Minor Points: Annie's layout projects.

[Annie]

12 minutes ago, Pacific231G said:

If you want a better copy of "imitation is..." I can PM it to you.

That would be very good, - thank you.

[Annie]

Old fashioned fun.  I used to make model locomotives from galvanised sheet steel offcuts using these methods.

I really miss not being able solder anymore  😢

 

[Pacific231G]

1 hour ago, Annie said:

Thanks very much for this photo of No.4 which I haven't seen before.

 

The wheels have journal pins for mounting coupling rods.  I know from the E22 tank engines on the GER that removing the front coupling rods to convert them to a 2-4-0 from an 0-6-0 didn't take much effort so I would imagine that it would be the same with No.4.  If the right hand axle is a crank axle it would need balance weights, but they wouldn't be so necessary for the left hand wheels since there's no crank journals to balance.

 

Well spotted Annie, that's interesting. I'd assumed that balance weights would be required for any wheels driven by coupling rods but perhaps, at 10 MPH with 30 inch dameter wheels turning at about 120RPM and with fairly light rods, the out of balance forces were tolerable (but perhaps uncomfortable for the crew) . However, Wilkinson's book seemed to imply that converting from 2-2-0 to 0-4-0 was done almost on a trip basis but they'd surely have had to lift the undriven wheels to be able to turn them to align the journal pins before fitting the coupling rods .

Accordign to Wilkinson, WantageTramway no 6  was always a 2-2-0.

Imitation is.. will be with you shortly!  

Edited November 19, 2023 by Pacific231G

[Schooner]

MER.

 

 

 

 

 

That is all.

 

:)

[Annie]

1 hour ago, Pacific231G said:

However, Wilkinson's book seemed to imply that converting from 2-2-0 to 0-4-0 was done almost on a trip basis but they'd surely have had to lift the undriven wheels to be able to turn them to align the journal pins before fitting the coupling rods .

With a light locomotive like No.4 I would think it would be fairly easy to chock the driven axle and use a pair of jacks to lift the other wheel pair just clear enough of the rails so it could be rotated to align the journal pins.  I would imagine the engine crew would have had it down to a fine art after a while.

 

31 minutes ago, Schooner said:

MER.

 

 

 

 

 

That is all.

 

:)

I can't brain today I have the dumb.

[Schooner]

 

:)

[Annie]

10 hours ago, Schooner said:

MER.

 

 

 

 

 

That is all.

 

:)

The sound you have just heard is a seriously huge penny dropping.

 

Millwall Extension Railway, - how could I have gone and forgotten that!  Thank you for reminding me.

 

http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/n/north_greenwich/

 

 

 

Edited November 20, 2023 by Annie
Added a map

[Annie]

It looks like a classic Piano Line layout is simple enough to do using O-27 3 rail track which is a good thing since I have so much of it.  I purchased some dense 8 ft long insulation panels some time ago thinking that they might be useful as baseboards and once I can get things a bit more sorted out in my room I'd like to give them a try.

 

 

I thought it might be a good idea to order some more code 124 bullhead rail from Ironhorse Hobbies, but it came up with their cheery 'just missed out'  message when I tried to place my order.  I'm picking that it won't be until well into the New Year before they get some more in.

[Schooner]

11 hours ago, Annie said:

Millwall Extension Railway

That's the badger!

 

Not that it's any better than Wantage, being less frequently referenced perhaps it is worse, but it does offer some interesting traffic excuses and some different reasons for cramped station sites...and swap the spur and approach road and your Aunt Joanna's good to go!

 

[Annie]

15 hours ago, Schooner said:

and your Aunt Joanna's good to go!

 

Don't complain, - this is one of my all time favourite songs.

Yeah, - it's been one of those kind of days.

[brumtb]

19 hours ago, Annie said:

 

Don't complain, - this is one of my all time favourite songs.

Yeah, - it's been one of those kind of days.

Brilliant, one of the best, thanks!

Tony

[Annie]

My order of twelve lengths of code 124 Bullhead rail along with 300 or so chairs and other bits and bobs arrived today which was a big cheer up  😁😀😃

I'd made some kind of dumb mistake with Ironhorse Hobbies checkout application and paid too much for postage and they very quickly and efficiently refunded my misspent pocket money which was definitely a good thing.  🤩

 

Apparently the local company WoodsWorks here in NZ that I mentioned recently are agents for C&L Finescale so if I have any difficulty with getting anymore of the Peco 'O' gauge trackwork kit of bits I might be able to find suitable substitutes there.

