Fat Controller Posted October 31, 2020 Share Posted October 31, 2020 (edited) I suspect they were Diagram 1/108 wagons, so Morton, with shoes on on side only. I looked at the list of Diagram and Lot Numbers, and they don't seem to have built any diagrams before 1/108. The first number issued to Pressed Steel was B75200; there was an run of numbers to B100108 that is, just short of 25000 wagons. There were further batches from Pressed Steel and other manufacturers; in total 206444 wagons were built to this Diagram alone. Edited October 31, 2020 by Fat Controller 1 2 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatB Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 On 31/10/2020 at 01:52, hmrspaul said: Graham Farish did an LMS mineral wagon with that type of end. A very long time ago! Available in red/brown or grey. Paul And in N too, not that it's relevant here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Enterprisingwestern Posted November 1, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 1, 2020 4 hours ago, PatB said: And in N too, not that it's relevant here. But the OO version is? Mike. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatB Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 8 hours ago, Enterprisingwestern said: But the OO version is? Mike. Well, insofar as the mystery wagon could, at a stretch, be a Farish 00 one, but almost certainly couldn't be an N example. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve4rosegrove Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 On 31/10/2020 at 19:03, hmrspaul said: Who What we knew as Alec Jackson couplings, but nothing to do with this model. Paul Although the nose of the wire part of the couplings is similar, I do not think that they are Alec Jackson couplings. There is not a horizontal loop / bar or curved 'lifter' in Alec's design as far as I know. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 1 hour ago, steve4rosegrove said: Although the nose of the wire part of the couplings is similar, I do not think that they are Alec Jackson couplings. There is not a horizontal loop / bar or curved 'lifter' in Alec's design as far as I know. i am aware of what is now called an Alec Jackson coupling, but that is what we called these in the 1960s. And it has absolutely nothing to do with mineral wagons or the source of this model. Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 14 hours ago, Enterprisingwestern said: But the OO version is? Mike. What is this question? I take a couple of photos of a wagon because someone found a body. I've boxes of bodies. Want to see the Playcraft 2 door, I can do that, the ERG rivetted 16t I can do that. But not after this reaction. Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Enterprisingwestern Posted November 2, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 2, 2020 23 hours ago, Enterprisingwestern said: But the OO version is? Mike. 8 hours ago, hmrspaul said: What is this question? I take a couple of photos of a wagon because someone found a body. I've boxes of bodies. Want to see the Playcraft 2 door, I can do that, the ERG rivetted 16t I can do that. But not after this reaction. Paul No need to get uppity Paul, I'm only asking if the OO version is more relevant to the current discussion. Apologies if it was phrased badly, that's the joy of the printed word. Mike. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernard Lamb Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 On 31/10/2020 at 22:38, Ian Smeeton said: The reason for asking, is that I have an urge to upset the rivet counters, by running a full train of unweathered, ex works consecutively numbered 16 T minerals on delivery from Linwood to wherever they went. The firs 10 have just landed on my workbench, courtesy of Stephen Harris. As they were built unfitted, I am guessing Double sided independent, but I would like confirmation, if possible. Regards, and thanks for the help. Ian Would a rake leaving the factory be consecutively numbered? My experience of how things are made leads me to think that there would be more than one production line and that completed wagons would not come from those lines exactly in sequence. Bernard 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwealleans Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 It might depend on the manufacturer, but I have a couple of photos from Charles Roberts showing painted LNER wagons being lettered and they are simply placed in a long line for the signwriters to work down. They are numbered sequentially. Presumably the plates were attached at the same time as the number was painted on? 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbo675 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 55 minutes ago, Bernard Lamb said: Would a rake leaving the factory be consecutively numbered? My experience of how things are made leads me to think that there would be more than one production line and that completed wagons would not come from those lines exactly in sequence. Bernard Steady on there Bernard, never mind the rivet counters, you will be upsetting those with Asperger's if you don't get the numbers in order !!! Gibbo. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RLBH Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 8 minutes ago, jwealleans said: It might depend on the manufacturer, but I have a couple of photos from Charles Roberts showing painted LNER wagons being lettered and they are simply placed in a long line for the signwriters to work down. They are numbered sequentially. Presumably the plates were attached at the same time as the number was painted on? I would imagine that in the case of multiple factories, one might be assigned numbers 1 to 1000, another numbers 1001 to 3000, and so forth. Any given factory would start making them in consecutive order, simply for administrative convenience, but you'd probably get the odd case where number 273 had to be sent back for rework so was completed out of order. But you'd quite probably wind up with number 1001, being the first produced by Factory B, being completed well before 1000, the last from Factory A. Unless of course you didn't, because Factory A had other priorities, or was on strike, or the contract was signed late, or any number of other things. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernard Lamb Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 2 minutes ago, Gibbo675 said: Steady on there Bernard, never mind the rivet counters, you will be upsetting those with Asperger's if you don't get the numbers in order !!! Gibbo. I was told to lay the table for tea and was given a tea set that was illustrated with pictures of UK castles. I laid it out geographically from N to S . A friend of my sister who was a special needs teacher thought that I would do it like that but it surprised my sister who knew I was a bit that way but not quite that extreme. In BR times in a private company I would expect there to be at least two lines. Any reject wagon would be taken out and if rectified sent for delivery. Let us say several in sequence with an odd one every now and again that has an earlier number. Some of the big car companies certainly worked like that. Re the point by jwealleans. I would have thought that would be a separate paint line rather than a complete production line. Bernard 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwealleans Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 4 minutes ago, Bernard Lamb said: I would have thought that would be a separate paint line rather than a complete production line. Sorry, I obviously wasn't clear enough - this was a separate paint line, not part of production. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbo675 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 4 minutes ago, Bernard Lamb said: I was told to lay the table for tea and was given a tea set that was illustrated with pictures of UK castles. I laid it out geographically from N to S . A friend of my sister who was a special needs teacher thought that I would do it like that but it surprised my sister who knew I was a bit that way but not quite that extreme. In BR times in a private company I would expect there to be at least two lines. Any reject wagon would be taken out and if rectified sent for delivery. Let us say several in sequence with an odd one every now and again that has an earlier number. Some of the big car companies certainly worked like that. Re the point by jwealleans. I would have thought that would be a separate paint line rather than a complete production line. Bernard Hi Bernard, As a child I used to eat my dinner in order so I know all about that kind of carry on. Although I've grown out of such I do still like a good ordered line up. Gibbo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Re6/6 Posted November 2, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 2, 2020 Another question! Were there ever any versions with 10ft wheelbase? I have a couple of Bachmann (Hong Kong) versions which are longer with a 10ft wheelbase. Would these be fictitious? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold JohnR Posted November 2, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 2, 2020 I think I'm right in saying that some early Bachmann wagons were actually based on the Mainline tooling, which was stretched to fit a 10ft chassis? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poor Old Bruce Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 21 minutes ago, Re6/6 said: Another question! Were there ever any versions with 10ft wheelbase? I have a couple of Bachmann (Hong Kong) versions which are longer with a 10ft wheelbase. Would these be fictitious? There were a small number of 10ft wb/17ft 6in Mins which were late-on conversions of redundant Palbrick wagons. It has all been covered previously in the thread. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 7 minutes ago, Poor Old Bruce said: There were a small number of 10ft wb/17ft 6in Mins which were late-on conversions of redundant Palbrick wagons. It has all been covered previously in the thread. To give some idea of how relatively rare the 10' wb ones were, there were 394 of the rebuilds (all without top doors), as opposed to 206,444 Diagram 108. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold JohnR Posted November 2, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 2, 2020 5 minutes ago, Fat Controller said: To give some idea of how relatively rare the 10' wb ones were, there were 394 of the rebuilds (all without top doors), as opposed to 206,444 Diagram 108. However, it appears that the longer wagon does have a top door? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 7 minutes ago, JohnR said: However, it appears that the longer wagon does have a top door? The model may do; the real things didn't. It's all part of manufacturers using the 'one size fits all' principle when it comes to underframes. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Re6/6 Posted November 2, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 2, 2020 Thanks all. They won't be used. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Metr0Land Posted November 2, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 2, 2020 Moses Gate, Bolton Sharnbrook West Hampstead Great Bridgeford 12 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnw1 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 46038 - 1977 Stainforth https://www.flickr.com/photos/pics-by-john/50500698693/in/dateposted-public/ 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 15 hours ago, Enterprisingwestern said: No need to get uppity Paul, I'm only asking if the OO version is more relevant to the current discussion. Apologies if it was phrased badly, that's the joy of the printed word. Mike. OF course there is. We were discussing a 4mm model that wasn't identified. I photographed a 4mm model which appears identical in all respects but still has the original frame. And I believe it is a Graham Farish one. If you look at their adverts from the 1950s you will see photos of them. The original poster was comparing the model with the Bachmann 4mm model wasn't he? I still have no understanding of what your comment was about. Paul 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now