DP1 - imagining it on a present day railtour

[Edwin_m]

In the 60s when BR introduced yellow ends, several other things were going on at around the same time:

 

- Great increase in train speeds and frequencies on main lines at least, likely to increase track worker fatalities.

- Closure of low-speed and lightly used branch lines, likely to increase fatality risk in proportion because the higher risk routes would form a greater proportion of the total network.

- Mechanisation of track maintenance, meaning there were fewer workers exposed to risk and therefore fewer fatalities, but not easy to say what it would have done to the risk level for an individual worker.

- Introduction of high visibility clothing for track workers, making it more likely a driver will see them earlier and sound the horn.

 

My feeling is that it would be impossible to separate out these effects and use British data to make the case either for yellow ends having a safety benefit or making no difference. There would be more chance, as Stationmaster suggests, of using comparative data between countries but even that would be difficult. For example most countries have more generous clearances between tracks, allowing work to take place more easily adjacent to a line still in use, and it is not obvious whether this makes track workers more or less vulnerable.

 

However I note that Belgium is now using yellow ends - are they mandatory there or anywhere else? Is there any research into the change to track worker risk in any countries where yellow ends have been adopted but the railway has otherwise not changed much?

 

Under British safety legislation a railway has a duty to reduce all risks (other than those that are already acceptably low) to a level As Low As Reasonably Practicable. As yellow paint costs much the same as any other colour then yellow ends are not a significant cost to the industry (no price is put on appearance!). Track workers are amongst the higher risk occupations in the country, most people would agree that yellow ends probably reduce this risk if only by a little, but the cost is also small. So it qualifies as a reasonably practicable safety measure and is therefore required by health and safety legislation.

[Guest stuartp]

The story of yellow ends (and whatever experimental colours those two 31s were painted) is covered in "BR - A Journey by Design" by Brian Haresnape. It's been a very long time since I read it but I'm pretty sure the reason was complaints from track workers.

 

BR was occasionally quite good at acting on suggestions/complaints from staff without waiting for the body count to rack up to prove the case, especially if the solution was cheap. Edwin has admirably covered the reasons why they're still yellow despite it possibly being a marginal control measure.

[craigwelsh]

I wasn't using figures, I was using common sense. If Germany, Switzerland and Austria had a similar or higher fatality rate to Britain and BR introduced yellow ends and had a large reduction in fatalities then surely these countries would have followed suit?

 

Kindest Regards,

Jack

Maybe those countries used common sense that a yellow end couldn't possibly have made the difference? Actually don't the Germans mandate a red front end or something because red was the danger colour? Good thing HS1 doesn't need the yellow panel when that ICE ran into London..

 

how about making a yellow headboard with ohle warning flashes and a high intensity headlight that could be temporarily attached to the model with smurf poo (blutak) or tacky wax, gives you the option of running it as original or how it might need to appear if on the mainline now.

I'm pretty sure a loco has run on the mainline with a massive yellow headboard stuck on the front but I can't recall what it was now. It might have been an Intercity anniversary special or something?

[Sir Hadyn]

It was class 71 E5001 on the main line in all over green with a yellow headboard. Can't remember which particular train. Loco subesquently had a half yellow end painted on it.

[Rods_of_Revolution]

Maybe those countries used common sense that a yellow end couldn't possibly have made the difference? Actually don't the Germans mandate a red front end or something because red was the danger colour? Good thing HS1 doesn't need the yellow panel when that ICE ran into London.

 

Did the ICE run unassisted, I know the one which was bought in for the display was dragged as it wasn't cleared for operation on HS1.

 

I'm pretty sure DB Red is just the livery and not mandatory, for example ICEs don't use it, various items of push pull stock and locomotives wearing the older colours don't and neither do a host of hired and privately owned and operated vehicles use it.

 

Kindest Regards,

 

Jack

[Edwin_m]

According to Modern Railways mag the ICE ran unassisted during tests in the tunnel but was dragged to St Pancras.

