scanman Posted October 31, 2010 Share Posted October 31, 2010 Hi Some of you will be reading this as a follow-on to my failed entry in the 2010 comp - others will be stumbling across it purely by accident! Welcome to you all.... This first section will suffice as an introduction - previous activity, thought processes leading to this project, and a description of what is envisaged for the future. My modelling life has had several phases since returning to the hobby as an adult(?) some 40 years ago. I started in early British outline 'N' gauge, when the loco everyone aspired to was the Rivarossi 'Jubilee' - mainly because it was one of only two available! The other was the 'Farish' 94xx - and that's what I started with in early 1970... At least it was GWR Steam! Five years later, and I emigrated to 'EM' - still GWR, still steam. Three or four layouts ensued (including one that was exhibited at Brighton 'ModelWorld' based on the Fairford branch). Several years later, and I got the bug to cross 'the pond' - so sold all the UK stuff including a very full reference library - a VERY bad mistake. Never sell reference books - you won't make any money, and when you need to replace them they've quadrupled in price or are out of print! A few years in US 'HO' - and I'm back to the UK, this time 'Isle of Wight' steam in P4. Okay, not a good idea, so back across the pond in US 'N' gauge. Then back this way to - yes GWR steam in 'N' Guge. Finally a dabble in a freelance 16.5mm layout based on the Burton breweries. And in all that time I had very few layouts that reached anything like completion. Meanwhile I had been exposed to three iconic layouts. Two - Peter Denny's 'Great Central' and Frank Dyer's 'Borchester' were courtesy of the modelling mags. The third - Roye England's 'Pendon' I was fortunate enogh to be involved in for a while. I fully realise that Pendon is a team effort and credit is not solely due to Roye. However, there is a guiding principle in those three layouts - they were all the dream of an individual who did not waver from the dream. Whilst I had been butterflying through the hobby, Messrs Denny, Dwyer and Englande had persued a goal.... I suppose it was the sad loss of Peter Denny earlier this year that finally concentrated my mind. There was a modeller who had not only had the pleasure of building a layout - he also had the benefit of operating it for forty years. Note the contrast with my 'career'. Coincidentally, this realisation came at the same time as the demise (because of poor baseboard material) of my first entry to the challenge (South Hall Yard if you want to search the archive!). So 'Upton Dene' was born The intention is to build 'the final layout' - the one that will see out my modelling career (and I intend to go up (or down) with a controller in one hand a a glass of good red wine in the other)! However, the parameters had to be set. The choice was first - which scale? Second - where? Third - what form? None of the choices was a foregone conclusion... The one foregone conclusion was subject and period - Great Western Railway between the Wars (I & II) Scale. I'm not a spring chicken, and 7mm isn't known as the 'senior gauge' for nothing. However, in the short to medium term worthwhile space would be a real issue (the current 'layout room is 10' x 7'6"). 'N' guage? I'd been dabbling in it recently and still was not impressed with running quality. 2mm was a definite possibility as time was not (hopefully) going to be an issue. Personal skills are, and I did not feel confident that I could rise to the challenge. 'EM'/P4? I'd worked in both - with some success in 'EM' - and in the short to medium term could make something worthwhile in the space available. 'EM' Gauge it is then... 'Where' - well GWR and period had already been fixed. I also wanted to feature English countryside - I love the landforms - so a coastal or urban scene was out. I also like buildings in 'Cotswold Stone' - so somwhere in the Gloucestershire/Oxfodshire/Worcestershire area would suit. Prototype or fictional? Well, prototypes are great - half the decisionmaking is already decided! However, they can be constraining. So fictional - but with a prototype base. Form. - well the GW branchline has been done to death... Mainline then? Ahh - loadsa stock required almost from the outset. How about - a branchline feeding a secondary main line. Where have we seen that format used successfully for forty years??? The other advantage was the ability to start the build process at any point along the line... So 'Upton Dene' will be a branchline serving a secondary mainline station, set in the GWR interwar years and modelled in 'EM'.. Enough to keep me going for the rest of my natural? I reckon so. Other secondary considerations were - how interesting (modellingwise) would a layout