Earl Bathurst Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 Once again another problem which i cant find the answer for. I have an asymmetrix point on my layout which when ever i run a loco over stalls. the locos run fine before the point and after the point but wont run over it. The information i have found for the point al seems to be designed for dc wiring but nothing for dcc wiring. Can someone help me again. Sorry for being a pain. Scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grovenor Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 Try a search on here, it comes up almost every month, and its just the same for DC or DCC, both need to connect one side of the supply to each rail and switch it when the point changes. Regards Keith Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coombe Barton Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 And this - http://www.brian-lambert.co.uk/Electrical-2.htm - may answer those as yet unasked questions Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
66C Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 Hi Scott The wiring should ideally be the same for both DC and DCC. You may find this diagram easier to follow: http://www.finescale.org.uk/images/stories/pdfs/3way.pdf Regards. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
retbsignalman Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 Hi! I had a few problems with the Code 75 3-way assymetric point when setting it up. My difficulty lay with orientating their diagram with the point as laid. Several attempts were made, each time resulting in a short, made more difficult by it being part of a scissors crossover! In final despair and several resorts to Anglo Saxon, I invested in a 'Hex Frog Juicer'! Great bit of kit, send the droppers from each frog to the juicer and take a spur off each bus wire to it! Problem solved and such was the success of that move, I've slowly started to put them in other areas of the layout too. Hope this helps, Regards, Graeme Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earl Bathurst Posted July 24, 2012 Author Share Posted July 24, 2012 If i use a SEEP point motor with built in switch would that correct the problem of polarity or would you use a Hex frog juicer and the point motors? Scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earl Bathurst Posted July 24, 2012 Author Share Posted July 24, 2012 Im also going to be using NCE powercab if that will make a difference? Scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250BOB Posted July 24, 2012 Share Posted July 24, 2012 Scott.......beleive me.....get a frog juicer. Expensive maybe.........................................but worth every penny. I have wired in a 3 way assymetric and two double slips, all to one Hex Frog Juicer, thats seven frogs in all, but only six outlets on the frog juicer, but I doubled up on one from a slip and one from the three way. Simple and trouble free....the man who invented these deserves a medal. Give it some serious thought, you wont regret it. Check out this thread. http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/55564-frog-juicer-fitting/page__fromsearch__1 Bob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earl Bathurst Posted July 24, 2012 Author Share Posted July 24, 2012 So with the frog juicer i can change the polarity of 6 frogs and it will work with my NCE power cab? scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250BOB Posted July 24, 2012 Share Posted July 24, 2012 So with the frog juicer i can change the polarity of 6 frogs and it will work with my NCE power cab? scott Absolutely Scott....guaranteed. I have used it to do 7 frogs, because I will never be running a loco over the three way and one of the slips at the same time. As the loco runs onto the point, the system detects in a micro second if the polarity is correct, and changes it if required. It is done so quickly you dont know anything about it....even sound locos run continuosly without break in the sound. My pal had his slips and assymetric wired up with umpteen switches to change the polarity, he came and took one look at mine, then disappeared and bought two Hex Frog Juicers last week....he cant believe how simple they are to wire in. You wont regret it. Ask away if you have further questions on them. Rgds.....Bob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earl Bathurst Posted July 24, 2012 Author Share Posted July 24, 2012 Oh sounds good. i might see a purchase of 1 of these now haha because i can now use my 3 way point. So how do you wire them up? And do the wires from the bus cable from the dcc controller contect to the frog juicer? Scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion Posted July 24, 2012 Share Posted July 24, 2012 See http://www.tamvalleydepot.com/support/frogjuicers.html Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250BOB Posted July 25, 2012 Share Posted July 25, 2012 Oh sounds good. i might see a purchase of 1 of these now haha because i can now use my 3 way point. So how do you wire them up? And do the wires from the bus cable from the dcc controller contect to the frog juicer? Scott As you will see from the picture in Orions post.......the power comes in on the left where there is a 2 wire terminal block, yes it can be from your power bus. Then the block of six terminals are for the frogs....just one wire to each frog. It is that flippin simple. Good luck. Bob. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earl Bathurst Posted July 25, 2012 Author Share Posted July 25, 2012 Hi Thanks for the info. And bob took your advice i ordered 1 this morning, so hopefully have it before the weekend. Thanks for all your help. Scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250BOB Posted July 25, 2012 Share Posted July 25, 2012 Hi Thanks for the info. And bob took your advice i ordered 1 this morning, so hopefully have it before the weekend. Thanks for all your help. Scott Hi Scott, Good decision mate.......just shout if you need further help on this one. Here is a pic of mine when I first got it, and quickly wired in the power, blue and brown wires, and also wired in two frogs on my double slip, two orange wires. Bob. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250BOB Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 Hi Scott, I note from elsewhere on the Forum that you have purchased the Frog Juicer and it has arrived.........well....have you fitted it yet.??????? Bob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earl Bathurst Posted July 26, 2012 Author Share Posted July 26, 2012 Hi Bob Had a fantastic service from Bromsgrove models. Thats my weekend job got some jobs to do on the track first. How did you say you managed to put 7 points onto 6 outlets because i have 7 points aswell? Scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tender Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Hi Scott You just have to think carefully about the way your trains run through point sections to avoid conflicts with frog polarity. For instance, I have a double mainline junction consisting of two Y points and a crossover, a total of four frogs. By linking the two points together so the up/down lines either both go to the left or both to the right ive managed to get away with only using two outputs on the frog juicer. Linking the two point frogs and the furthest crossover frog to one output of the juicer and the near crossover frog to the other. Ray. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250BOB Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Hi Scott, Like Ray.......I have two double slips, one on the main line, one on the freight avoiding line which gets less use......so I wired one of the two frogs on this lower use slip, into the same connector on the juicer, as one of the 3 frog wires from my 3 way point. I hope that makes sense.......ask if its not clear Scott. The polarity in each slip and 3 way only has to be + or - while a loco is passing over the point......so you have to be a bit unlucky to get conflicts, unless its like Clapham Jnc., let us know how you get on....good luck. Bob. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earl Bathurst Posted July 27, 2012 Author Share Posted July 27, 2012 Thanks for the info. Bob i have included a very crude drawing of the layout, which 2 pointswould you double up in the juicer? Scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earl Bathurst Posted July 27, 2012 Author Share Posted July 27, 2012 Here is the pic i forgot to attach haha Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250BOB Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Hi Scott.......let me understand......you have one 3 way assymetric point. Are any of your other points double or single slip points.??? You only need a frog juicer with double slips, single slips and 3 way points, because of the complex wiring required to deal with the changing of polarity. I can't see you have any slip points on your diagram.?? Regards................Bob. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250BOB Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Here is a pic of my completed and wired frog juicer, and also the wiring from my 3 way point. Hope this helps. Here you will see the blue and brown power bus wires appeaing from the top, and running behind the juicer down to the power terminals at the bottom of the pic. Also, on the left you will see the bottom three orange wires disappearing off to my 3 way, and the top four orange wires going to the 2 double slips. Look carefully, and you will see two wires going to one outlet, one from the 3 way point, and one from a double slip. This pic shows the three white wires coming from the frogs on my 3 way point, then through a connector and continuing on to the frog juicer as orange wires. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earl Bathurst Posted July 28, 2012 Author Share Posted July 28, 2012 I only have one 3 way assymetric point and he rest are normal points. Cant i also put the other points into the juicer to control the frog polarity then? Thanks for the pic Scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 I only have one 3 way assymetric point and he rest are normal points. Cant i also put the other points into the juicer to control the frog polarity then? Thanks for the pic Scott Yes, of course you can! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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