55022 to work freight

[DavidH]

And I bet hearing that sound booming across Tyneside is stirring memories in people who wouldn't normally notice a train noise and are wondering what's making that once-familiar sound in these parts.

Dave.

 

The mischievious pedant in me finds it hard to resist pointing out that the sound is unlikely to travel that far ... Blyth and Ashington aren't Tyneside. Sorry Max

 

But it was wonderful to see, and I envy your DC3.

[Coach bogie]

It is a great sight to see.

 

What is less than pleasing is the trespass, photographers quite happy to climb over fences onto the track to get that 'must have' shot.

 

Shots taken from the public road... where some of these should have been!

 

Mike Wiltshire

[Bon Accord]

The mind boggles. Before you know it, the BTP will be in attendance for these trains so as to curb trespass - why is this still such a problem?

Whilst I don't necessarily agree with certain elements of the railway trespass law, the fact of the matter is that the HSE Fanatics run the UK these days, and if they throw their risk assessed, smooth cornered and ethnically diverse toys out of the pram then it could mean the end of Heritage locos on the national network.

[James]

The problem is that magazines like Traction have carried references to trespassing - the latest Traction Article has photos by Tony Wright where, in the captions, he admits trespassing in order to obtain the shots.

 

Despite these being twenty or more years ago, it seems irresponsible for magazines to publush such blatant examples of this - not surprising it still continues.

[craigwelsh]

The problem is that magazines like Traction have carried references to trespassing - the latest Traction Article has photos by Tony Wright where, in the captions, he admits trespassing in order to obtain the shots.

 

Despite these being twenty or more years ago, it seems irresponsible for magazines to publush such blatant examples of this - not surprising it still continues.

You can't really put a modern view on the past or we'd have hardly any steam era shots to show. Much of the official railtour activity done then would be illegal now anyway. It does seem to be people who were active in that era continuing bad habits though that havent kept up with more modern views on H&S.

[John M Upton]

They will wish they had kept up with modern line side H&S regs when one evening some unlucky engineer is jet hosing what's left of them from the underside of a Deltic whilst someone from the BTP has to do the onerous job of delivering the death-o-gram to the relatives.

[James]

You can't really put a modern view on the past or we'd have hardly any steam era shots to show.

Of course I can!

 

How many trespassers on railway property have you had to deal with? I've met drunks, druggies, people taking short cuts, a Leeds Uni student going for a run along the cess (seriously!), the odd enthusiast and had bottles, stones, etc thrown at me. I've even had abuse from an enthusiast for ruining his shot when I was stood in the cess as a train went by! The latter wasn't actually trespassing but his attitude was just as entrusive!

 

So I think I can apply modern day thinking to this! A lot of shots in books are the result of trespass and many of the more well known photographers had arrangements with railwyamen they knew. But the way that Traction presented the article I highlighted is appalling - it would have been better for the captions not to mention it at all.

[The Stationmaster]

The mind boggles. Before you know it, the BTP will be in attendance for these trains so as to curb trespass - why is this still such a problem?

Whilst I don't necessarily agree with certain elements of the railway trespass law, the fact of the matter is that the HSE Fanatics run the UK these days, and if they throw their risk assessed, smooth cornered and ethnically diverse toys out of the pram then it could mean the end of Heritage locos on the national network.

 

Unfortunately the sort of idiotic behaviour seen in those pics is nothing new and was a source of constant and long running concern back in BR days - indeed it almost put an end to the 'mainline steam revival' on several occasions. Back in the 1970s I had to physically remove one peanut-brained so-called 'enthusiast' from the four foot of a running line and the only way I could then stop him trying to get back there was to, literally, shove him down an embankment into a bramble patch - less than 2 minutes later a D10XX hauled passenger passed over the very spot where the idiot had been waiting to get his steam loco picture. So none of the commonsense attitude to trespass has anything to do with H&E or 'poltical correctnees whatever' - it is, and has long been, a simple matter of safety and trying to save people's lives.