be - would it maintain my interest? Would the layout be so large as to require a team of operators or of a size that I could operatii alone - and if so would it hold my operating interest in the years to come? The model also had to fill another consideration - contraction (or expansion) of available layout space. So (to a certain extent) modular.. So the final decision on scale form etc was made. GWR, 1920-1930's EM, based in the Cotswolds, and a series of dioramas separated by 'hidden' running lines. The modules would include the mainline station (based initially on 'Mortimer' on the Reading-Basingstoke secondary route), with the branchline diverging from it. The branchline would run through one 'passing station' based on 'Burghclere' on the old 'Didcot Newbury & Southampton' line, to a terminus based on Abingdon - but as they would all differ from their prototypes - to be renamed 'Upton Dene', 'Brimscombe' and (dumty dumty dumty dum dumty dumty dum dum) 'Ambridge' respectively! 'Upton Dene' would lie on a 'roundy roundy' base level with a fiddleyard on the opposite side of the layout, and the branch would ascend to the terminus in two laps of the layout room. The modular approach with 'hidden' connecting track would mean that modules could be built 'as required' and, if more space became available, the percentage of plain running lines could be increased and the layout altered to suit. However, there was also the '2010 Challenge' to consider. The constraints of the challenge (both in size and time) meant that none of the planned modules would be suitable. However, a small rural industy built as a scenic area (with operational interest) would fill the bill - and a dairy seemed the ideal 'corner filler'. Hence the genesis of the 'Dairy for Ambridge'! Internet research and study of those costly reference book replacements led me to the dairy at Moreton-in-Marsh - which also led me to a re-appraisal of the prototype base for 'Upton Dene' - Moreton station itself! So that's a (shortish) introduction to the background of the project. Now to the practicalities. The 'dairy' module is under construction now - in fact it could be completed soon. Up to recently, I would have semi-abandoned it and moved on in to the terminus. Lesson learned - complete one section at a time! The dairy will be finished and be operated between to cassette fiddleyards - one of them will be semi-permanent - the other will be replaced in time by the terminus boards. The intention is to have something that works and will maintain my interest as the other sections are built and added to it. The operational aspect appears quite limited at first - but the 'main line' will carry any 'branchline traffic whist the dairy itself offers the opportunity ofr related traffic - milk obviously in taks and 'siphons', but also coal for the boiler, covered vans for ancilliaries like packaging coming in and dairy products (butter, cheese etc) out. TTFN Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allegheny1600 Posted November 1, 2010 Share Posted November 1, 2010 Hello Ian That's a very interesting introduction and it seems as though both you and I have have a similar career path! Over this past couple of years or so, I too have decided that the "layout for life" concept is a very sound one and have recently started initial planning on my very own 'magnum opus' - with the difference that I have gone back to the other side of the pond! Your plans certainly sound good so I will observe with interest and wish you luck! Cheers, John E. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scanman Posted December 20, 2010 Author Share Posted December 20, 2010 Well, on the last post back at the end of October, the dairy (the nucleus of the new layout had reached this stage: As can be seen, the scenics were fairly basic, consisting of basic scatter material and some development trials using dyed teddy-bar fur. Apart from voting in the 'Challenge', things have moved on a little on the layout.... As stated above, I decided to start the scenics at the right end of the layout - defined by an overbridge that will (temporoarily) give accesws to a cassette storage system. Here, the roadside hedging is being developed Moving around to the left brings us to the 'viaduct board' which will lead to 'Ambridge' station throat. There are large areas of rough grassland, bounded by a cart-track, river and canal - plenty of scope to let the scenic imagination run riot! I am currently representing 'grass' by the use of dyed teddy-bear fur. THe bright-gold original product was dyed using very dilute acrylic paint. I use artist tube acrylic from an art shop where they appear to be on a permanent 2-for-1 offer! When dried, the fur is obviously matted down (left) but soon perks up when attacked by a suede-brush (right). When