Julia Posted March 14, 2011 Share Posted March 14, 2011 Has anyone tried running 3 4-cep units together on DCC to form a 12-CEP ? How well does it work? J Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRman Posted March 14, 2011 Share Posted March 14, 2011 You mean like this? I ran this lash-up just before the final dismantling of my old layout. I still couldn't quite get the whole train in shot but it is all there! The inter-unit couplings are Bachmann EZ-Mate (Kadee equivalents) and there were two types of decoder fitted - two units have Lenz Silver and one had a Bachmann (ESU) basic decoder pending the arrival of an ESU LokSound from Howes (since fitted). They ran beautifully together as a consist although I had to use an old-style consist because of the Bachmann decoder. My new layout will be set up for a maximum 8CEP length in normal use but I may have to revise the plan slightly now that Bachmann have announced the MLV! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
exet1095 Posted March 14, 2011 Share Posted March 14, 2011 I think my 4-CEP is my most powerful locomotive - it happily pulls another 12 coaches! I think if I had another I would want it to be unpowered, but I know that's not going to happen. Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
neal Posted March 14, 2011 Share Posted March 14, 2011 That's a good point, I wonder if Bachmann have ever considered un-powered locos (as Dapol do in N gauge). Un-powered 4 car EMU's, or 2/3 car DMU's would be useful. Similarly Class 20 'slaves' or un-motorised banking/double-heading steam locos could be interesting. However I wonder whether they could be as cheap as Dapol un-powered locos (where these are around a third of the motorised version cost!) Neal Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julia Posted March 15, 2011 Author Share Posted March 15, 2011 That's a good point, I wonder if Bachmann have ever considered un-powered locos (as Dapol do in N gauge). Un-powered 4 car EMU's, or 2/3 car DMU's would be useful. Similarly Class 20 'slaves' or un-motorised banking/double-heading steam locos could be interesting. However I wonder whether they could be as cheap as Dapol un-powered locos (where these are around a third of the motorised version cost!) Neal Its an interesting idea. I know in the past that you could buy diesel loco sets which were a powered and a dummy car, I don't know who made them, but I remember seeing them on the shelf. With DCC it is quite easy to run two or more loco's together in a consist, tho I have never tried it (hence asking my questions). I quite like the idea of someone making a 4TC set, being that it was an unpowered 4 car multiple unit in effect... J Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torn-on-the-platform Posted March 15, 2011 Share Posted March 15, 2011 Not knowing much about the power set up for the 4Ceps, would it be a reasonable idea to supply them with an alternative, unpowered bogie should the owner want to make a more permanent 8/12Cep? The unpowered bogie must surely be supplied as a spare anyway? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete the Elaner Posted March 15, 2011 Share Posted March 15, 2011 I've seen 2 4-CEPs running together on a DC layiout & they ran faultlessly. They even sounded great over board joins. If you ar worried about motors snatching against each other, then place them together in the middle of the train. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted March 15, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 15, 2011 Although we have been told above that multiple-running of these units is no problem on DCC, the conventional wisdom for overcoming any pushing & pulling is for one decoder to have Back EMF enabled, and another not so. Thus one decoder can sense and compensate for both. If all decoders are BEMF-enabled, they constantly "fight" each other. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRman Posted March 15, 2011 Share Posted March 15, 2011 Quite correct Ian; conventional wisdom says that and with some other consists i have used this has been necessary. With the 3 x 4CEPs, though, I did not make any adjustments at all to BEMF settings and they all ran perfectly together with no fighting or hunting. Some time back, at a BRMA meeting here in Melbourne, I instigated a 2 x 4CEP formation on my friend's DC layout; in this case we had the motor bogies in the centre of the eight car unit and all worked equally well. One correction to my earlier post is that the decoders used were not Lenz but Hornby Sapphire units which I was trying out. I wasn't entirely happy with the behaviour in relation to CVs 3 and 4 with those but they did work fine with the Bachmann decoder, which also had issues with the inertia / momentum behaviour (they all still matched!). I did replace the Sapphire decoders with Lenz after trying out an 8-pin Lenz decoder in one unit, which drove beautifully but did not work the lights correctly through the 21-pin adaptor from the Hornby Sapphire. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Evil Bus Driver Posted March 15, 2011 Share Posted March 15, 2011 We ran a 12-CEP formation on Brighton MRC's Highcombe layout. Ran faultlessly, although a 12 coach train in a 5 coach terminus station was quite a sight... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dogmatix Posted March 15, 2011 Share Posted March 15, 2011 I once ran my two 4CEPs together around my layout not by coupling them together, but by running them on separate controllers, the rear unit always one step higher than the front unit, each with power car last, thus simulating close coupling between the units. I still wish that Bachmann hadn't skimped on close coupling at the unit ends. I use ESU LokPilot DCC decoders, with Roco DCC control and ESU wireless controllers therefor (no longer available). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Budgie Posted January 17, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 17, 2012 Isn't it time Bachmann announced a 4BEP so we can run "proper" 12-car CEP/BEP trains? And maybe there should be an unmotorised option, as mentioned earlier in the thread by Torn-on-the-platform. I had no trouble whatever when running 12CEP round my garden railway. They are fitted with Lenz Silver 21 decoders, and consisted. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastwestdivide Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 Isn't it time Bachmann announced a 4BEP so we can run "proper" 12-car CEP/BEP trains? You could fool 95% of people with "any old Mk1 buffet car" substituting for the trailer second. Did the BEP buffets resemble anything else? Edit: earlier topic on converting to a BEP: http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/9067-converting-a-Bachmann-cep-to-a-bep/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 That's a good point, I wonder if Bachmann have ever considered un-powered locos ...However I wonder whether they could be as cheap as Dapol un-powered locos (where these are around a third of the motorised version cost!)... ...I quite like the idea of someone making a 4TC set, being that it was an unpowered 4 car multiple unit in effect... They have certainly been asked about such things in the past, and have basically said that it isn't an economic proposition: the extra design work and alternate parts for an unpowered version, and then the stocking issue with retailers for an unknown customer demand all militate against it IIRC. Frankly, with the price of a four car EMU set being much the same as 4 of their BR mk1 coach models with lighting (Met-Camm Pullmans) my assessment would be that on the model as it stands the motor unit is almost for free. That could almost be embarrassing with respect to the idea of a 4TC. How would it have to be priced for value perception against a directly comparable powered EMU? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
70022Tornado Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Historical Note: The classical Dover/Folkeston Harbour Boat Train Was 4CEP,4BEP,4CEP,MLV,MLV laterly one MLV substituted for a through wired and piped BG 70022 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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