Q1 Locos.

[Paul_C]

Would Q1 locos have graced the Sheerness branch line or Sittingbourne area at any time? A few years ago somebody did tell me that they were used for a short period to run freight onto the Island as the old bridge could not accommodate class 33s due to their weight. When the new KF bridge opened in 1960 this solved the problem allowing for 33s to be brought into play apparently.

 

Paul.

[Wickham Green too]

The Southern Q1 - as opposed to any other* - would have been used on virtually all lines in the area ..... though they were specifically banned between Queenborough and Leysdown in the July 1949 Restrictions.

 

* Many years earlier, I've no doubt the the SECR Q1s would have been visitors to the area - though the ex LCDR 0-4-4Ts would have been far more common.

[bécasse]

In steam days, a C would have almost certainly been the preferred choice for goods work, not least because there were more of them than there were Q1s and because they performed well on passenger trains (if and when the need arose - although Q1s could work passenger trains as well). Q1s would have been seen though, more probably at Sittingbourne or as far as Bowaters than on the rest of the branch), and they tended to be the favourite loco for engineers' trains because a good driver could "stop them on a sixpence".

[Wickham Green too]

Don't forget there were busy docks at Sheerness and other industries at Queenborough that might have generated sufficient traffic to justify something larger than a C ....... steam had gone from the area before Sheerness Steel arrived on the scene, though.

[Compound2632]

3 hours ago, Wickham Green too said:

The Southern Q1 - as opposed to any other* - would have been used on virtually all lines in the area ..... though they were specifically banned between Queenborough and Leysdown in the July 1949 Restrictions.

 

* Many years earlier, I've no doubt the the SECR Q1s would have been visitors to the area - though the ex LCDR 0-4-4Ts would have been far more common.

 

Ah, you are far too kind and understanding: I'd have taken the question as being about the Stirling / Wainwright Q1, obviously. 

[Tom Burnham]

According to D L Bradley's 'Locomotives of the Southern Railway Part 1' 33026, 33027 and 33028 were transferred to Gillingham in 1950 where they were used among other duties on both goods and passenger services to Sheppy. After electrification in June 1959, Gillingham retained some Q1s specifically for goods and parcel trains to Queenborough and Sheerness until the new Kings ferry bridge opened in 1960 and main line diesels were able to reach Sheppey.

Edited March 6, 2023 by Tom Burnham
Date added.

[Tom Burnham]

16 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Ah, you are far too kind and understanding: I'd have taken the question as being about the Stirling / Wainwright Q1, obviously. 

Don't think I've ever seen a photo of an SER Q1 on Sheppey. R1 044Ts were common until they were superseded by Hs.

[Compound2632]

43 minutes ago, Tom Burnham said:

Don't think I've ever seen a photo of an SER Q1 on Sheppey. R1 044Ts were common until they were superseded by Hs.

 

It was, after all, LC&DR territory.

[Tom Burnham]

There were several examples in the 1950s of Q class 060s being used for excursion trains to Sheerness-on-Sea, by the way.

[Tom Burnham]

5 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

It was, after all, LC&DR territory.

Indeed it was. Although I have the impression that the R/R1, Q/Q1 and H 044Ts were used mainly on London suburban services until they were displaced by electrification from 1925 onwards.  After that I think R1s were preferred for country branch lines (a number received push-pull gear) like Westerham (even though it had been SER) and Hs for main line stoppers. Hs took over from R1s on branch lines in the 1940s and very early 1950s.

[Wickham Green too]

1 hour ago, Compound2632 said:

Ah, you are far too kind and understanding: I'd have taken the question as being about the Stirling / Wainwright Q1, obviously. 

I was concerned about the obvious confusion - for anybody in LNER territory - with the Robinson / Thompson 0-8-0T rebuilds ! 🙄

 

[RFS]

1 hour ago, Tom Burnham said:

According to D L Bradley's 'Locomotives of the Southern Railway Part 1' 33026, 33027 and 33028 were transferred to Gillingham in 1950 where they were used among other duties on both goods and passenger services to Sheppy. After electrification in June 1959, Gillingham retained some Q1s specifically for goods and parcel trains to Queenborough and Sheerness until the new Kings ferry bridge opened in 1960 and main line diesels were able to reach Sheppey.

 

BR Database does indeed show 33026/7/8 being allocated to Gillingham in 1950, but in September 1951 they were all transferred back to Tonbridge. 

[The Lurker]

The SER Q/Q1s proved less adequate than the R/R1 and the H Class, even the Q1s with the same boiler as the H Class, and so with the surplus of suburban tanks, they were scrapped, the last going in 1930 (per SREMG).

 

https://sremg.org.uk/steam/q1(secr)class.shtml

 

The R/R1s were certainly used on the Hawkhurst branch but not as direct replacements for the Q/Q1 which I believe were used on it - there seems to have been various ex-Brighton types used (perhaps displaced by some of the H Class). The H class were used on it from the mid 50s until the end...