sufficient has been restored it is glued to the subsurface using 'Copydex' paste. This is applied in a similar manner to 'Evostick' - ie coat both the back of the fur and the scenic area, allow to go tacky and apply. It can happily be laid across baseboad joints (cutting it later with a 'Stanley Knife' or similar. Thus! In the main - in 4mm - the 'grass' is much too long. However this is easily remedied by using a pair of scissors (sharp blades are a neccessity) or (as in my case) a set of hair clippers! Further 'brushing can be then undertaken with the suede brush (amazing how strong 'Copydex' is!. More coliur variation can be introduced by using neat acrylics applied with an old toothbrush using a 'drybrush' technique similar to weathering. Now the finishing touches are applied. Ground foam for rough areas, applied using a spray adhesive, 'bushes' from 'Woodland Scenics' foam -de-clumped then re-clumped with the afore-said 'Copydex' (where applied over the baseboard join see the comment about cutting the fur first!). Dead shrubbery (cow parsley etc) along the hedgerow is represented by short lengths of cut sizal, with the obligatory poppies growing beneath. Also to be seen is the face of the viaduct - each stone lovingly inscribed in a sheet of depron foam, then painted with the above-mentioned tube acrylics (like the road bridge in the 'Challenge' entry). It was at this point that I realised that I'd made an error with the dairy approach road... For my chosen period (late 1020's - early '30's) it is highly unlikely that it would have been metalled - so it was back to a natural earth finish with a scatter of dirt/small grit etc to represent erosion products (look a bit red here but the actual scene is better!) Also in shot is the mock-up of the backscene - a 'genuine' cotswold' scene which I hope will shortly look even better after a commercial company has produced it for me as a single sheet! Well, thats it for the 'mo. Next steps are the 'rear wall' of the viaduct and associated arches, the river and canal. TTFN Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinahand Posted December 21, 2010 Share Posted December 21, 2010 Hi Ian, Well, considering your conceptual post was only on 1st November, I'd say you have made some remarkable progress in such a short space of time. Having recently retired I am, like yourself, in the process of constructing my Final Final Layout and it is, again like yours, to be a GWR one. In my case, however, I am risking everything by going N Gauge. This is to enable me to model more of the scenery with trains passing through it, though I do have a quite extensive terminus staion included in 'The Plan'. I look forward to watching your progress in the hope of maybe 'cribbing' some ideas from you. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scanman Posted December 23, 2010 Author Share Posted December 23, 2010 Hi Ian, Well, considering your conceptual post was only on 1st November, I'd say you have made some remarkable progress in such a short space of time. Having recently retired I am, like yourself, in the process of constructing my Final Final Layout and it is, again like yours, to be a GWR one. In my case, however, I am risking everything by going N Gauge. This is to enable me to model more of the scenery with trains passing through it, though I do have a quite extensive terminus staion included in 'The Plan'. I look forward to watching your progress in the hope of maybe 'cribbing' some ideas from you. Cheers Chinahand. I didn't mean to give the impression that a;; the work had been done in the last few weeks! (I wish!) The dairy section was developed mainly as an entry for the '2010' challenge, and the full topic can be found here:- http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php/topic/15731-ians-final-attempt-at-the-challenge/ which shows the module's development up to the beginning of November. Conceptually, (as mentioned above) the new layout will initially consist of a series of modules of which the dairy is the first. the modules will be linked (initially) by sections of plain track. Hopefully at some point the layout will be moved out of it's 10' x 8' shed into larger surroundings (dreams sometimes come true!) and the modules can then be re-positioned with 'real' scenic sections in between. So far as 'cribbing' goes - crib away! I do! I will admit to being seriously influenced by 'Waton' (another 2010 challenge entry) and Chris Nevards work. I like scenics! Regards Ian B Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scanman Posted January 7, 2011 Author Share Posted January 7, 2011 Little progress over the last couple of weeks I'm afraid - a serious cold & sinusitis (missed a holiday in Spain ), wife down with the same, work, Xmas, work, GRRRRRRR! Anyway - got a nice Xmas pressy from