Formula 1 2023

[Pete the Elaner]

16 minutes ago, john new said:

I’ve never seen the point of time penalties alone - should be done as (1) a set number of places or something (2) like x seconds or x places which ever is the greater loss. Reason so that the penalty actually has an outcome for the driver’s finishing place. If they are in last finishing place anyway, or don’t finish, then carried forward to the next race.

 

The aim is to serve them during a pit stop because when this happens, we get to see them racing for position. They do not work so well when the finishing positions are adjusted after the race.

[PhilJ W]

Why not simply dock drivers points as punishment for bad or aggressive driving. And teams can lose points for breaking construction rules. To administer it fairly an independent panel of judges could be appointed. Points lost would be on a set scale according to the severity of the offence.

[Hroth]

2 minutes ago, PhilJ W said:

Why not simply dock drivers points as punishment for bad or aggressive driving. And teams can lose points for breaking construction rules. To administer it fairly an independent panel of judges could be appointed. Points lost would be on a set scale according to the severity of the offence.

 

Too simple, and there'd be a fair bit of pouting from a certain team...

 

[OnTheBranchline]

[Gareth Collier]

Normal service has been resumed. I fear last week's race was a welcome one off.

Great to see the McLaren's back at the top of division 2 though.
 

[OnTheBranchline]

2 hours ago, Gareth Collier said:

Normal service has been resumed. I fear last week's race was a welcome one off.

Great to see the McLaren's back at the top of division 2 though.
 

Max gonna be halfway to Qatar before P2 crosses the finish line tomorrow.

[Pete the Elaner]

2 hours ago, Gareth Collier said:

Normal service has been resumed. I fear last week's race was a welcome one off.
 

 

It was what I expected to be honest.

There has been a lot of talk about the floor of the Red Bull this season. This is where the 'ground effects' downforce is generated. Ground effects are an efficient way to create downforce; efficient because it creates less drag than 'traditional' downforce from wings.

By relying more heavily on ground effects, less drag at higher speeds allows them to go much faster.

Singapore has no high speed curves, which reduced the advantage of downforce created by ground effects. Even Monaco has the tunnel, where you still need downforce but the reduction of drag is a huge advantage. Suzuka has more high speed curved sections, which suit ground effects quite nicely.

[Obi-Jiff Kenobi]

Did anyone see the announcement that the stewards admitted they got it wrong in Singapore, and Verstappen should have been given a grid penalty for impeding in qually, not a reprimand? Tell us something we didn’t know...

[Hroth]

10 minutes ago, Obi-Jiff Kenobi said:

Did anyone see the announcement that the stewards admitted they got it wrong in Singapore, and Verstappen should have been given a grid penalty for impeding in qually, not a reprimand? Tell us something we didn’t know...

 

Doesn't surprise me one little bit.

 

[ejstubbs]

Quite an interesting piece with Lando Norris in The Observer: McLaren driver vents his frustration at F1 regulations which mean managing tyres takes precedence over aggressive racing

 

Quote

"You are not driving at 100% because one slide and you’re done. You are just managing your tyres and your temperatures. It is frustrating, it feels like you are going so slowly. You just want to be able to race closer but as soon as you push, you light up the rears once and it’s game over."

 

“The cars used to be 200kg lighter and that is a lot,” Norris says, with emphasis. “They should make the cars lighter, simple as that. You make them quicker by being lighter, then you can remove some of the aero stuff, which makes all the dirty air, and then you would be able to follow better.”

 

Some interesting detail figures about the growth in size and weight of F1 cars, too:
 

Quote

At tracks such as Monaco, they are simply too big to compete properly on a track where they lumber round the tight corners of a circuit that belongs to a different time.  In 1989 the Ferrari 640 weighed 510kg. At the end of the V8 era in 2013 the cars weighed 640kg. This year the minimum weight is 798kg. They are behemoths in comparison to their predecessors. The 640 was 4.40m long, this season’s crop of cars is more than a metre longer at 5.63m.

 

Edited September 23, 2023 by ejstubbs

[Hroth]

Back to the RB dominated snoozefest, eh?

 

[didcot]

"Dick of the day" is awarded to joint recipients Perez and Sargent for driving like they are in the dodgem cars!

