nnich Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 An observation which begs a question. This year I've purchased 3 Hornby steam locos fitted with sound decoders. I have the Schools "St Pauls", a Castle - "Kidwelly Castle" and most recently the new A4 - "Sparrow Hawk" The Schools has a Loksound 3, the Castle has a 3.5 and the new A4 has a Loksound 4. Is there any method behind the selection of which version each loco gets, or you suppose it is just a matter of what is available when the batch of locos is manufactured? As a follow up does anyone know which version is fitted in the next most recent Hornby A4 - R2896XS the Green "Sir Ronald Matthews"? Norm Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowlander Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 Hi Norm The A4 "Sir Ronald Matthews" has the ESU V3.5 chip installed in it. Stephen Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady_Ava_Hay Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 This year I've purchased 3 Hornby steam locos fitted with sound decoders. The Schools has a Loksound 3, I doubt it. Loksound 3 became Loksound 3.5 a lot more than a year ago. The Loksound 3 is convertible to a Loksound 3.5 using a download which is still available on the Loksound website. It is possible that Hornby might be using supplies of older V3's upgraded Loksound 4 will load and play Loksound 3.5 projects. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nnich Posted June 16, 2011 Author Share Posted June 16, 2011 I doubt it. Loksound 3 became Loksound 3.5 a lot more than a year ago. The Loksound 3 is convertible to a Loksound 3.5 using a download which is still available on the Loksound website. It is possible that Hornby might be using supplies of older V3's upgraded Loksound 4 will load and play Loksound 3.5 projects. It puzzled me too because I thought v3.5 would have been the current version at the time of manufacture - but here is a quote from the mini booklet packaged with the Hornby Schools " The LokSound V3.0 decoder by ESU represents a key component of your newly acquired Schools class" It goes on to say "the LokSound V3.0 circuitry is responsible for all drive control functions as well as special functions of the Hornby Schools class" Contrast that with the booklet packaged with my next purchase - "Kidwelly Castle" - which mentions LokSound v3.5 I will add that the Schools sounds just as good as the others and includes three different whistles, injector and safety valves as well as a nice coast feature with some rod clank as well as wheel flange and rail joint noise. Still, as you say, it is possible its been upgraded to v3.5 software. I didn't realize that could be done. Is there any CV setting that would indicate the upgrade had been done? From what you say it also appears likely that the new A4 has a v3.5 project loaded onto a v4.0 chip. Thanks for the information Norm Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady_Ava_Hay Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 I didn't realize that could be done. Is there any CV setting that would indicate the upgrade had been done? Not AFAIK. I have no doubt though that a Lokprogrammer set to pick up the CV's would do so as you need to be in the right blank project for the decoder or it will give an error message. I don't recommend this by the way as linking a Lokprogrammer in this way is a bit dangerous and it only picks up the basic CV's anyway and none of the sound schedule. Push the wrong button and the project will be lost. I have never owned a Loksound 3 and I have owned Loksounds for about three years. The Early 3.5's were only 1 minute memory so all your Schools sounds would probably amount to more than that. Later versions of the 3.5 are two minutes and the latest V4 is about four minutes. A converted V3 would still be one minute. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold big jim Posted June 17, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 17, 2011 not a steam loco but bryan at howes Had a Hornby green 08 D3511, cat number R2977XS to reblow today and its fitted with a Lok4 decoder. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nnich Posted June 19, 2011 Author Share Posted June 19, 2011 not a steam loco but bryan at howes Had a Hornby green 08 D3511, cat number R2977XS to reblow today and its fitted with a Lok4 decoder. So it would seem that current (2011 catalog) Hornby sound locos have Lok4 decoders. This would support the theory that Hornby are fitting the most recent available at the time of manufacture but leaves the Schools class as an inexplicable deviation from that theory - perhaps the enclosed leaflet I quoted from at the beginning of this post was, in fact, in error Norm Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold big jim Posted June 20, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 20, 2011 another reply from bryan  The Hornby Schools no doubt  has a Lok3.5 fitted as this is a later sound model than the Duchess 08 Black 5 and A4 etc which all had Lok3.5 fitted, ESU refer to their decoders by generation ie Lok 3 and Lok4, if you look at the sound files for download on their website this becomes apparent, Lok 3.5 being an upgrade of their Generation 3 decoder. as ESU do the recordings and programming of Hornby sound locos they probably wrote the paperwork in the same way thus causing the confusion. