RMweb Gold chriswright03 Posted November 29, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 29, 2011 It looks like the NIMBYS will win again! http://www.ifw-net.com/freightpubs/ifw/article.htm?artid=20017921377&src=rss I would expect these are the same people who will be complaining about the amount of lorries on the road. Council seem to be up for it but I suspect the prospect of new jobs and money coming into the area will not be sufficient to win the day. More bad press here as increased trains through Lincoln cause mayhem at the level crossing once more. I know this has been discussed before on here but the traffic does not have to use the High Street as there are roads that go over the line either side. Seems like Lincolnshire folk (or some of them) have no time for the rail industry. Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catkins Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 Lincoln High Street is dying on its feet, the shops look run down - St. Marks Station is a busy "Out of Town" retail park, with car parking and large names. Any shopper who wishes to go along the high street doesn't have to wait for ever whilst the barriers are down, although there was a footbridge at the High Street crossing once. The only roads that bridge the line, are Pelham Bridge to the immediate east of Lincoln Station, and Brayford Way to the west of Brayford Wharf. http://maps.google.c...ps?hl=en&tab=wl The proposed Railfreight terminal at Deeping Saint Nicholas could be sited in a very good location, but I have to ask what the terminal would be used for? There is no freight that originates from that area of the county, Boston Docks is served by trains that go through Sleaford, and with out a run round wouldn't be able to go to the terminal (not that there would be any economic need) and most of the other freight is oil from the Humber to Nottingham, sand from Norfolk to Doncaster, and containers from the Yorkshires to Felistowe / Southampton. EDIT - The people who live in that area, and will mostly be affected are already employed, and the thought of new jobs will not be uppermost in their minds, what they will not want is the 'disruption' that the terminal will bring. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 There is no freight that originates from that area of the county, Boston Docks is served by trains that go through Sleaford, and with out a run round wouldn't be able to go to the terminal (not that there would be any economic need) and most of the other freight is oil from the Humber to Nottingham, sand from Norfolk to Doncaster, and containers from the Yorkshires to Felistowe / Southampton. EDIT - The people who live in that area, and will mostly be affected are already employed, and the thought of new jobs will not be uppermost in their minds, what they will not want is the 'disruption' that the terminal will bring. I did a quick Google and came up with http://www.sholland.gov.uk/news/archive/over6months/internationalfoodhub.htm Spalding is central to vast production of field vegetables as well as flower bulbs. This is an international trade, with large quantities also imported from continental Europe and repacked for distribution to Supermarkets. With the supermarkets becoming increasingly aware of air and road miles they may be interested in having both the local and imported produce sent out by rail, as well as the imports being railed in. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spalding,_Lincolnshire Paul Bartlett Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Webbo Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 Lincoln High Street is dying on its feet, the shops look run down - St. Marks Station is a busy "Out of Town" retail park, with car parking and large names. Any shopper who wishes to go along the high street doesn't have to wait for ever whilst the barriers are down, although there was a footbridge at the High Street crossing once. The only roads that bridge the line, are Pelham Bridge to the immediate east of Lincoln Station, and Brayford Way to the west of Brayford Wharf. http://maps.google.c...ps?hl=en&tab=wl The proposed Railfreight terminal at Deeping Saint Nicholas could be sited in a very good location, but I have to ask what the terminal would be used for? There is no freight that originates from that area of the county, Boston Docks is served by trains that go through Sleaford, and with out a run round wouldn't be able to go to the terminal (not that there would be any economic need) and most of the other freight is oil from the Humber to Nottingham, sand from Norfolk to Doncaster, and containers from the Yorkshires to Felistowe / Southampton. EDIT - The people who live in that area, and will mostly be affected are already employed, and the thought of new jobs will not be uppermost in their minds, what they will not want is the 'disruption' that the terminal will bring. Catkins, With regard to this, you only have to stand (in a layby) on the A16 south of Spalding and count the number of 44tonners going to the south daily, delivering fresh, chilled or frozen veg, also the flower traffic in season, and returning north. The catchment area for all this traffic is the Boston areas and Holbeach areas as well as Spalding. There is also a wealth of foreign lorries delivering into same the areas from the south, and returning south fully loaded. The new road (A16 Cowbit/Crowland bypass they have just finished, removed the problems with the A1073) is just coping with