Edinburgh Junction Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 Hello! I've just put down some ballast scatter onto the track where I want to put it, and I've spreaded it out to how I want it, but whats the best way to glue it down without it loosing its place of where I put it? I've heard spraying it with Diluted PVA does the job, but what spray bottle do I need? Im also on a budget... so any help would be much appreciated. Cheers Jack Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold RedgateModels Posted December 23, 2009 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 23, 2009 Hi Jack, the "standard" technique (others are available) is to: using a hand sprayer - the sort that you use for misting houseplants or hairdressers use for wetting your hair before cutting. Fill with water and a few drops of washing up liquid and mist the track, slowly at first from a distance then gradually moving closer as it gets wet ensuring that the ballast gets a good soaking. Now with a mix of 50/50 PVC glue and water, again with a few drops of washing up liquid drop the glue onto the wet ballast with an eye dropper or better one of those syringes that come with childrens medicine these days. Allow to dry overnight. Beware though that if you have used real granite ballast it will probably go green. Woodland Scenics stuff does not suffer from this problem. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LBSC123 Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 Dam you Redgatemodels beat me to it while I was typing. I've recently finished balasting on my layout and this is what I did: once the balast is in the correct position spary with washing up liquid and water dont point it towards the ballast or it will blow it out of the way you want a light mist falling down on it which sort of binds it together. Then mix up your PVa/water/washing up liquid sollution (you might not need washing up liquid in it but I put it in to be on the safe side) then mist this over in the same way until it looks saturated, avoid doing too much or you will get fans coming out of it and it will spoil your hard work. if it goes green I generally find it can be fixed by a wash of Acrylic Black/brown paint and water also makes it looks nice! Give it a go I enjoy it! Will Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jim s-w Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 Hi Jack I use Klear floor polish. No need to wet anything first and it dries in about an hour. Just apply neat with an eye dropper. Cheers Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edinburgh Junction Posted December 23, 2009 Author Share Posted December 23, 2009 Thank you ever so much guys! I've got the sprayer, adjusted and tested, and it works. Now to do the real thing. I found this very useful article... does what you guys recommended. http://www.camelotjunction.co.uk/ballasting.htm Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
smyles1 Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 I agree with Jim about Johnson's Klear. I used it for the first time stick ballast to a new layout with it recently and it is magic. One ??2.49 bottle did all the track and scenic scatter on a 5ftx1ft board with plenty leftover. Mike Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LBSC123 Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 could someone who uses Johnson's Klear give us a step by step demo of how its done? I've never heard of this method before and it sounds interesting and also a possible time saver. Will Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinkmouse Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 could someone who uses Johnson's Klear give us a step by step demo of how its done? Place ballast, add Klear with pipette, let dry. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalo Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 Place ballast, add Klear with pipette, let dry. Beat me to it -- it really is that simple :icon_e_biggrin: You might also try going to the RMweb front page and scrolling down to the 'Google Custom Search' which allows you to search the old RMweb. Try entering something like 'klear ballast' and you'll find it has been discussed before, as have the more traditional (and often more messy) PVA and washing up liquid methods. Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrisr40 Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 has anybody ever tried adding wallpaper paste powder to the ballast mix and then spraying with water after brushing the stones and powder into place ? Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted December 23, 2009 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 23, 2009 has anybody ever tried adding wallpaper paste powder to the ballast mix and then spraying with water after brushing the stones and powder into place ? Chris When the paste dissolves (which it will struggle to do without being very wet) it will leave voids in the ballast, and the carefully crafted ballast shape will collapse, into the tie bar of a point no doubt. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edinburgh Junction Posted December 23, 2009 Author Share Posted December 23, 2009 I prefer the budget PVA solution. I've covered it in water, and will do it again in a mo, but is it me, or when I add the PVA solution to the sprayer, instead of it being a fine mist, its a powerful blast... no adjustments made. Very strange.... anyone recommend anything? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chameleon Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 You are much better using a plastic pipette or dropper to put the glue down. A 50/50 glue/water mix is too thick to spray properly and will clog the nozzle on the sprayer. Using a dropper is much easier and more accurateas you can get the glue exactly where you want it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edinburgh Junction Posted December 23, 2009 Author Share Posted December 23, 2009 Right.... so where is the best place to get a pipette or dropper? Could I use a spoon and drip some from the spoon to track????? Mmmm... need to think a bit more than I thought to have done. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrisr40 Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 chemists or boots is the best bet - eye drop pipettes are good but also with some meds you get plastic syringes that you can use to control the flow of liquid . Chris or if you havent laid the track yet - paint the baseboard with neat pva in the route of the track and then pin / stick you track down on it - then spread ballast along the pva. When dry hoover up the excess - worked a treat on the layout I built for my son and I wish I had done it that way on mine. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 Most dispensing chemists will have eye-droppers, teat pipettes and the like. I am solidly in the dilute PVA in a plant mister camp. Four parts water, one part PVA, drop of washing up liquid: that will spray as a fine mist and the speed is what makes it so good, no prewetting required. Arrange the ballast, mist it on until the solution is visble between the ballast, wipe off the rail tops, walk away and let the water completely evaporate. I have even got away with doing this over points, but normally mask off moving parts, and do these by dropper. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
meple Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 Ballast the track at the same time as you lay the track. That way you don't need to add anything and it all done in one fell swoop. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Prism Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 Ballast the track at the same time as you lay the track. That way you don't need to add anything and it all done in one fell swoop. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigwelsh Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 Ballast the track at the same time as you lay the track. That way you don't need to add anything and it all done in one fell swoop. This doesn't work with full height sleepering. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Prism Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 This doesn't work with full height sleepering. Not all full height sleepering needs full height ballasting... (sorry, Craig, I know that is a bit unfair) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 I agree with Jim about Johnson's Klear. I used it for the first time stick ballast to a new layout with it recently and it is magic. One ??2.49 bottle did all the track and scenic scatter on a 5ftx1ft board with plenty leftover. How solid does the Klear go? I was considering using copydex rather than PVA as it doesn't set rock hard like PVA does. I can't see the point of putting track on top of a cork underlay only to lock it completely solid with PVA. So what's Klear like when it's dried? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jim s-w Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 Indeed but equally not all low height sleepering needs just a thin layer of ballast either. some need raised shoulders Cheers Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Prism Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 Indeed but equally not all low height sleepering needs just a thin layer of ballast either. some need raised shoulders True, Jim. Ballast needs as much planning as the track does! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edinburgh Junction Posted December 23, 2009 Author Share Posted December 23, 2009 There are loads of different methods. 4:1 seems to be good (water:pva)... I shall try that out later when I have time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
smyles1 Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 Art shops have very nice plastic pipettes as artists use them for accurately mixing paint. I paid 50p each for those I bought at a local artists' supplies/craft shop. They also have dropper bottles. Mike Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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