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Hale Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 Hi, Forgive my stupidity but can the decoder in the Hornby 5MT be re-programmed with another loco's sounds? I bought a very cheap factory sound-fitted 5MT and would like to transfer the decoder into a Hornby Spamcan. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady_Ava_Hay Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 Hi, Forgive my stupidity but can the decoder in the Hornby 5MT be re-programmed with another loco's sounds? I bought a very cheap factory sound-fitted 5MT and would like to transfer the decoder into a Hornby Spamcan. Yes Tim it can. Factory fit decoders from Hornby are standard ESU. You can re-programme it without removing it from the loco if you wish to. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
paftrain Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 another reply from bryan  The Hornby Schools no doubt  has a Lok3.5 fitted as this is a later sound model than the Duchess 08 Black 5 and A4 etc which all had Lok3.5 fitted, ESU refer to their decoders by generation ie Lok 3 and Lok4, if you look at the sound files for download on their website this becomes apparent, Lok 3.5 being an upgrade of their Generation 3 decoder. as ESU do the recordings and programming of Hornby sound locos they probably wrote the paperwork in the same way thus causing the confusion. I have recently purchased a Hornby Schools with Sound. The sounds are really good, but only on DCC - although it also runs on DC, shouldn't the sounds, albeit limited, still work? I have many sound locos, but this is the only one that is silent on DC. Have I bought a faulty one? Paul. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady_Ava_Hay Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 I have recently purchased a Hornby Schools with Sound. The sounds are really good, but only on DCC - although it also runs on DC, shouldn't the sounds, albeit limited, still work? I have many sound locos, but this is the only one that is silent on DC. Have I bought a faulty one? Paul. Probably not. The Loksound can be disabled for DC sound. In any event the sounds available on DC are very limited and a bit of a waste of the resource and money. Usually DCC sound is the hook that sells DCC completely. It was certainly the principal reason for me.....plus running two locos on the same track.....and the slow running.....and the ability to control the loco and tweak its performance to suit my layout and driving style. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
paftrain Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 Probably not. The Loksound can be disabled for DC sound. In any event the sounds available on DC are very limited and a bit of a waste of the resource and money. Usually DCC sound is the hook that sells DCC completely. It was certainly the principal reason for me.....plus running two locos on the same track.....and the slow running.....and the ability to control the loco and tweak its performance to suit my layout and driving style. Thanks for the instant response! Yes, I'm familiar with the advantages of DCC as I have many DCC fitted and DCC Sound locos, but although we have DCC at our club, I still only have DC at home (because I've also still got many, many DC only Locos.) If Loksound can be disabled for DC sound, have you got any idea how it can be enabled again?. I have looked through the Loksound user manual, but all they say is you can also run on AC (?how many UK modellers use AC - I don't know any!) Regards, Paul. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold big jim Posted August 12, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 12, 2011 reply from bryan at howes....   I dont have the CV settings for the Hornby Schools sound loco  but looking at a couple of their previous steam sound settings I saved before reblowing them CV13 is value 0 which is DC sound  diasbled, based on the asumption that the Schools settings are probably the same, just change it to value 1 and hopefully this will do the trick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
paftrain Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 reply from bryan at howes....   I dont have the CV settings for the Hornby Schools sound loco  but looking at a couple of their previous steam sound settings I saved before reblowing them CV13 is value 0 which is DC sound  diasbled, based on the asumption that the Schools settings are probably the same, just change it to value 1 and hopefully this will do the trick Thanks, Bryan, I'll give it a try and let you know if it works, so others can use it if they're having the same problem. Paul. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