[john new]

Interesting tactic by RB to work off the Perez penalty. Allowed in the rules so can’t blame them. Perhaps a rule tweak is needed for next season, any car restarting after a penalty is applied/to work off a penalty has to do a set number of laps after that for it to count as done. Similar one where they did the mandatory stop/change in the pits on the very last lap, was that for tyres?

[OnTheBranchline]

27 minutes ago, john new said:

Interesting tactic by RB to work off the Perez penalty. Allowed in the rules so can’t blame them. Perhaps a rule tweak is needed for next season, any car restarting after a penalty is applied/to work off a penalty has to do a set number of laps after that for it to count as done. Similar one where they did the mandatory stop/change in the pits on the very last lap, was that for tyres?

Nothing beats the 1998 British race where Michael Schumacher took a stop go penalty after the race had ended.

[Pete the Elaner]

56 minutes ago, OnTheBranchline said:

Nothing beats the 1998 British race where Michael Schumacher took a stop go penalty after the race had ended.

 

That was a complete farce, but one of many in F1.

[Pete the Elaner]

57 minutes ago, OnTheBranchline said:

Nothing beats the 1998 British race where Michael Schumacher took a stop go penalty after the race had ended.

 

There are a lot of things which need tweaking & I don't believe ever had:

Causing a yellow or red flag in qualy after setting a good lap is still a possibility.

Taking a new engine when you have a grid penalty, knowing you can't be pushed back any further.

Each such incident where the rules have not worked properly needs to be marked for review at the end of the season.

Safety car re-start in cold conditions (this was a problem at the Nurburgring in 2020 & every driver was complaining. The FIA's answer was to hope it doesn't happen again).

The question should be asked "what negative effect would a change cause, so would a change be better?".

[OnTheBranchline]

4 hours ago, Hroth said:

Back to the RB dominated snoozefest, eh?

 

Yes but happy for Piastri!

 

Mercedes need to start favouring one driver more because sometimes the indecision costs them - today Hamilton was faster.

Edited September 24, 2023 by OnTheBranchline

[Hobby]

And finished highest. To be fair to him he's also been the most consistent all season, he's not even that far behind Perez whilst he should be much further behind, consistency being his middle name?! ;).

[Hroth]

I actually watched the race highlights on C4 this afternoon.

 

Provided you ignored Mr Bean smugly touring around in front*, it was an interesting race, full of drama, overtaking and incident.  Are we seeing the advent of the most ignored F1 champion ever?

 

* Even from the start, it was elbows out and a drag race away from the rest of the field.  No driver skill required, just an uncannily efficient car.  Perhaps its the Dorian Grey effect, and Perez has the DG car....

 

[EddieB]

5 hours ago, Hroth said:

Back to the RB dominated snoozefest, eh?

 

Too true.  Did anything much happen between laps 31 and 48?  I fell asleep...

[Obi-Jiff Kenobi]

5 hours ago, didcot said:

"Dick of the day" is awarded to joint recipients Perez and Sargent for driving like they are in the dodgem cars!

Sargeant has intimated that the coming together with Bottas was Bottas’s fault because he failed to avoid Sargeant’s mistake! 🤪

[Pete the Elaner]

6 hours ago, Hobby said:

And finished highest. To be fair to him he's also been the most consistent all season, he's not even that far behind Perez whilst he should be much further behind, consistency being his middle name?! ;).

 

It would be nice to see him snatch 2nd place. It would serve RB right for not supporting their 2nd driver enough. Without a win or 2nd, it is a big task though.

[OnTheBranchline]

On 24/09/2023 at 09:14, Hobby said:

And finished highest. To be fair to him he's also been the most consistent all season, he's not even that far behind Perez whilst he should be much further behind, consistency being his middle name?! ;).

 

I don't think George would see it like that 😉

 

I think it's clear that Mercedes are missing James Vowles.

[Hobby]

George still needs to mature a bit, Lewis has always been consistent, no doubt George will get there in the end.

[OnTheBranchline]

Perez on his mental struggles lately.

 

After reading this, I think he should just retire and end his career driving the most competitive car he will ever drive in his career.

Edited September 26, 2023 by OnTheBranchline