NeilH Posted March 17, 2011 Share Posted March 17, 2011 Hi I was wondering if anyone could help me with the passenger train coach formations for trains with sleeping coaches on the WCML in 1977. Information required for passenger trains for a model rail project. Thanks and Regards Neil. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertcwp Posted March 17, 2011 Share Posted March 17, 2011 I have the 1977-8 LMR carriage workings which have the formations - both original and massively amended versions. They are currently awaiting scanning (and will eventually be posted to my Yahoo Group in pdf form). However I shall not have time to scan them for a while. Here is one sleeper formation: 2330 (SX) Euston to Glasgow BG (NDV) 2 SLCT SLSTP SLF SLSTP SLF SLSTP SLF Pullman Car 4 SLF BG (NDV) The Pullman Car was M354E - the Nightcap Bar. However, as there was only one such vehicle and two sets were needed for the service and its balancing working (2310 from Glasgow) the other set must have included another vehicle but this is not identified in the carriage workings. An ex Golden Arrow car had been used but this had been withdrawn by 1977. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilH Posted March 18, 2011 Author Share Posted March 18, 2011 Many thanks for your help with this Robert - Much appreciated, Regards, Neil. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted March 18, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 18, 2011 Back in the 1970s there were many more sleeper services than survive today. All had different formations as far as I am aware to take account of differing levels of traffic. Some of those listed here may have ceased or been combined by 1977 as overnight traffic dwindled and / or was actively killed off by BR attitude. From (and back to) London Euston there was a combined Liverpool / Manchester Piccadilly sleeper which had vans, seats and sleepers on both portions. The "Irish Mail" had sleepers for Holyhead even though Irish passengers got a rude awakening at some ungodly hour to transfer to the boat. There were two trains to Glasgow Central (as noted above one of which was sleepers only) and one to Stranraer which later became a portion off one of the Glasgow trains. Inverness was served by the 16-vehicle "Royal Highlander" train of mostly sleeping cars. The Fort William portion was switched from an ECML Edinburgh train to the WCML when all overnight trains were withdrawn from the ECML but I cannot recall the date. It continued to be a portion off the Edinburgh train however. There was a Barrow - Euston overnight train which had a single sleeping car IIRC along with some seating and ran as 1A00 but in one direction only. The down was a daytime working with the sleeper locked out of use. Aberdeen was served via the ECML until the transfer of services to the west coast. Then there was the overnight Bristol - Glasgow / Edinburgh which had seats and sleepers for both destinations which joined the west coast routes at Birmingham New Street. there was only one such vehicle and two sets were needed for the service and its balancing working (2310 from Glasgow) the other set must have included another vehicle I believe the "opposite number" was the Hadrian Bar vehicle. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
caradoc Posted March 18, 2011 Share Posted March 18, 2011 Wasn't the Fort William portion switched from Kings X to Euston, at or shortly after, the electrification of the northern part of the WCML was completed in 1974, being detached from an Inverness train at Mossend Yard ? The removal of sleepers from the ECML came later, in May 1988. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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