Fiddle Yards - Traverser, Sector Plate or Turntable

[Stubby47]

This is probably a 'how long is a piece of string' question, but.....

 

I'm intending to make a pair of fiddle yards to go either end of a variety of future layouts.

 

Given that these layouts might well be a one-man operation, so the yards need to be simple to use (hence no casssettes, plain track, etc), which style do seasoned exhibitors recommend : traverser, sector plate (pivoted at one end) or turntable ?

 

Cheers

 

Stu

[shortliner]

You are right about the length of a piece of string! It honestly depends on what you want to do! Moving a single loco/train between two or three tracks only - a sector plate with pivot will do that. Moving multiple trains on and off a layout either a traverser or a turntable. Reversing a train, either a turntable or a cassette

My current system is the fiddlestck sector plate

[Kris]

If it's going to be for one man operation I would suggest a fan a sidings. You can then control this remotely. Saves lots of walking up and down.

[Taz]

How long do you think your longest train consist will be (knowing the size of your previous layouts I guess 1 engine and 1 wagon ).

 

That might have a bearing on the choice. My own layout uses a 9+' traverser but it doesn't have to move anywhere. If the layout was portable I think I would have problems with the tolerances required.

 

I have seen turntables used effectivley for 1 man operation at exhibitions so this might be worth exploring.

[Colin]

I've used traversers exclusively for the last few years (I found Screwfix drawer runners to be ideal), having weighed up the alternatives and tried various options. Early on I discounted fans of sidings due to the extra length needed for points ( on the new layout I plan to run EMU trains of around 6 coaches or alternatively a loco + 5 and will also need at least 7 tracks at each end of the layout). I'm not keen on cassettes as in 4mm scale a 6 car train can be a bit unwieldy. I originally tried sector plates but found that the entry/exit curves on the outer tracks were a bit too sharp for comfort, causing problems with long wheelbase non-bogie stock such as SR utility vans/CCTs. If I only ran short trains then I'd probably go for cassettes as a fairly easy option.

[mike morley]

Two thoughts;

 

Firstly, have you considered the Iain Rice idea of the through station with a fiddle yard at only one end? At the "outward" end of the layout the train disappears off-stage then reverses along a return line hidden behind the scenery to the fiddle yard at the other end. As it rarely requires more than a single turnout that can obviously be operated from afar its ideal for solo operation.

 

The other thought - more advice, really - is to avoid over-engineering things, no matter which system you nominate. I once attempted a four-road traverser, one road of which was a lift-out cassette. It was more complicated than the whole of the rest of the layout and was the sole cause of the entire layout being abandoned at the barely-half-built stage.

[Kenton]

It is probably just personal choice in the end but I think it does depend on the type of layout in between.

 

Quintland has, or will eventually have a traverser at one end and a simple sector at the other with mike's suggested hidden return from far end (sector plate) to the traverser. The traverser has worked from Day 1 and was simple to build and IMO the simplest to operate. The hidden gends up used for additional storage and the SP has been replaced by a point as it doesn't work (design issues yet to be overcome) and it extends the operational length by 3ft making it difficult to set up.

 

Past experience with one ended micros has always favored traversers for simplicity in use - they just seem to be able to hold more.

 

However the ability to turn complete trains and send them back means that they should win hands down operationally - less need to handle stock especially uncouple 3 links or tension locks. Their biggest drawback though is having to swing the wholetup back into the operational area and into the guts of all the punters trying to watch the layout.

[clecklewyke]

Two thoughts; Firstly, have you considered the Iain Rice idea of the through station with a fiddle yard at only one end? At the "outward" end of the layout the train disappears off-stage then reverses along a return line hidden behind the scenery to the fiddle yard at the other end. As it rarely requires more than a single turnout that can obviously be operated from afar its ideal for solo operation.

 

I have used this system on two exhibition layouts - Humber Dock and Royston Vasey, the idea being that I should operate from one end only. At the operator's end are simple cassettes and at the other end a swinging sector plate, rather than a point. This makes the layout shorter and was important in reducing the layout footprints sufficiently to meet the Scalefour Soc's 1883 and Workington MRC's 5sq.ft. challenges. The sector plate was operated by string or simple levers. On reflection I think a turnout might have been easier.

 

This one-ended system works fine for the short trains (max two coaches or six wagons) I run on these layouts. However, it might be pushing it a bit with longer trains.

 

Both are based on Iain's Chapelfirth design in his Wild Swan book on layout design (thoroughly recommended).

 

Here are some pictures of Humber Dock and Royston Vasey:

 

 

[Stubby47]

Guys,

Thanks for all the considered and informative replies !

 

After I posted the original question, I realised that in order to reduce handling of stock, the simplest way to return trains would be to use turntables (as I believe Mr Nevard does on Catcott), so at first I thought the question is moot. However, having noticed a trend on the B&W Rly where all locos face the same way (and again thanks for the explanations this question brought forth), then using turntables could / would negate the realistic effect of locos travelling one way then returning, especially tank locos.

 

But, there is always a wealth of advice to be gleaned from this forum, so all answers have been equally valid and welcome.

 

Taz is not quite right, the trains I'm considering would be at least two wagons, maybe even two coaches, but certainly not longer than 3ft in any form. This sort of size would lessen the scenario Kenton mentions, that of using a turntable and swinging the stock out into the public area, but that does need to be considered.

 

I really like the idea of a hidden return loop, as several of you have suggested - it would certainly simplify solo operation. As my layouts would not be that wide, to incorproate such a line within a 2ft wide baseboard should be straight forward.

 

So, again, thanks for all your replies and insight - further pondering on how I progress is required.

 

Cheers

 

Stu

[clecklewyke]

 

 

I really like the idea of a hidden return loop, as several of you have suggested - it would certainly simplify solo operation. As my layouts would not be that wide, to incorproate such a line within a 2ft wide baseboard should be straight forward.

 

 

With a small exhibition layout I think it is very desirable to have a single operator at one end of the layout and to remove any need to walk about while operating (at my age exhibitions are tiring enough without unnecessary exercise!).

 

Royston Vasey is just 4' X 1' and I managed to fit in a hidden kick-back line under the hill side. If you do this there is no problem about locos having to face the same way, presumably uphill?

 

I like the idea of a small turntable for a fiddle yard. If planning Humber Dock now I think that is the way I would go. But on Royston Vasey I had to incorporate gradients on both the visible and hidden lines, to allow the road to cross the visible line on the level and pass over the hidden line, so the two lines to the fiddle yard are at different levels, which made a turntable impossible.

 

I look forward to see your progress,

 

Best wishes,

 

Ian

[Stubby47]

Following the excellent advice (as always !! ) I've come up with this as a proposal for a theory for a probable possibility...

 

 

The green bits will be areas I can add different layouts as time progresses, using the 'dead' area in front of the right-hand headshunt fiddle yard either for additional track / sidings (hmm, clay dries ??? ) or just for an area to plonk my latest odd buildings.

 

The main board will have two entrances, allowing me to have a through station or a terminus with a private siding or something else.

The main fiddle yard will intiailly be cassettes, but this might be improved upon to a more mechanical solution as my needs / abilities expand.

 

All I have to do is :

a) convince the boss it's a really good idea and will not take up any space in the garage / kitchen and won't cost anything

and b ) build it...

 

Thanks for all your input and please keep adding to this thread if you have further options.

 

Stu