darren01 Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 HI all I was just looking at some wagons and i am sorry but how can they sell this wagon for this price, even with shop knocking some cash off ,it's still a lot more than a Bachmann one! , I know who i would buy my one from! Hornby OO R6504 BR 21 Ton Iron Ore Tippler - Pre-TOPS RRP : £16.50 OUR PRICE : £12.95 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 I can't tell much from the picture. The last Hornby mineral wagon I bought had their naff underframe from the 80's. On the other hand the recent horsebox is exquisite (with full brake gear) and cost about the same as the tippler. Bachmann's underframe detail is very sparse. Depends on what's important to you I guess. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
(The) Youth Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 £9 from hattons I seem to remember it had a different body to the Bachmann one - (possibly 27t vs bachmanns 26t?) HTH Simon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jim s-w Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 Nearly £25 for the 4 wheelcrane not changed since the 1970's? No thanks Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 7013 Posted August 10, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 10, 2011 Buy a load of cheap S/H ones, weather heavily and put in a rake filled with ore, no-one will be bothered. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigwelsh Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 I can't tell much from the picture. The last Hornby mineral wagon I bought had their naff underframe from the 80's. On the other hand the recent horsebox is exquisite (with full brake gear) and cost about the same as the tippler. Bachmann's underframe detail is very sparse. Depends on what's important to you I guess. John Suggest you look at the recent Bachmann LNER vans which even have the safety loops fitted. These area really detailed enough for a RTR 'rake' wagon. A horsebox like the previous BY and Shark brake van are more one or very few purchases and you expect a bit more bits on these. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium spamcan61 Posted August 10, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 10, 2011 Even the list price of that mineral wagon seems to be in doubt:- http://www.modelrailwaysdirect.co.uk/Hornby-R6504-BR-21-Ton-Iron-Ore-Wagon/ As discussed here extensively since Hornby's 2011 price list was released, some of the list prices make little sense, although given the quality of recent Hornby releases it can be argued in some cases that Hornby offer an even finer detailed model than Bachmann, but at a significantly higher price. EDIT Even Hornby's website has them for 'only' 10 quid (presumably list price), so I'm not sure what Rails are playing at with their pricing. EDIT2 I'm wondering if this is one of the items where Hornby reduced the RRP a few months back. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigwelsh Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 EDIT2 I'm wondering if this is one of the items where Hornby reduced the RRP a few months back. It was.. Though my comments are based on £9 for a box on wheels which should be seen in rakes and I think the £2 more than the Bachmann one is noticeable unless you really want that particular diagram of Iron Ore wagon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 Suggest you look at the recent Bachmann LNER vans which even have the safety loops fitted. These area really detailed enough for a RTR 'rake' wagon. I had a look at the pictures on Hatton's website. I agree that the LNER van (8.00) appears to have very fine underframe detail - never seen that before. Vive la competition! (Hattons price for the tippler is 9.00) John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennine MC Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 Previous thread, just a month ago... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium spamcan61 Posted August 10, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 10, 2011 It was.. Though my comments are based on £9 for a box on wheels which should be seen in rakes and I think the £2 more than the Bachmann one is noticeable unless you really want that particular diagram of Iron Ore wagon. Right, looks like Rails are still displaying the original RRP then whereas others are displaying the 'adjusted' one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
neal Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 I mentioned the price to my local stockist who had them on for £14.99. They checked the Hornby website to find the RRP had dropped to £9.99. They took the stock from the shelves subject to confirmation that they would be credited by Hornby for selling at the reduced RRP. I would expect them to re-appear near the Hattons price! Seems odd that Hornby communicate/coordinate so badly with their retailers! N Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium spamcan61 Posted August 11, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 11, 2011 Seems odd that Hornby communicate/coordinate so badly with their retailers! N Indeed, although I'd hope a retailer would know how much they'd paid for the item - OK maybe a bit tricky if they carry the entire Hornby range. I couldn't find a pdf price list on the Hornby website which was a tad surprising. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted August 11, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 11, 2011 I mentioned the price to my local stockist who had them on for £14.99. They checked the Hornby website to find the RRP had dropped to £9.99. They took the stock from the shelves subject to confirmation that they would be credited by Hornby for selling at the reduced RRP. I would expect them to re-appear near the Hattons price! Seems odd that Hornby communicate/coordinate so badly with their retailers! N I didn't realise they were about yet although on checking the Hornby website it definitely implies that they are now available; has anybody had a chance of a look at one yet? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennine MC Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 I didn't realise they were about yet although on checking the Hornby website it definitely implies that they are now available; has anybody had a chance of a look at one yet? Still very curious whether it's a high or low body... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
markburley Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 The RRP was amended by Hornby about a month ago to £9.99. Hornby informed all retailers via their reps. Several other items were also reduced at the same time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