Very few, if any, of the well known and long established railway photographers of old trespassed in order to get their pictures. One or two others no doubt occasionally made their way inside railway boundaries but stayed clear of running lines and dangerous spots unless they had official permission. Others, such as Eric Treacy, had the necessary official permission while others (and probably including Treacy) had proper Lineside Photographic Permits and were therefore 'legitimate'. The stupidity generally did not lie with the well known and published photographers but with some idiots of the 'end of steam' and later 'end of various diesel classes' era and usually the magazines exercised a further control by refusing to publish photographs which were taken from places where the photographer had no right to be; that is what any halfway intelligent editor should be doing now.

 

And others have hinted at it but I'll just add - the sole purpose of high-vis clothing is let a Driver see you before his train hits you, he can't stop that train and invariably a train is a lot bigger and harder than the person it hits. And when we used to go out to a fatality the most important thing to have handy was rubber gloves and a supply of black plastic sacks, I hope I don't need to explain why but on one occasion I picked up one of the deceased's socks (fortunately empty) nearly 400 yards beyond the place where the train had hit him.

[DaveF]

I cannot understand why anyone would need to even think about trespassing to get a photo of 55022. There are plenty of very open locations, even where these photos were taken there are plenty of perfectly good viewpoints from public access areas i.e. not railway land and not industrial or farm land. I've been living near the line for 30 years and have never trespassed to get my photos. Any of mine taken on railway property have been taken with specific permission (and that was in BR days).

 

As for photographers trespassing in other areas I remember when I was a young my father explaining to me that he had a track permit for certain areas of BR and that when he was using it I could not go with him as it only applied to him, not his family or friends. This was in the 1950s.

 

I know that a few of the images I have of mine and Dad's on flickr (and RM Web) are taken trackside, but they were all taken with permission and when necessary under the supervision of an appropriate member of staff, be they on BR or other lines.

 

I cannot understand why people trespass for any purpose, I know too many railwaymen who have literally had to pick up the pieces.

 

My apologies for straying from the main topic. Fortunately when I have gone out to see 55022 since it came to the area I have not encountered any trespassers.

 

David

[stewartingram]

I don't know the area (long way from the Fens!) but I honestly cannot see the point of trespassing, just to get a close-up shot, which could have been taken anywhere? Surely much better to move back, include the scenery, and "place" it somewhere especially if a rare/unusual working?

Stewart

[Guest Max Stafford]

I'll concur fully with the final paragraph of Mike's posting. Not for the first time I've had to deal with the aftermath of a 'Train-1, Person-nil' scenario and it's not fun, always the same final score.

Sadly, it appears that the sight of an interesting train makes the blood rush disproportionately to the heads of some individuals, leading to the abandonment of common sense and indeed basic survival instincts as they focus on their quarry. It's incredible to witness, but occasionally individuals lose their entire awareness of the surrounding environment. One individual in their late 50s actually walked right across four running lines at a busy major station with which I am very familiar in a professional capacity ( ) in full view of a large number of other persons, his wife and grand-child as a steam charter was departing! Needless to say, a formal 'chat' followed along with a £50 fixed penalty, but he was left in no doubt whatsoever that the cost could have been immeasurably higher.

 

Dave.

[TheSignalEngineer]

Cleaning a trespasser's body parts from a Facing Point Lock after a full english in the canteen is an experience I am glad I will never have to repeat and one I would not wish on anyone.

Unfortunately the idiots are everywhere. One Sunday evening I was checking round a worksite ready to sign a job in, when I noticed a light coming towards me along the track from outside the possession. When it got closer I realised it was a man on a motorbike riding up the four-foot. Apparently he used the line as a regular route back from the pub after a drinking session to avoid riding along the road.

[jamie92208]

The other thing that these thoughtless idiots don't seem to consider is the effect on the driver of the train who hits a trespasser which can be devastating and lead to many long term problems. All for the sake of a photograph. I ahve also ahd to deal with these things in a professional capacity and they are not pleasant. I don't know if there is still a voluntary ban on publishing photos taking whilst rrespassing but I believe there used to be amongst the magazine editors.

 

 

Jamie

[James]

I don't know if there is still a voluntary ban on publishing photos taking whilst rrespassing but I believe there used to be amongst the magazine editors.

Apparently not in Traction! Certainly not in the Annual in the example I used.

 

The situation can be a little unclear when people have taken photos whilst at work -

 

 

I guess the difference is that I was supposed to be there, supposed to have a camera with me and in a position of safety.