dad-in-law - so Martin Finney now has my CC number for a 'straight framed' Bulldog (going to be Kingfisher I think). So today it was back in to the workshop to carry on with the 'High Level' chassis kit for the 'Pannier' - although five hours work only produced half the gearbox (idler shafts in place) - a real 'slow-down' in what - to now has been a fairly fast build. Photo's should go up tommorrow on the link below. Oh yes - went to the doc's about the cold/sinusitis (need to claim off the insurance for the holiday) - went in with the cold - came out with a heart condition! When I told the locum about mild chest pain it was off to the nurse for a quick ECG - and some of the electrical circuits to the pump are misbehaving. (I didn't do the wiring - honest)! Stiill - look on the bright side - might get some time off to do some more modelling... Why look at a dark cloud when the silver lining is so much nicer! Regs to all Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
westerner Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 Only just come across this one. I'll be watching with interest. I like the dairy idea and the idea of a Branch joining a secondary mainline.(I wonder why ). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scanman Posted January 14, 2011 Author Share Posted January 14, 2011 I'm now 'blogging' for the construction of the rolling stock required - here http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php/blog/710/entry-5594-the-ex-mswjr-4-4-0-em-compensated-with-dcc-sound/ Normal service on the board themselves will continue here! Regs Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scanman Posted April 2, 2011 Author Share Posted April 2, 2011 Having spent a lot of time working (mortgage-paying type work), starting on the MSWJR 4-4-0 (see the blog!) and being shaken by the loss of my mother-in-law (my 'other' mum) 'Upton Dene' has taken something of a back seat - lthough there's been a lot going on off the boards. Time for a bit of a break and get into some architectural modelling again. 'The Dairy' boards - currently under construction - is of course the outlier for the terminus 'Ambridge'. It is to be hoped over the years that buildings representative of the village will grow up round the (yer to be built) station. However, one building was always intended to complement the dairy, and was tentatively named 'Angel Cottage' - to be the home of Walter Gabriel - one of my favourite characters! I have fond memories of childhood summer holidays spent with the grandparents (both 'Archers' addicts) at their bunglow in Ramsgate - listening for the gravelly voice of Walter over the radio.. . The site is on the outer curve leading to the viaduct and I have recently been considering further development in this area. A simple cottage/uothouse would suffice I suppose - but I really fancy developing the site as the 'village blacksmith' with a cottage: and ancilliary buildings. This will be a long-term project. probably being buit on a sub-board which can then be inserted into the scene. Why long-term? Well, built in this fashion, there's no rush - the generic scenery will be complete so the trains will have something to run past! I also want to go 'back to me roots', using the same modelling process as 'Pendion' - card buildings, scribed & individually-painted brick & stonework. It also implies a certain level of research, getting the vernacular buildings to match the prototypical area. The starting-point will be the various 'English Heritage' indexes, accessed through the 'Heritage Gateway' project. The link is at http://www.heritagegateway.org.uk/Gateway/ . If you follow the link, do NOT be put off by some of the technospeak - particularly in the advanced search area - it is very logically thhought out and fairly simple to use. The gateway searches both national records ('E.H's 'Pastscape', 'Views of Britain' etc) and also local authority records such as 'Historic Environment Records (HER's) which in any case are available on the local authority's own website. This should provide a number of 'targets' for the various types of buildings needed (agricultural labourer's cottage, wheel wright, forge, stable - to use some of the thesaurus terms) which I wil lthen look to make the subject of site visits which will eliminate some, and (hopefully) leading to detailed studies of others. Here's to a long warm summer! Regards Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scanman Posted April 2, 2011 Author Share Posted April 2, 2011 Ho Hum... First set-back - my original collection of watercolour tube paints (bought nearly 40 years ago!) have 'died'... I've hust ordered an new batch (don't think the originals cost £70)! Still at least the company I ordered from (I'll put the website link up when the order has arrived) has an