the traffic, a lot of the truckers didn't use the A1073 as it was a bit unnerving to say the least, they are now using the new Cowbit/Crowland bypass. It's not only going help the job situation (Lincolnshire has one of the most number of unemployed people in the country), it is also going to help the enviroment. Just imagine at least 150 44tonners daily, what impact there is on the road surface, excess diesel fumes and the conjestion. The "NOT IN MY BACKYARD" people do not consider others, the whole concept of the distribution centre could be the start of a regeneration of the whole area. Webbo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete_mcfarlane Posted November 30, 2011 Share Posted November 30, 2011 I'm confused by the NIMBY references - the link posted to talks about their arguments for halting the project being rejected by the council. So it's going ahead, and seems to be a very good idea. I just hope the joint line is up to all the extra traffic. Jocelyn Kedzlie, from campaign group Rally Against Industrialisation of our Landscape Aren't they about 250 years too late to be complaining about industrialisation of the British landscape? The Lincoln wingefest seems to be the usual small businessman's rant about how the rest of the World doesn't revolve around them. Matt Corrigan, chief executive of Lincoln Business Improvement Group, said the timing of the rail engineering work was wrong."The frustrating thing is that they are doing this routine maintenance work now, not after Christmas, when things are a lot quieter" he said. "It is not as if they are having to do emergency repairs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ess1uk Posted December 1, 2011 Share Posted December 1, 2011 If it gets some of the trucks off the roads round here then great. Shame the cowbit bypass is built on the march to spading trackbed. Still be the same number of trucks on a14 though Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold chriswright03 Posted December 1, 2011 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted December 1, 2011 I'm confused by the NIMBY references - the link posted to talks about their arguments for halting the project being rejected by the council. So it's going ahead, and seems to be a very good idea. I just hope the joint line is up to all the extra traffic. Pete this bit about them going to the Ombudsman. They did say on local radio that they intend to continue to fight so I guess that is the Ombudsman bit. As others have said there is a lot of agricultural transport in the area and it would make sense to take that off the roads via a hub. As regards the traffic in Lincoln High Street well that can be avoided and there is even talk of putting a footbridge back as now Network Rail are saying that it does not have to cater for the disabled with it. I suppose it is a case of cannot keep everyone happy all of the time but when it is something that can take a considerable amount of heavy lorries off the roads I would have expected there to be quite a bit of support rather than the not in my back yard attitude. Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwin_m Posted December 1, 2011 Share Posted December 1, 2011 Part of the problem is that while there are fewer heavy lorries overall, there will be about the same number leaving the farms and more of them around the terminal! Each farm will fill about the same number of lorries per day but instead of going to a distribution centre in somewhere like Daventry they will all go to this terminal instead. So the A14 benefits (and, err, they've just decided to enhance that!) but Lincolnshire less so. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
37079 Posted December 3, 2011 Share Posted December 3, 2011 I understand that the High Street Crossing in Lincoln will go as part of the Joint Line upgrade. This will allow the reinstatement of a footbridge which was removed due to being foul of the crossing barriers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CUTLER2579 Posted December 4, 2011 Share Posted December 4, 2011 Catkins,are you saying there is little unemployment in Lincolnshire? I would have thought that anything that was creating worthwhile long term employment in the Area would have been welcomed by all ,except of course existing employers who would need to pay the going rate for staff instead of the minimum wage and have reasonable working conditions. I can see that would crucify some employers in the Area. Regards,Yellow Belly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catkins Posted December 4, 2011 Share Posted December 4, 2011 Catkins,are you saying there is little unemployment in Lincolnshire? I would have thought that anything that was creating worthwhile long term employment in the Area would have been welcomed by all ,except of course existing employers who would need to pay the going rate for staff instead of the minimum wage and have reasonable working conditions. I can see that would crucify some employers in the Area. Regards,Yellow Belly. I can't see where you get that view from, I have not said that there is little unemployment, but those people (the NIMBY element) that will be affected are those that already have some employment. I am well aware that there is unemployment in Lincolnshire, but it is in the places like Grantham where the majority of potential workers will be - trust me on that one, I've seen the job centre here - and much as though the jobcentre say that it is reasonable to travel an hour to get to work, add that hour on to an eight hour shift in winter. And just because a new employer arrives in the area, it does not mean the other employers will change their pay or conditions, after all the people i did work for have their head office in London, and they will set the terms and conditions to suit themselves. (and I know that there are rumours of an ASDA warehouse being built on Spittalgate level, but they are old rumours). The other thing with any employer in Rural Lincolnshire is that they can pay the local average wage, and they will get staff - most likely from an agency. