OKWB - Cambrian Timber Bolster (was A Pretty Pair)

[craigwelsh]

The ingenious use of the fold back to get the inner solebar vertical was not really required as the solebar is held vertical by the fold-around ends of the headstock. I don't think any attempt at prototype thickness of the solebar is being attempted here.

 

I'm not sure about the coupling plate. Always difficult and even with a GW rivet press they were never going to punch out easily. To my eye they went on straight and I didn't find their attachment too difficult. Perhaps a half-etched part with the rivets etched? I'm not so sure.

Prototype wooden solebars are about 5" thick which would need bent etch to do really. I think its the nuts ticking outwards on a solebar so the 1/2 etch can look better than punching.

 

1/2 etch drawgear plates are undersize unfortunately unless you use 0.5mm material.

 

 

Roxey might be a source of shackles at S4um. For the loop that fits on the wires in the bolster i'd use spare loops off the Masokits screw link etch, its what I used on my MRJ double bolster and went on nicely. Chain needs to be something a bit larger than the Slaters 'small' size.

 

I hasn't worked out what the pattern was on the end of the floor boards until you made more of the kit up, I now see its an attempt at wood grain though a bit of coarse sanding and paint would probably be better in 4mm.

 

You'll probably have to file a flat into the axlebox behind the front face for the spring to sit behind, this happens with a lot of oil axleboxes I use too. Its possible the grease boxes and springs are from different suppliers. Note that springs don't fit flush to the axleguards on the prototype, there is normally a slight gap.

 

I'd agree i've not seen any howlers in the Dragon range and apart from debating some of the design decisions anyone with a bit of practice should be able to produce a nice unique wagon from one of the kits.

[mike morley]

I bought a pair of these at Railex when they first came out and was also frustrated by the quality of the brass, which I ended up suspecting is too soft a grade.

 

One of mine was also seriously over-etched. I didnt dare deepen any fold lines as it was 50/50 whether something would fold or snap off as it was.

[Kenton]

I hasn't worked out what the pattern was on the end of the floor boards until you made more of the kit up, I now see its an attempt at wood grain though a bit of coarse sanding and paint would probably be better in 4mm.

It will always look what it is to me - a bent edge of metal.

 

Although I really do not like mixed media kits, I could not help wondering as the kit was built if there was scope to use real wood to make up the platform of a bolster wagon?

 

Thanks for the suggested work around for the axlebox. I think I may extend the hole and file a notch in the back to sit over the correctly folded keep plates. Soldering the springs to the underside edge of the solebar rather than the face of the W-iron would be more correct but far more difficult and fragile. Keeping the clearance for the rocking unit would also be more of a challenge.

 

I'll see how it goes on No 2 as I now have a beter idea of what parts need to be tinned in advance.

[billbedford]

Despite being new the brass was in a very poor state when removed from the packaging being very dull and corroded. Considering this is a new kit from the manufacturer and being used to a better quality brass I have to admit some disappointment from the start. The brass required a great deal of scouring with wire wool, wet and dry paper and Cif cleaner to place it in a state suitable for soldering.

The second kit was no better and I wonder if it is simply a lower grade of brass being used?

Unless the brass was green it was unlikely to have been corroded. This sounds like normal atmospheric tarnish. It can be remove quickly with a bright dip - either a §§commercial limescale remover, or a saturated solution of salt in vinegar if you din't like chemicals.

[Kenton]

Unless the brass was green it was unlikely to have been corroded. This sounds like normal atmospheric tarnish. It can be remove quickly with a bright dip - either a §§commercial limescale remover, or a saturated solution of salt in vinegar if you din't like chemicals.

No it wasn't green - that image gives a pretty good idea of what it looked like selotape and all.

 

It most certainly didn't budge with limescale remover (I tried) along with Cif scrub, and a phosphoric acid dip. I didn't try salt in vinegar (a chemical I don't particularly like - even on chips)

 

It required aggressive attack with abrasives and even then refused to glimmer in the same way that other kits from the same supplier and others usually do.

 

Looking at the model now following building, a dip in the ultrasonic bath and acid neutraliser it has rapidly gone dull and tarnished as if the flux had not been cleaned away.

 

It is not that it is unworkable as you see, more of having to do more prep work than really needed, letting the kit down.

[Donw]

Have you spoken to Chris Basten?

Don

[Siberian Snooper]

[12] Two wagon label plates were added to the solebars, one either side of the V-hangers. The four buffers were then attached to the pre-tinned headstocks using 70° solder from the inside of the wagon. This required removal of the wheelsets to gain access and would have been easier if done earlier. I would have preferred sprung buffers but these castings were of fine quality. The wagon was now nearly complete. All that remains are to generate some resemblance of shackles - your guess is as good as mine - as all atempts so far have ended in the bin. I think much thinner wire is required and some insight. The other item is of course the coupling hooks which will have to wait until after Saturday at least. But other than the basic brake gear, the upside-down axleboxes (which if wagon 2 finds a solution may get removed and reworked), and those keeper plates turns out to be a very straightforward build and certainly within reach of a beginner. A nice little kit, not without room for improvement, but nothing devastating.

 

I bought some shackles from 51L models a few years ago. Just had a shufftie on the wizard site, hers the link.