 

I don't believe yellow ends are required on HS1 and they certainly aren't on Eurotunnel - there are no doubt other ways of safeguarding track workers. If Network Rail or anyone else insisted on yellow ends on HS1 without a very good safety justification then they would be up before the beaks for breaching EU interoperability directives. Not sure of the status of Ashford International but this may require more NR rules to be followed due to its close proximity to the rest of the network.

 

Ironically Eurostar is one of the few liveries where the yellow end looks like it was thought through by the designer rather than something that had to be added on later to meet safety standards.

[Rods_of_Revolution]

According to Modern Railways mag the ICE ran unassisted during tests in the tunnel but was dragged to St Pancras.

 

I don't believe yellow ends are required on HS1 and they certainly aren't on Eurotunnel - there are no doubt other ways of safeguarding track workers. If Network Rail or anyone else insisted on yellow ends on HS1 without a very good safety justification then they would be up before the beaks for breaching EU interoperability directives. Not sure of the status of Ashford International but this may require more NR rules to be followed due to its close proximity to the rest of the network.

 

Ironically Eurostar is one of the few liveries where the yellow end looks like it was thought through by the designer rather than something that had to be added on later to meet safety standards.

 

I found the answer, obtained by a Freedom of Infomation request, not by me a I may add!

 

"Your enquiry in relation to yellow ends on trains has been passed to me for action. Your email identifies that trains operating on HS1 are not required to have yellow ends. You will no doubt be aware that the yellow ends were an early attempt to make trains more visible to track workers who might be on or about the line whilst trains are running. The rules of HS1 do not allow for working on the line whilst trains are operating and so yellow ends are not required.

 

Should a train be able to operate on both HS1 and the rest of the heavy rail network then a different arrangement would apply. The default position is that yellow ends would normally be required however new trains that comply with the Technical Specifications for Interoperability (TSIs) and have the new headlight arrangement are considered to be clearly visible. On the basis that the new headlight arrangement gives good visibility to track workers, any application for a derogation against the requirement for yellow ends is usually granted by the standards committee."

 

Source: http://pipsrailway.wordpress.com/2010/11/29/they-call-me-mellow-yellow/

 

Cheers,

 

Jack

[Steven B]

As a note at least 45% of the front of a train must be painted yellow

 

 

I thought there had to be a square meter of yellow on the front? (I wouldn't have said that the panel on a class 67 was 45%).

 

 

Happy modelling.

 

Steven B.

[hairyhandedfool]

....As a note at least 45% of the front of a train must be painted yellow....

 

I was of the belief it was 20% and that if it was divided into sections, each had to be no smaller than a metre square or something like that.

 

Using a random selection of web searches, the following are clearly not 45% of the front of the train.

 

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3437/3856095917_d1f1997b01_o.jpg

http://www.dailytrains.com/train-images/09/07/class-180-snow.jpg

 

http://www.freefoto.com/images/23/03/23_03_2---Central-Trains-Class-158_web.jpg?&k=Central+Trains+Class+158

 

http://www.scot-rail.co.uk/photo/scaled/77.jpg

 

http://www.kentrail.co.uk/Class%20319%20002.jpg

 

http://www.chiltern.gov.uk/filminglocations/images/class121(bubble%20car).jpg

 

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3179/2938880525_bbe10d8c87.jpg

I answer to the op, using 50044 as an example, one tail light could be replaced by a headlight. As a thought, could the big headlight thing be replaced with a high intensity one and the taillights replaced with bi-colour LED lights? or would one need to be a bulb?

[Guest stuartp]

I thought there had to be a square meter of yellow on the front? (I wouldn't have said that the panel on a class 67 was 45%).

 

 

Group Standard GM/RT2483 says 1 square metre, with a load of conditions as to how much can be split by gangways or otherwise distributed around the front end. Section C2 refers. As has been mentioned though, derogations are available if the risks are controlled another way or are insubstantial.

 

For anybody modelling the post-privatisation scene all current and some earlier Group Standards are freely available on line at www.rgsonline.co.uk. It's a bit of a faff as document titles rarely include sensible keywords you might be searching on, and you'll need to unravel current and superceded documents. Also, you won't get documents only applicable to Network Rail and their contractors as those are Network Rail Line Standards and are subscription only.