 

One day I expect an enthusiast will get themselves killed and it may result in a huge change to how enthusiasts and specials are handled.

[The Stationmaster]

Apparently not in Traction! Certainly not in the Annual in the example I used.

 

The situation can be a little unclear when people have taken photos whilst at work -

 

I guess the difference is that I was supposed to be there, supposed to have a camera with me and in a position of safety.

 

 

In such circumstances the situation should be made clear in the text which accompanies the photo - as various people have done on here in the past (when it might not otherwise have been obvious that they were where they were with official sanction). Mind you technically it might still be the case (although I think not?) that just having permission to be there is not necessarily permission to take photos - which was certainly the official situation at one time back in the days when BR issued Lineside Photographic Permits and you were not supposed to take & publish 'lineside' pics unless you had one! I wonder how many times that was observed in the breach?

[James]

With so many different companies out and about now I'm not sure how you would police it. Some of my photos ended up in use on Grants website and I guess other things too.

 

Mind you, most photos I took on the Hull Docks project weren't too interesting - 5,000 of steel bridge details for instance! Corus were much more strict on photography (there's even a note on the App-Frod Preservation Society's site re the site trips) - as a whole photography was banned unless it was part of your job.

[TheSignalEngineer]

There is a question of copyright when taking photos at work. On a number of my jobs post privatisation we were obliged to take photographs of various things whilst on track and in signal boxes. The terms of the contracts in force at the time usually vested copyright of photographs taken on the job in Railtrack's hands, not that they ever saw most of them, getting a good shot of point fittings during a night possession and a temperure well below freezing iemperatures isn't easy. About 1000 rejects are still in my office.

[The Stationmaster]

There is a question of copyright when taking photos at work. On a number of my jobs post privatisation we were obliged to take photographs of various things whilst on track and in signal boxes. The terms of the contracts in force at the time usually vested copyright of photographs taken on the job in Railtrack's hands, not that they ever saw most of them, getting a good shot of point fittings during a night possession and a temperure well below freezing iemperatures isn't easy. About 1000 rejects are still in my office.

 

I did it the other way about with my post-BR occasional employer by allowing them to make use, without prejudice to my retained copyright, of photographs I had taken in their time (the only exception being when I used their camera during some Ansaldo signal head testing on the Stockport job - that time I kept the copies with their permission for me to use them).

[5944]

 

Taken yesterday, from inside the fence but with the assistance of a step ladder! I'll post some more at http://www.flickr.com/photos/5944 when I've finished sorting them out.

[Allegheny1600]

The thing is;

With todays digital cameras, zoom lenses and burst mode, I find that I can take quality photos from quite some distance away - no need to ever put myself into any danger from passing traffic, rail or road!

Okay, my pics might not be quite good enough to appear in magazines but they sure look good on my 24" monitor, IMHO!!!!

As to those who have to get that perfect picture - what good will it do you?

Imagine the headstone;

"Alas poor John, He got the perfect shot of the Deltic - just before it killed him"!!!

I don't want that, do you?

.

Stay safe, stay off the railway!

John E.

 

P.S. I've seen in "Rail Express" I think, that they do not accept submissions where there are lots of other 'photographers' in attendance, presumably because they could receive multiple copies of much the same shot.

[Coach bogie]

The trespass problem appears to have sorted itself out. Interest not what it was!

 

By Friday evening it was the driver, the signalman and me.

 

Saturday 14th is the last booked run, though there is still time for this to be extended.

 

Mike Wiltshire

[James]

the signalman

Judging by the car he must be a relief signaller!

[Coach bogie]

Last full day of ops Tuesday 17th.

 

Wednesday 1 trip in the morning then off light engine to Scotland.

 

Ran with a headboard today.

 

Mike Wiltshire

[The Black Hat]

Here is a link from my website about the event::

 

Pictures here show the locomotive at various points on the line, passing its

GBRf workmates, being the class 66 on the duties across the network. Will it

happen again? A Deltic on freight, who knows, but someone came from Canada to

see this one - I guess that says it all....

 

Nice to meet some new people and see some familiar ones in Blyth of all places!

 

Pictures at http://www.blackhatrailwaypictures.co.uk/p890053025

[The Stationmaster]

Not likely to happen there from what I hear - Alcan is closing its activity there and at Lochaber due to Carbon Taxation