 

Rummaging around in RM's digital back issues this afternoon earned me a small, but useful collection of Manning Wardle drawings.  Seeing the Manning Wardle class 'B' 0-4-0ST drawing again made me smile as when I was much younger than I am now I built one of these to P4 standards in brass.  I must've been nuts, - and my eyesight certainly must've been a lot sharper than it is now.  A 4mm scale class 'B' is tiny.  The only way I could get a motor into it was to find a can motor that was the same diameter as the boiler and use it as the boiler barrel.  The gearbox was some tiny kitset thing that had to be carefully assembled while taking great care not to sneeze.

Eventually I came to my senses and took up with coarse scale 'O' gauge instead which involved a lot less eye strain and a lot more fun.

 

 

So what I was thinking this afternoon was that if I could build something in brass, then building it in cardboard would involve about the same level of skill, but with less singed fingers.  And If I'm building it to 7mm scale as well it would be one heck of a lot easier than building it to 4mm scale.

 

I did go and make the pilgrimage to have a look at the Manning Wardle 0-4-0ST on the Slater's website, but after figuring out the price and postage cost in NZ dollars I decided that cardboard as a modelling material had a lot going for it.

 

[Annie]

I've ordered these Tamiya cutting implements, - a Design Knife and a pair of Curved Scissors.

Tamiya modelling tools are excellent so I think they should serve me well.  Scissors are generally safe enough for me to use and this pair with the curved cutting edges will make doing certain kinds of cuts a lot easier. I am slightly nervous about the Design Knife though.  I have used similar kinds of modelling knives before and found them to be very good for fine work.  The Tamiya knife looks to be a much better design in terms of it being easier to grip comfortably and the big advantage for me is there isn't a long exposed sharp edge all ready to cut me should I suffer a micropause or REM dropout.

 

 

[cornamuse]

0 gauge in card is definitely a possibility- 

 

this even has a card chassis- works well enough. I must confess to using a computerised card cutter though, although it is far from necessary. the tram skirts hide my appealing level of technical skill rather well…… 

 

 

[Annie]

44 minutes ago, cornamuse said:

0 gauge in card is definitely a possibility- 

 

this even has a card chassis- works well enough. I must confess to using a computerised card cutter though, although it is far from necessary. the tram skirts hide my appealing level of technical skill rather well…… 

Thanks for sharing these pictures of your models cornamuse.  When I was younger I made all kinds of models from card, - mostly because I didn't have much pocket money to spend, - but as time went on I came to enjoy using card and even used it to make terrain pieces for fantasy wargaming.  I never really seriously thought about using it to build locomotives though until I saw what Jim Read had done with his cardboard 'O' gauge models.

Edited November 22, 2023 by Annie
can't spell for toffee

[Annie]

An interesting page I stumbled upon almost by accident.  http://www.nevard.com/showcase.htm

It's all 4mm scale, but the layout builds are quality work and are bursting full of good ideas.

 

Edit:  And here......  https://www.flickr.com/photos/nevardmedia/sets/72157612020895249/

 

I started an archeological dig in my room to discover a potential site for building a layout only by the time it was midday it was 28 degrees and my brain stopped working for the rest of the day and I had to sleep.  I hate our Summer.  18 degrees and grey skies is my idea of a perfect Summer's day.

Edited November 23, 2023 by Annie
added a link and wrote words

[cornamuse]

8 hours ago, Annie said:

Thanks for sharing these pictures of your models cornamuse.  When I was younger I made all kinds of models from card, - mostly because I didn't have much pocket money to spend, - but as time went on I came to enjoy using card and even used it to make terrain pieces for fantasy wargaming.  I never really seriously thought about using it to build locomotives though until I saw what Jim Read had done with his cardboard 'O' gauge models.

Jim’s models are amazing, gave me the confidence to try locomotives from card. My accuracy isn’t great though, so I’ve moved up to g scale where it doesn’t show. Still in cardboard because I’m rubbish with anything else! 