[eastglosmog]

1 hour ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Ah, you are far too kind and understanding: I'd have taken the question as being about the Stirling / Wainwright Q1, obviously. 

But not the Worsdell Q1's of the NER?  (Later known as D18's by the LNER)

[Compound2632]

33 minutes ago, eastglosmog said:

But not the Worsdell Q1's of the NER?  (Later known as D18's by the LNER)

 

Fair point. Are there more Q1s out there than E1s?

 

                          E1                                    Q1

NER       W. Worsdell 0-6-0T      W. Worsdell 4-4-0

LNER     ex-GN Ivatt 2-4-0*       ex-GN Ivatt 0-8-0

                                                      Thompson 0-8-0T

SECR      rebuilt E 4-4-0              rebuilt Stirling 0-4-4T

LBSCR    Stroudley 0-6-0T**

SR                                                 Bulleid 0-6-0

 

Looks like the Q1s have it!

 

Although all four E1 classes existed simultaneously but at most three of the Q1 classes.

 

*Was GN Class E1 - would that be double-counting?

**Originally E, reclassified by Marsh.

 

Edited March 6, 2023 by Compound2632

[Compound2632]

I had missed out the MR NCC E1 0-6-0s, a pair rebuilt from BNCR Class E 0-6-0s. 

 

A tie, then, but E1s win on quantity built. 

Edited March 6, 2023 by Compound2632

[PeterStiles]

(
I really wish the title of this thread was "Bulleid Q1 Locos"...

)

[Wickham Green too]

10 minutes ago, PeterStiles said:

( I really wish the title of this thread was "Bulleid Q1 Locos"... )

I suspect there's already a thread of that title lurking somewhere in the dusty cupboards of RMweb !

[Paul_C]

😂 Wow, what a very lively debate, fantastic info coming in thank you all. I am not as knowledgeable as many of you so it's very helpful when I receive stacks of comments like this. Attached are some photos of the model I have which is the Bachmann Q1 (I think) so I take it this would be of suitable type?

 

I will be renumbering it to make it more localised. I do have a good list of numbers from three sheds so I have plenty of scope there. I might go for 33004 as that was at Faversham from March 1953 through to the same month in '59.

 

Paul.

[RFS]

38 minutes ago, Paul_C said:

😂 Wow, what a very lively debate, fantastic info coming in thank you all. I am not as knowledgeable as many of you so it's very helpful when I receive stacks of comments like this. Attached are some photos of the model I have which is the Bachmann Q1 (I think) so I take it this would be of suitable type?

 

I will be renumbering it to make it more localised. I do have a good list of numbers from three sheds so I have plenty of scope there. I might go for 33004 as that was at Faversham from March 1953 through to the same month in '59.

 

Paul.

 

33004 was at Faversham from only March 1953 till July 1953 according to BR Database. My 1955 Ian Allan ABC confirms it was at Guildford by then. 

 

I wonder if the 4 Q1s that went to Faversham for a few months in early 1953 were to assist with the major rebuilding of the lines there after the terrible 1953 floods. 

Edited March 7, 2023 by RFS

[SRman]

30 minutes ago, Paul_C said:

...snipped...

Attached are some photos of the model I have which is the Bachmann Q1 (I think) so I take it this would be of suitable type?

...snipped ...

 

Paul.

 

Hornby! 

Sorry if that's being pedantic, but Bachmann have never made a Bulleid Q1. 

Moving on, the Hornby model is a good one. I have two of them, with both originally having the same number. Renumbering is easy, as any shiny bits on the base black can easily be disguised with some weathering.

 

[Fat Controller]

It's Hornby, rather than Bachmann, I believe. Nicely weathered. My old boss used to fire these around the Weald in the mid-1960s; he used to say they could haul more than they could stop.

[Paul_C]

Sorry, when I listed it as Bachmann I was guessing as it was a good few years ago when I bought this and the box is long stored away. So this is a Bullied loco, that confirms a previous comment from somebody else. As I've said this was bought a good few years ago and you've probably spotted my obvious lack of observation 😂😂😂. I've got so much stock I sometimes forget what's been done and what hasn't as everything was packed away in 2020 when I had builders in to do my loft.

 

I forgot that this had already been weathered and renumbered and didn't spot it before I'd uploaded and attached the photos. The work was done by Steve Johnson at Grimy Times. Just sound to add now so it's time to search out the best sound files.

 

Paul.

[bécasse]

8 hours ago, RFS said:

 

33004 was at Faversham from only March 1953 till July 1953 according to BR Database. My 1955 Ian Allan ABC confirms it was at Guildford by then. 

 

I wonder if the 4 Q1s that went to Faversham for a few months in early 1953 were to assist with the major rebuilding of the lines there after the terrible 1953 floods. 

 

[bécasse]

Pairs of Q1s were used to double-head trains of chalk, dug out near Knockholt IIRC, to reinstate the washed out railway embankment across the Reculver marshes east of Herne Bay. The extent of that wash-out is well indicated by the many months that it took to reinstate the railway - and, unlike today, they didn't hang about doing it.