offer of a free set of sable brushes worth £25 with the order. Regs Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beresford Junction Posted April 2, 2011 Share Posted April 2, 2011 Hi Ian Fascinating thread, especially about the teddy bear fur - if only they knew what it was going to be used for when you bought it! I look forward to more tips. Cheers Phil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scanman Posted April 2, 2011 Author Share Posted April 2, 2011 Hi Phil - They did! I quite often find very interesting tools/materials etc in shops which are essentially outlets for 'the other halfs' activities - and I never neglect to mention what I'm going to use it for! Surprising how much interest it generates... Regs Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beresford Junction Posted April 2, 2011 Share Posted April 2, 2011 Hi Ian Very good - I too often find myself looking at things working out what I can make from them, but I'm obviously not at your level yet - going from teddy bear fur to grass - I need to broaden my horizons ;-) Cheers Phil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wummyock Posted April 2, 2011 Share Posted April 2, 2011 Would Teddy Bear fur make a passable impression of thatch? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scanman Posted April 3, 2011 Author Share Posted April 3, 2011 Hi Ian Very good - I too often find myself looking at things working out what I can make from them, but I'm obviously not at your level yet - going from teddy bear fur to grass - I need to broaden my horizons ;-) Cheers Phil Hi Phil - Nothing original in using TBF - the Americans have been using it for years! Would Teddy Bear fur make a passable impression of thatch? Hi Wummyock - Personally I wouldn't - its just too fine (for 4mm) and in 2mm you'd probably have to gut it too short to get it to lay. 'Way back when', Pendon used human hair (Chinese) for some of the early models (the 'Coach & Horses' and ' The Chapel Group'). The source has now dried up, so they use plumbers hemp I understand. If you want to know more I can recommend Chris Pilton's book 'Cttage Modelling For Pendon' he was (is?) a first-class model-maker, and has a happy knack of explaining things. Regs Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Donw Posted April 3, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 3, 2011 Plumbers Hemp is not so widely used these days when I was Plumbing ( gaVE UP 2004) there was some being sold off cheap. I was one of the few that still used it. I had a big shank of it and someone's dog took it out of my tool box - had a lovely game with it. Does work well for thatch though. You need to watch a thatcher at work to get the idea its just like doing the real thing small. Don Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJS1977 Posted April 3, 2011 Share Posted April 3, 2011 There is a thatched cottage on my father's layout that I did using teddy bear fur and it doesn't look too bad, even if I do say so myself! Richard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coombe Barton Posted April 3, 2011 Share Posted April 3, 2011 Had thought of using dog hair (have plenty from source), but just googled for "plumbers hemp" and came up with a whole variety of sources and prices. You may find this bit useful about thatching - http://www.stuartviggers.com/about-thatch-in-england.php This gallery may also be useful - http://www.westcountrythatching.com/gallery.htm And a brief manual of construction - http://www.buildingconservation.com/articles/longstraw/longstraw.htm And some archaeological articles on thatching - http://www.buildingconservation.com/articles/articles.htm#thatch Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scanman Posted April 4, 2011 Author Share Posted April 4, 2011 Hi Coombe Barton - Thanks for a very interesting set of links (including one from your blog site on 'researching building history' - all now safely in my favouritse! Regs Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scanman Posted April 8, 2011 Author Share Posted April 8, 2011 Well, a nice package arrived today with all the paints etc. No hesitation in recommending the web site - http://www.artifolk.co.uk/index.htm. a very interesting site in its own right & a lot of very useful tools & equipment. The delivery even included an apology for the delay in filling the order.... Not that I was expecting one having only submitted it on Sunday! Next step will be to make a small test-piece (probably in the shape of a 'privvy') to find out whether I've still got the skills. For those that are interested in 'having a go' for Pendon (& they are always looking for potential village modellers), this is the system they use. Give the volunteer a small shed or outhouse to model. Mine was a bakehouse from Colney (about 35 