45568 Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 Still very curious whether it's a high or low body... Pix up on the Hatton's site!(R6504). It may just be me but the position and font of the lettering look very wrong. Nothing like Bachmann or any of my transfers, Modelmaster or even Woodhead. Mmmmmm? Any input from those with more knowledge appreciated! Cheers, Peter C. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennine MC Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 Pix up on the Hatton's site!(R6504). Yeah, it's still hard to tell without any surrounding reference, and I certainly wouldnt trust the number to indicate which it is. It may just be me but the position and font of the lettering look very wrong. Nothing like Bachmann or any of my transfers, Modelmaster or even Woodhead It's difficult to be prescriptive Peter, many of these wagons were hand lettered or stencilled even in the 1960s. The position of the branding isnt wrong, it could appear anywhere in that middle panel, although central and lower positions were probably more common. I think I know what you mean though, it doesnt look as instantly 'right' as most Bachmann wagon lettering does. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigwelsh Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 The little gussets on the sides are a bit odd squared off when they are normally little triangles.. I'd agree the lettering organisation on this one isn't a set of features i'd recognize as representing the larger amount of prints I have. Modelmaster transfers aren't usually a good guide though, the ones I have feature some dubious choices of font compared to Fox. They have released some better back of late though in terms of thickness and these possibly have better fonts and layouts too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 46444 Posted August 11, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 11, 2011 It may just be me but the position and font of the lettering look very wrong. Nothing like Bachmann or any of my transfers, Modelmaster or even Woodhead. Mmmmmm? Any input from those with more knowledge appreciated! Cheers, Peter C. Hi Peter, Think Pennine may be right on this one. The typeface of the lettering certainly varied, and yes if you look at various transfer sheets then there is clearly a difference in typeface. The Hornby version has one particular style, compared to the Bachmann version which looks as if it's finished in ex-works condition. Looking at Paul Bartlett's site the wagons show a few variations though most of these photos stem from the 1970's and show wagons which have been modified. Here's the the link: :http://paulbartlett....43d37c#h6c388e9 Looking at the Hatton's pictures it looks as if it's 'horses for courses' on whether you chose between the Bachmann or Hornby version. Cheers, Mark Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NINJA Posted August 12, 2011 Share Posted August 12, 2011 When you look at the current prices Hornby are charging for their Steam and Diesel locos it makes the limited edition models that a lot of retailers have commisioned from Bachmann, Heljan and Dapol look not so dear after all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
45568 Posted August 13, 2011 Share Posted August 13, 2011 Thanks Ian, Craig & Mark for your thoughts. Looking more closely at the Hatton's pix, the model seems to capture the heavier axle boxes used on later? builds, and the tie bar and brake gear look good too. Still not convinced over the lettering, but one may make it's way into my next order for home comparison to Bachy and home-builds. Cheers, Peter C. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennine MC Posted August 13, 2011 Share Posted August 13, 2011 Though my comments are based on £9 for a box on wheels which should be seen in rakes and I think the £2 more than the Bachmann one is noticeable unless you really want that particular diagram of Iron Ore wagon. The difference is less than that Craig, it's actually £1.24 even at RRP, and obviously discounting would also reduce that slightly. My feeling is that it's worth that to get the correct and distinctive brakegear, rather than the simple 16 tonner arrangement on the Bachy. You're still limited to the one type of axlebox of course but that said, my projected IOT fleet will in any case be made up of bodies from Parkside, old Hornby, Bachy and even MTK, with assorted kitbuilt underpinnings. Having got one today from 53A for 'evaluation', I have to say that the wagon as a whole leaves me with an impression of adequacy rather than brilliance. I'd mentioned body height before, the obvious thing for them to do would have been the low body version, partly because it was much more common but also because it'd have been different from the Bachmann. But oh noooo, it's a high one. Meh The top capping is a tad overthick though, so I could probably do what I did to a Bachmann one - file it down a few mill to make it into a low one, and restore it with plastic strip The little gussets on the sides are a bit odd squared off when they are normally little triangles.. Yeah, whilst that's hardly a showstopper and can be rectified with a few minutes with the knife, I do find it faintly incredible that Hornby have still managed to get two things wrong on what must be one of the simplest wagon bodies in railway history. Another peculiar feature is the vestigial vac pipe, which runs under the chassis, even crosses over and sprouts up at the headstock Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigwelsh Posted August 14, 2011 Share Posted August 14, 2011 The difference is less than that Craig, it's actually £1.24 even at RRP, and obviously discounting would also reduce that slightly. I based £2 on Hattons - Bachmann £7 (£6.50 if you buy 4) and Hornby £9. Rails haven't updated their Hornby price from £12.95 yet while Bachmann is £6.95. My local, Waltons of Altrincham is quoting £7.25 Bachmann and £13.99 Hornby (added to the catalogue 13th aug rrp £16.49). I wonder if some retailers aren't convinced about the rrp decrease yet! I did wonder if the top reinforcement was a bit thick. I've noticed it doesnt have a lever guard stay either, a staple feature of modern Bachmann. I agree you'd think a simple box would be perfect.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenny Emily Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 I got one of these the other day. Modelzone had them on the shelves for £16.50! However they did bring it down to £9 to price match with Hattons. It's a good model, though would benefit greatly with a heavy weathering. Certainly finer than the Bachmann tipplers. I too noticed the brake pipe snaking across the underframe. I wonder whether this hints at future livery/numbering possibilities for release. Would this particular style have appeared as vacuum fitted or piped? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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