Licences.

[Neil]

The 'Titgate' controversy set me wondering just when we went from this:

 

 

... to this ....

 

 

 

 

 

[MarkSG]

Well, only someone who works for one of the companies concerned will be able to answer that authoritatively, and the people who know are almost certainly not telling. But my understanding of it is that railway companies are, still, generally positive about having their trains reproduced in model form and don't consider it to be an opportunity to charge a hefty fee. But media companies, such as StudioCanal, have a different perspective and consider model manufacturers to be just another potential licensee who will need to pay the going rate. And I don't think that either of those has ever really changed, it's just a reflection of the different nature of the organisations involved.

[sir douglas]

titgate?

 

EDIT-- it took me 20 minutes to realise what it is, its the Titfield/Rapido/Hornby thing,

Edited February 13, 2022 by sir douglas

[Nearholmer]

There was an early case of “logo proprietorality” in the 1920s, when Hornby put Colman’s Mustard livery on closed wagons, and Colman got the hump, leading to Hornby ceasing to market the wagons.

 

I think they either reproduced the Royal Warrant crest without permission, or simply failed to ask Colman nicely, and it was odd because Bassett-Lowke had reproduced the livery without any problem ten years before.

 

Upshot: the Hornby Colman wagons are now rare, highly sought after, expensive, and occasionally faked. There are a couple on eBay currently that look too good to be true.

 

This one from a famed collection might be kosher, although I wonder whether the base and roof might have been re-finished.

 

 

 

Edited February 13, 2022 by Nearholmer

[F-UnitMad]

2 hours ago, sir douglas said:

titgate?

 

EDIT-- it took me 20 minutes to realise what it is, its the Titfield/Rapido/Hornby thing,

Thanks, saved me a load of headscratching, too!!

[Andy Hayter]

It is important to recognise the differences in IP and sometimes Trade marks between different types of companies.

 

If I am a train operator and helbydapmann produce a model with my logo on it, then if I don't pursue this the impacts are likely to be very small.  Others may likewise copy my logo or livery but so what? It may even be considered as free advertising.

 

If I am an owner of entertainment materials however and someone without authorisation produces  a reproduction in miniature of one of my protected items without permission, if I don't react it opens the doorway to others to do the same with other protected items and my lack of action opens the doors to they having a degree of protection in law.

 

So say I have the rights  to the film "Granny wets her knickers".  It was last shown under permission on Dave (other channels are available) in 2017 at 3 am.   Someone now produces without authority a bill board in 00 reproducing the original advertising for Granny wets her knickers.  I could of course view this as a benefit to advertise this long lost masterpiece.  However if I also own the rights to say Henry Potter or Astro Wars, then failing to take action leaves the door open to companies producing goods with these logos, characters, or other immediately identifiable items linked to these products.  My lack of action against "granny" will weaken my case in pursuing a case in defence of Potter or Wars. 

 

Every company will take its own benefit/dis-benefit view.  Some have little to lose but others have potentially much to lose.

 

I have posted elsewhere the case of Accor against Jouef for the production of Wagons Lits cars in H0 scale, since Accor was the owner the rights to the CIWL name and logo.  Accor won even though they were selling customers on the Venice Simplon Orient Express with keep sake models that looked to be the Jouef models

[Wheatley]

It generally started at privatisation, when corporate branding, marketing and other similar owning group functions got in on the act. Most had an overriding policy at group level to protect their brand regardless of what individual MDs and TOC marketing managers thought but went about in different ways. Some permit no reproduction at all, some charge a commercial fee and others a nominal fee. 

 

Since then it has spread to government owned departments, the "ROYAL AIR FORCE" logo is trademarked for example, but the roundel itself cannot be (they tried and lost) because it has been in use as a fashion statement for too long.