miles off the scene they are modelling - but now hapily ensconced in the village! I'll show the progress as it happens - but not brick by brick, I promise! TTFN Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scanman Posted April 11, 2011 Author Share Posted April 11, 2011 A couple of hourssearching the Heritage Gateway site above revealed several potential targets for cottages & smithys in the cotswold area. However, the first piece as mentioned earlier will be that most important of structures - a privy (a searchable term on the 'Gateway'. The first example is http://www.imagesofengland.org.uk/Details/Default.aspx?id=469705&mode=adv. I have to use links as the images are copyright. The building's description - Privy immediately NE of Besbury Cottage GV II Privy .Circa early to mid C 19. Limestone rubble with dressed quoins. Stone tile roof with gabled ends to front and rear. Rectangular, almost square, on plan with doorway at front with plank door . Very small window on west side under eaves. INTERIOR: Plastered walls; exposed common-rafter roof with ridge-piece. 2-seat soil box. is attached to the wrong image... I love the 'two-seater soilbox.... The second - also a little quirky - is at http://www.imagesofengland.org.uk/Details/default.aspx?pid=2&id=131944 For an 18thC building it certainly has all 'mod cons' including running water.. The arrangement was not unusual in that period (as long as you had access to a stream - and you took the domestic water supply from a point above the privy (or better still a well)! It's only drawback (from the 'artistic' perspective is that it is made of brick... I can probably live with that as it is still an example from the modelled area, but the first example is more naturally in keeping being built from local stone - and the thought of modelling an occupied two-seater.... Well..! On reflection I think I'm going to model no2 - the cottaqge that sits behind it will do very nicely for Walters cottage... I feel a site visit coming on - although I will of course be writing to the occupant first. One of the attractions of modelling - the journey to the finished product (if they ever are 'finished') - can travel a very winding path! Regs Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scanman Posted April 11, 2011 Author Share Posted April 11, 2011 Ooops - I meant privy No1... Regs Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Mikkel Posted April 11, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 11, 2011 I'll show the progress as it happens - but not brick by brick, I promise! Brick by brick would be good! I really like your approach Ian, putting some real research and effort into building a model privy, a great approach and fascinating to follow. And some very interesting links above, too. PS: Agree that No. 2 is very "modellable. Be sure to bring some of Andy's "RMweb product" for the site visit Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coombe Barton Posted April 12, 2011 Share Posted April 12, 2011 If you can borrow a copy, you may find The Compleat Loo - a lavatorial miscellany of use.There are illustrations of several types, including one from the Cotswolds. They include the method of waste extractions, if a dry privvy (soil or ash) It is really amaziing what you come across when looking at building history. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scanman Posted April 12, 2011 Author Share Posted April 12, 2011 Brick by brick would be good! I really like your approach Ian, putting some real research and effort into building a model privy, a great approach and fascinating to follow. And some very interesting links above, too. PS: Agree that No. 2 is very "modellable. Be sure to bring some of Andy's "RMweb product" for the site visit Hi Mikkel 'Brick by brick'... You like watching paint dry?? Only joking! I will break it down into the various processes - marking out, setting out (not the same thing!), mortar washing etc. key features, the infill, folding-up etc. Must say I was stumped by the reference to Andy Y's product.. Not been around long enough! If you can borrow a copy, you may find The Compleat Loo - a lavatorial miscellany of use.There are illustrations of several types, including one from the Cotswolds. They include the method of waste extractions, if a dry privvy (soil or ash) It is really amaziing what you come across when looking at building history. Hi Coombe Barton Absolutely agree regarding building history. If I hadn't followed nautical archaeology as a main course I would probably have chosen the archaeology of buildings. Still, it's not too late & retirement is about three years off. Thanks for the reference - I'll have a look on LOLI Regs to you both, Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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