paftrain Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 Thanks, Bryan, I'll give it a try and let you know if it works, so others can use it if they're having the same problem. Paul. Hi Big Jim/Bryan, Success! Yes, thanks for the advice - I have at last plucked up the courage to connect my Schools up to my 'Sprog' and read CV13. Sure enough, it read '0', so I changed it to '1' and hey presto, sound on DC! When I checked my other Hornby sound locos (that all work ok on DC), they were all set to '1' on this CV, so it begs the question, why did Hornby set this one differently? Anyway, thanks again, Paul. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark 37 Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 Hello, I have a question about Black 5 sound decoders (sorry to jump in here). I hoped to get one of the Pete Waterman locos being sold off by a liverpool retailer and adding a black 5 sound chip to it. This would work out cheaper than buying a Hornby ready loaded loco. Unfortunately I am too late (sold out), so I've searched for an alternative, but on researching decoders, the sounds are from archive material and in some instances quoted as taken from gineric sounds. Is there a true recording of a Black 5? I loathe the thought of paying in excess of £200 for gineric sounds. Best regards, Mark Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowlander Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 Hello Mark I can only speak from experience here. I know Howes sounds for steam are not all genetic and they do try to record the actual loco if it is on the mainline. I've got Bryan from Howes Black 5 sound chip fitted to my model, and everybody who has heard it thinks that it is spot on, and miles better than the actual Hornby sound black 5. Big Jim will most likely have a posting of one on You tube. If you coming upto the Ayr Modelrail exhibition in two weeks time I can let you hear it there. Regards Stephen Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark 37 Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 Stephen, I hope to be there, but the wifes the size of a beached whale (expecting our second) and drivings becoming a problem. Unfortunately I don't drive and public trasport is out of the question due to helth issues. I'm working still working on it. Please bring the loco if it's not in your normal running session. Best regards, Mark Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady_Ava_Hay Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 Hello, I have a question about Black 5 sound decoders (sorry to jump in here). I hoped to get one of the Pete Waterman locos being sold off by a liverpool retailer and adding a black 5 sound chip to it. This would work out cheaper than buying a Hornby ready loaded loco. Unfortunately I am too late (sold out), so I've searched for an alternative, but on researching decoders, the sounds are from archive material and in some instances quoted as taken from gineric sounds. Is there a true recording of a Black 5? I loathe the thought of paying in excess of £200 for gineric sounds. Best regards, Mark Steam loco sounds in general don't suffer too much from being generic in origin. It is more important to ensure that the whistle is genuine and that the sound project contains sufficient well recorded sounds to enable good prototypical acceleration, coasting and general hisses and clanks in appropriate places. Howes projects are generally well received and are generally reckoned by those that have heard them to be better than the Hornby offerings. Then again the Hornby Black 5 project has taken the Hornby sound to a new level and all these modern projects need quite a lot of experience to get the best from. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 I have recently purchased a Hornby Schools with Sound. The sounds are really good, but only on DCC - although it also runs on DC, shouldn't the sounds, albeit limited, still work? I have many sound locos, but this is the only one that is silent on DC. Have I bought a faulty one? Paul. When I got my "sound on board" Black 5, just for a laugh I tried it on DC. I didn't touch any CVs. The sound was there - after a fashion. It sounded awful, something like those Lloyds "stereos" you used to get from Woolies in the 70s. I remember my parents buying one with the only criteria that it be loud. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark 37 Posted September 7, 2011 Share Posted September 7, 2011 Stephen, I had a look at Howes, out of stock for the moment. I am wondering if it will be really worth it (trying to watch spending because new baby on the way). I'm strugling to find a Black 5 under £100. By the time I add the decoder and factor in post I could be looking at around £250 in total. I have thought about buying pre loaded and getting it re-blown, but it's around the same price if not a few ££££'s more. I'd really like this to come in around the £180 price bracket. Does anyone know of any retailers that fit the bill as the reblow would be much more appealing. I did find a video with Howes recordings and it does sound rather good. For the record this wil be the only steamer on our layout. For anyone interested. I phoned SWD and they have recorded a Black 5 and hope to have it in production for November. Best regards, Mark Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark 37 Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 Well after days of searching and putting 5 orders in to have them refunded (what's with online sites saying 1 in stock when there are none), I've found one for £190. Once we have heard it on our track we will see if it needs reblown by Howes (it would be nice). Best regards, Mark Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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