West Coast Derailment

[The Stationmaster]

I'd tend to agree with you Phil, the rostering itself wasn't at fault, maybe the CONTENT of the work on the roster which would maybe encourage (literally in this case) cutting corners. I could probably recount numerous rosters on the SR where "fiddles" were worked out as soon as the rosters were planned, all of which were ok as long as everything went ok. Most worked to the drivers' benefit, and the management let it happen because if the driver was going to "get something out of it" then he'd turn up and do the job. Is what I meant!

 

Exactly so - when, in TLF days, I first became involved in diagramming for a particular Southern depot the number of 'old Spanish customs' which came to light had to be seen to be believed (and that was just in the diagrams - where, for example 15 minutes Walking Time came out as 65 minutes simply to pad the diagram to make the flexible rostering hours total come out more easily ).

[roythebus]

1. Like the late turn we had at Waterloo which ended up sitting at Dorking for 55 minutes just to pad out the roster to an 8hr 55 min job for flexible rostering! Speaking to the roster clerk of the day, he explained it used to be drivers that would go sick on a regular basis. with flexible rostering, it was "duities" that went sick, irrespective of the driver; such as the late Dorking turn. after all, who wanted to miss the last train home to pad out a turn to suit flexible rostering? But that really is another discussion.
   

In the original instance, in my view it would be better to use a Crewe man to bring the loco to London, then back pass, that way there's less incentive to "hurry up".

[beast66606]

I'll take a look through my collection when I get chance, I have some Bletchley commissionings

 

[Supaned]

If I could bring up the subject of route knowledge/maps/schematics etc , one of the issues as a driver arises in that there is a wide variation in the standard of information provided - ranging from word of mouth (which may well be incorrect) , back of an envelope , up to the newer computer generated track-access maps.

 

Whilst a good map is never a substitute for proper route knowledge , for a driver to properly learn a route and the various permutations at junctions etc , there really should be a national database of maps (as opposed to the sectional appendix which does not show signals and their indications) - I appreciate the costs involved in setting this up and maintaining the information , but as long as the TOCs were involved an paid a subscription to access the information this shouldn't be insurmountable. If a driver requires to learn a route , the TOC concerned accesses the relevant files and provides the driver with the most accurate and up to date information possible...

 

Taking the case of Bletchley , as illustrated by Beast's post above , those diagrams presumably originate from the 1960s re-signalling of the area. It's unlikely that many copies of this will exist these days , so potentially vital information is missed with the inevitable consequences.

[phil-b259]

If I could bring up the subject of route knowledge/maps/schematics etc , one of the issues as a driver arises in that there is a wide variation in the standard of information provided - ranging from word of mouth (which may well be incorrect) , back of an envelope , up to the newer computer generated track-access maps.

 

Whilst a good map is never a substitute for proper route knowledge , for a driver to properly learn a route and the various permutations at junctions etc , there really should be a national database of maps (as opposed to the sectional appendix which does not show signals and their indications) - I appreciate the costs involved in setting this up and maintaining the information , but as long as the TOCs were involved an paid a subscription to access the information this shouldn't be insurmountable. If a driver requires to learn a route , the TOC concerned accesses the relevant files and provides the driver with the most accurate and up to date information possible...

 

Taking the case of Bletchley , as illustrated by Beast's post above , those diagrams presumably originate from the 1960s re-signalling of the area. It's unlikely that many copies of this will exist these days , so potentially vital information is missed with the inevitable consequences.

 

Ahem.... What about the local S&T? They will have track plans giving full particulars of the signals for the area including the type of signal, number of aspects, mounting arangements, type of route indicator which in the case of stencil or theatre types includes ever single letter number that can be displayed and which route hey relate to. Finding the information is not difficult even if you are a TOC. (Admitadly the formal arangements might be a bit more long winded but a few friendly phone calls to the right people would soon provide the info required).

[TheSignalEngineer]

I don't know what happens now, but when I was in charge of our local S&T records Route Lists with all indications, as in the commissioning notices, were kept for all MAS installations on my patch. Local Traction and Operating Supervisors usually kept copies. On later projects the Route Lists were incorporated into the scheme plans.