was well meant?], and certainly advice I , for one, would be heeding.....where is the need for consultation?

 

The key question about this advice is: did those who issued it intend for anyone to whom it applied to actually take any notice of it?

 

'Cos, if they did, there seem to be a few basics that they missed-out:

 

- consulting with local authorities, not necessarily about whether to issue it, but how best to promulgate it to those they intended to abide by it;

 

- publishing it in a way that would actually be noticed;

 

- announcing it in a way that would get some attention;

 

- explaining very clearly why it was being issued, which is fundamental to getting anyone to take any notice of any advice.

 

Many's the time that my work has included issuing "advisories", and I learned way back that failure to do the above was a certain route to nobody even noticing, let alone taking any notice, of advice.

 

The way it was sort-of drizzled out was either a c@ck-up, or a conspiracy - life has taught me that the former is far, far more common than the latter.

[Nearholmer]

1 minute ago, hayfield said:

You can take a horse to water but you cannot make it drink. !!!

 

 

It would seem that they didn't even mention the water to the horse, they hoped it might stumble upon it.

[alastairq]

9 minutes ago, hayfield said:

You can take a horse to water but you cannot make it drink. !!!

 Nipping round behind clutching two half bricks has been known to help...

[alastairq]

10 minutes ago, Nearholmer said:

The key question about this advice is: did those who issued it intend for anyone to whom it applied to actually take any notice of it?

 I am starting to get the impression that this is a bit of a bun fight between local authorities, and central government?

 

Local authorities should be issuing this sort of advice, but  [it appears] don't want to be seen as trying to destroy their local economies, or trying to dictating local people's lifestyles,  or doing anything that might adversely affect the local population's day to day survival [that should read, local voters,. perhaps?]

 

Central Government may be trying to get local authorities to take a more proactive role regarding localised infections.....[Which, in sensitive areas like Bolton, for example, the LA may feel reluctant to do? Given who constitutes  that face of that local authority? IE local councillors?}

 

Central Govt seems to be the stalking horse in all this...conveniently hundreds of miles, and a social world, away from places like Bolton,  or Kirklees,  etc...

 

 

[hayfield]

4 minutes ago, alastairq said:

 I am starting to get the impression that this is a bit of a bun fight between local authorities, and central government?

 

Local authorities should be issuing this sort of advice, but  [it appears] don't want to be seen as trying to destroy their local economies, or trying to dictating local people's lifestyles,  or doing anything that might adversely affect the local population's day to day survival [that should read, local voters,. perhaps?]

 

Central Government may be trying to get local authorities to take a more proactive role regarding localised infections.....[Which, in sensitive areas like Bolton, for example, the LA may feel reluctant to do? Given who constitutes  that face of that local authority? IE local councillors?}

 

Central Govt seems to be the stalking horse in all this...conveniently hundreds of miles, and a social world, away from places like Bolton,  or Kirklees,  etc...

 

 

 

Just reported on the BBC  

 

Royal Bolton Hospital said it had experienced "one of the busiest days ever" and urged people to attend A&E only "if absolutely necessary".

 

Thankfully later is said that "high proportion of cases is not translating into significant increases in hospitalisation, and, more importantly, it is not leading to more people in ICU."

 

Lets hope the message has got home and the infections start subsiding

[boxbrownie]

3 hours ago, burgundy said:

“But look, you found the notice, didn’t you?”
“Yes,” said Arthur, “yes I did. It was on display in the bottom of a locked filing cabinet stuck in a disused lavatory with a sign on the door saying ‘Beware of the Leopard.”

From the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, with apologies to Douglas Adams.  

Best wishes 

Eric 

But he must have found it before the Leopard got him 

[boxbrownie]

3 hours ago, Oldddudders said:

Port Isaac, aka Port Wenn, comes to mind. My parents went there if dad was on leave in the war. Remote and quiet. But since Doc Martin.....

The best and easiest time to see Port Issac was on a Sunday evening on ITV 

 

Too right, it is a nightmare, we dread when we have friends/relatives who force themselves upon us and ask “ohh can we go to Port Wenn”.........”of course, here are your bags” 

Edited May 25, 2021 by boxbrownie

[boxbrownie]

2 hours ago, AY Mod said:

 

I'm as much of a Europhile as anyone I know (culture and food rather than sun and Sangria) but I very much feel it's a year to get the tourist trade at home back on its feet (bang goes a quiet West Country holiday in the early autumn). However, I've just spoken to a friend this morning with several holiday lets and he said "our visitors so far this year don't know how to behave, they think they're on holiday on the Costa del Sol" so I shall be careful what I wish upon the domestic holiday trade!

I’ll second that......we have to make our runs to the Pharmacy or Post Office before 09:30 now.....while the “visitors” are still recovering from the night before s indulgence, it’s been the past month that has been the busiest we have seen for years.

 

Mind you at least the weathers been absolute 5h1te for them