 

http://www.wizardmodels.co.uk/FrameSetShop.php?DM=wizabout

 

Cheers SS

[Kenton]

Have you spoken to Chris Basten?

Don

Not since Wells when purchasing the kits.

[Kenton]

 

I bought some shackles from 51L models a few years ago. Just had a shufftie on the wizard site, hers the link.

 

http://www.wizardmod...php?DM=wizabout

 

Cheers SS

It is a shame there is no photo on the web site (the one shown is not of the correct design and would not fit) The other shame is that Wizard were at S4um and although I was there having a dig around for other items Shackles were not on my mind.

 

I think I am going to have to experiment withe wire and imagination.

[Kenton]

[13] As indicated previously a serious flaw in this kit is the total absence of coupling hooks.

 

Finding suitable hooks to fit the supplied coupling plate slot from an alternative source was not easy and was relatively expensive compared to having them included on the fret.

 

Of the known suppliers a couple of purchases at S4um were made yesterday to try out:

 

The sprung Romford 3-link couplings were far too big to fit the slot and even with a filed down shaft remained so. To get these to fit would require filing down to less than the diameter of the hole for the split pin and thinning the lamination to at least half thickness. But they were a nice product.

 

The Exactoscale product was slightly more expensive with the requirement to make up the 3-link which are purchased separately and the unit is unsprung, not that I am seeking that refinement. Just a simple hook alone would have been good enough. It again is far too thick to fit the slot. However, with some pretty aggressive filing and probably far too much force they can be pushed though and soldered from behind the headstock.

 

The shaft needed to be shortened on the rocking W-iron unit's side to prevent fouling. But really does look the part and is a good solution. Now all I need to do is find a microscope to connect the links.

[Kenton]

probably far too much force

Yep definitely too much rough handling  - as I've just spotted the other horse loop has snapped out of its half etch - more drilling required.

It makes me doubt if I really want to go through this all again on No 2.

[jamieb]

Hi Kenton

 

I built one of these a couple of months ago and encountered similar problems to you.The brass on mine was OK , although Mike Morley bought 2 at the same time, both of which were of lesser quality.Obviously I was lucky.

 

I found the double laminate solebars to be a good idea in principle, but the advantage of the 60 degree bend to position the inner was outweighed by having to sweat the outer layer onto a partially assembled body.I did one side the intended way and the other side by laminating first and then using the tab and slot.A better method would be if the inner solebar had an etched leg at each end which could be bent inwards for alignment once the double laminate was attached

 

As already noted, the axleboxes are too wide and I had to file about 1mm off of the back to sit over the springs.When attaching the bolster, I found it easier to make the whole lot removable by drilling a hole straight through the wagon floor to take the wire and then fixing the raised timbers to the floor and running the pivot wire all the way throgh bolster and floor, securing underneath with a sliver of plastic tube or a romford crankpin.This enabled the bolster to be removed for painting.As you say, the lack of coupling hooks is a serious omission,I used Roxey etched hooks which fit nicely.Although they're not shown on the photo,I managed to make chains by robbing the wifes jewellery box!

 

Photo attached prior to painting in Cambrian livery

[Kenton]

When attaching the bolster, I found it easier to make the whole lot removable by drilling a hole straight through the wagon floor to take the wire and then fixing the raised timbers to the floor and running the pivot wire all the way through bolster and floor, securing underneath with a sliver of plastic tube or a romford crankpin.This enabled the bolster to be removed for painting.

Ah, yes, er um, painting the bolster ...

 

Nice clean model there and it is faintly reassuring that similar problems were encountered.

[Enterprisingwestern]

No it wasn't green - that image gives a pretty good idea of what it looked like selotape and all.

 

It most certainly didn't budge with limescale remover (I tried) along with Cif scrub, and a phosphoric acid dip. I didn't try salt in vinegar (a chemical I don't particularly like - even on chips)

 

It required aggressive attack with abrasives and even then refused to glimmer in the same way that other kits from the same supplier and others usually do.

 

Looking at the model now following building, a dip in the ultrasonic bath and acid neutraliser it has rapidly gone dull and tarnished as if the flux had not been cleaned away.

 

It is not that it is unworkable as you see, more of having to do more prep work than really needed, letting the kit down.

 

Try brown sauce, honestly, you'll be amazed.

[Simond]

Coke....

 

The brown sweet fizzy drink, rather than anything white & powdery.

 

Can't imagine why it would be better than phosphoric acid dip, but it doesn't half bring old coppers up bright.

 

Despite demonstrating this to the offspring, they still drink it!

[Quarryscapes]

I know this is a something of a return from the grave but I was very glad to see this thread! Looks like these are the better of the Cambrian kits from Dragon, might give a pair a go with the usual recourse of proper Cambrian buffers and axleboxes. 

[Simond]

I hadn't actually seen the date - ah well!

 

S

[Kenton]

&bsp;

I hadn't actually seen the date - ah well!

 

A real rave from the grave and long gone (but still available from Dragon AFAIK - I rather like his kits, instructions well up for the job.) Not been doing much on 4mm of late - everyone going for 7mm, probaly just the current fashion. Quite surprised to see this in the inbox, good to know the search engine still works.