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CUTLER2579 Posted December 4, 2011 Share Posted December 4, 2011 EDIT - The people who live in that area, and will mostly be affected are already employed, and the thought of new jobs will not be uppermost in their minds, what they will not want is the 'disruption' that the terminal will bring. The point I was making was that even in the Deepings there is quite high unemployment and yet you seemed to have a different view point to me on that. I agree with your comments regarding travel on top of an 8 hour day. In fact when a certain courier firm based in Grantham closed its branch,it offered drivers and other staff the oppurtunity to work from its branch in Peterborough City. A few have taken up this offer and Drivers on top of an 11 hour average working day, have close on a couple of hours travelling to get too and from work.I also agree wholeheartedly with you regarding Agency Staff being the largest number of people being employed in this area,as well as many others. I also fear that the Asda myth will follow the one regarding a Swiss company locating on Triangle Bussiness Park that was floating around several years ago. A local authority with a bit more drive may well have attracted jobs to the town and got a By-pass for the town. However nothing much changes as the Mars Group wanted to locate their Petfood Company here in 1946 because of the great Road and Rail access,but the Local Employers and Councillers soon scuppered those plans and the company as I am sure you will know located in Melton Mowbray and bought very well paid jobs to that area until the present day (65 years). Kindest Regards,Yellow Belly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catkins Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 I also fear that the Asda myth will follow the one regarding a Swiss company locating on Triangle Bussiness Park that was floating around several years ago. Kindest Regards,Yellow Belly. Having worked for a food distribution company that is very close to the A1 at Gonerby Moor, I have heard the rumors about a company locating on the Triangle - Initially they wanted to take the whole site from the old A1 right through to the current A1 with a rail siding but the local authority said no, so the company relocated to South Yorkshire, but they have opened a smaller facility on the site, but it is not a hive of activity. If the ASDA warehouse did come to town at the site that the rumors are suggesting, then there will still be a lot of road movements, but we might see Intermodals in Grantham - or an alternative is that whoever is promotting the terminal near Splading might push for a warehousing estate and rail sidings. I can hear the NIMBYs quaking from here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 Don't forget that the packing plants in the area don't just deal with local produce, but with imported stuff as well; this is one of the key target areas for DBS and GBRf, the latter already having launched a Spain/Barking service. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mike Bellamy Posted December 5, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 5, 2011 Interesting that Catkins and Cutler both mention Asda as there is another Grantham connection with them and in a way with me as well. My father, John Bellamy ran a plumbing business in Grantham and his first employee in the early 1960s was Terry Bond - later Terry's son Andy went on to become the Chief Executive of Asda. Lots of Google references to his decision last year to stand down as CEO. I wonder how many of the Asda staff in Grantham would have recognised him if he walked into their store. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_James_Bond You mention Petfoods - had a vist there with the Scouts in the early 1970s - toured the factory and the highlight was seeing the Production Manager eating various samples of cat and dog food we had collected off the production lines He said he was happy to do that as he knew exactly what had gone into the product unlike many foods for human consumption Off course Grantham did get the canning factory on the site of the loco shed. Sorry for drifting away from the original Spalding topic Mike Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ess1uk Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 So where exactly is it going? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mike Bellamy Posted December 5, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 5, 2011 So where exactly is it going? The proposed Railfreight terminal at Deeping Saint Nicholas could be sited in a very good location . . . . . . . . Looks like that puts it at the side of the A16 using the Peterborough to Spalding line. Mike Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ess1uk Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 so by the level crossing at Littleworth station? it's not the A16 any more though, the new road is now called that now it has finally opened. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mike Bellamy Posted December 6, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 6, 2011 so by the level crossing at Littleworth station? it's not the A16 any more though, the new road is now called that now it has finally opened. To be honest I have no idea - I took the information from the earlier posts - and now I have looked at a more up to date map, I can see that what I thought was the A16 is now the A1175 Mike Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Webbo Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 If they do decide to put the distribution centre near the Littleworth level crossing the people who have just bought houses on the new estate there will be well "Pd" off, another set of NIMBY's. In my opinion it would be better for all concerned if it could be situated north of Spalding, somewhere between Pinchbeck and Gosberton at the western end of the A152 link road from the A16. That way it keeps the heavies away from the Deepings and into a low populated area which is mainly arable land, also with good road access from all directions. Just for info, it doesn't affect me as I am retired. Webbo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob D2 Posted December 10, 2011 Share Posted December 10, 2011 I don't like this phrase 'NIMBY'.What are people supposed to do if they want to put a freight yard in your back garden ? - 'Take one for the team ' ? I sure as hell would become a NIMBY if they tried to put one near me , despite the fact i see the overall benefits. I just hope they have some flows ready and waiting - and it's not another speculative fratton or donnington disaster Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ess1uk Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 Any more news on this? I've been looking in the press but it seems to have gone quiet. With the joint line upgrade due to start soon they need to get a move on really I would have thought. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shed Posted August 12, 2012 Share Posted August 12, 2012 Did hear rumours that a station near the signal box and crossing was being considered. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWRLMSLNER Posted July 21, 2013 Share Posted July 21, 2013 It is difficult to equate the Lincoln element into this thread. In Lincoln they complain about the crossing AND that there are not enough DIRECT trains to London. They think that a quick trip to Newark and the main line is beyond them even allowing for the fact that trains nearly all meet main line ones within 15 minutes and passengers don't even have to change platforms going south and not always coming home from London. A through service by non-electric all the way is slower than changing at Newark. Extra traffic through Lincoln is actually not that big a problem with inner relief road planned from High Street to Pelham bridge and a footbridge very likely on the cards for pedestrians. A resident of Ruskington was telling me only this week about the planned extra trains and that a stop the trains group is being formed as they can 'hear them' from their garden? Progress is about the same today as in 1840. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium phil-b259 Posted July 21, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 21, 2013 I don't like this phrase 'NIMBY'.What are people supposed to do if they want to put a freight yard in your back garden ? - 'Take one for the team ' ? I sure as hell would become a NIMBY if they tried to put one near me , despite the fact i see the overall benefits. To a certain extent I have to say yes. Put it this way if every single landowner was given an absolute veto on development the country would be, to use a rather brutal term - f****d. Nobody particularly likes living next door to motorways or wind turbines, recycling plants, etc and it was the same back in the early days of the canals and then the railways, but you try living your modern life without them. Its worth noting therefore that NIMBYism itself is therefore not a recent invention indeed railway history is littered with problems caused by landowners refusing to entertain the idea of trains getting close to their property and in some cases we are still suffering the effects over a century later. The big difference is that back in those days most land and property was owned by the ruling classes not individual householders so you could say that actually modern planning process are much fairer on society as a whole as it requires a far grater consultation than ever was the case back in the Victorian era or even the recent past such as the 1960s where they was still a lot of 'the ministry knows best' floating about and surprisingly little scrutiny of big planning decisions by ordinary residents. Returning to Spalding however, as to whether the benefits from this particular scheme override the natural desire of the local residents for the satus quo to remain - I am not in a position to comment. What I would say is that we do have one of the most stringent and through planning process in the developed world so naturally I would expect all angles to be looked at as part of the planning process and if the scheme does not prove worthwhile overall it should be rejected Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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