[Porkscratching]

11 hours ago, Annie said:

Thanks for sharing these pictures of your models cornamuse.  When I was younger I made all kinds of models from card, - mostly because I didn't have much pocket money to spend, - but as time went on I came to enjoy using card and even used it to make terrain pieces for fantasy wargaming.  I never really seriously thought about using it to build locomotives though until I saw what Jim Read had done with his cardboard 'O' gauge models.

For your amusement here's a thing I dabbled with in card (from amazon envelopes)  just as a kind of rough try out "toile" of an idea to then make in metal of some sort (tin?) which I never did naturally. 

It's circa 10mm (easy to calculate!) to the foot so slightly bigger than O gauge, I simply printed some line drawing, front, top, sides etc, views of a Hunslet loco on paper, glued it to the card, cut the bits out, glued 'em together. 

It's been abandoned, dropped and knocked about on the floor by the cat etc etc, but was all fairly square when I made it, and I reckon the method of building  would work as a "proper" model if you then impregnated the card with CA, varnish, or whatever to stiffen it. Pity it got bashed up I'd be almost tempted to rescue it and build it as a rough card model myself now 😁

[Annie]

18 minutes ago, Porkscratching said:

For your amusement here's a thing I dabbled with in card (from amazon envelopes)  just as a kind of rough try out "toile" of an idea to then make in metal of some sort (tin?) which I never did naturally. 

It's circa 10mm (easy to calculate!) to the foot so slightly bigger than O gauge, I simply printed some line drawing, front, top, sides etc, views of a Hunslet loco on paper, glued it to the card, cut the bits out, glued 'em together. 

It's been abandoned, dropped and knocked about on the floor by the cat etc etc, but was all fairly square when I made it, and I reckon the method of building  would work as a "proper" model if you then impregnated the card with CA, varnish, or whatever to stiffen it. Pity it got bashed up I'd be almost tempted to rescue it and build it as a rough card model myself now 😁

That is really impressive and as you say it wouldn't have taken much to make a proper model of it.

Back in the day shellac was used to strengthen card, but that can be difficult to find these days.  I tried using cheap CA (superglue) once and while it certainly worked the fumes were fairly horrible and made me feel ill. 

Using clear polyurethane was a lot more successful and I have an ex-LSWR milk van I did some years ago that's been bumped around in boxes with other tinplate rolling stock and it still looks reasonably good.

Edited November 23, 2023 by Annie
can't spell for toffee

[Porkscratching]

I think CA is better for making paper (rather than card) into a hard material, maybe for roof tiles, signage, and the like.

.. you'd likely need a fairly large ££ quantity of CA to impregnate a load of card I'd think! 

Your polyurethane varnish idea sounds a good plan, the initial layers could also be thinned down to assist soaking into the card. 

[Annie]

11 minutes ago, Porkscratching said:

Your polyurethane varnish idea sounds a good plan, the initial layers could also be thinned down to assist soaking into the card. 

Exactly that.  The trickiest bit on the milk van was soaking the paper I used to to make the panelling before and after cutting out the delicate paper doily.  Somewhat as an experiment I glued the paper panelling in place using polyurethane and it turned out fine and it's still as good as the day I put it all together.

 

Edit:  When I tried using CA I used several tubes of very cheap CA glue from the Two Dollar Shop so the experiment didn't cost me much.

Edited November 23, 2023 by Annie
more to say

[St Enodoc]

Shellac is pretty much the same as French polish.

[harris0169]

Hi Annie

 

Was the polyurethane varnish solvent or water based do you know?  Just thinking about warping of card with water-based anything.

I bought some shellac flakes from ebay to add to my stockpile of materials for card modelling a-la-Jim Reid and Cornamuse.

 

All the best 

 

Andy

[Annie]

25 minutes ago, harris0169 said:

Was the polyurethane varnish solvent or water based do you know?  Just thinking about warping of card with water-based anything.

It was solvent based Andy.

 

I should see if I can find any shellac flakes locally.  Living out in the rural countryside is lovely, but not so good when it comes  to finding any kind of specialist materials.

[harris0169]

Folks have mentioned Button Polish as a "ready made" shellac (along with French polish, acklnowledging St Enodoc). 

 

Cheers

 

Andy