Kirkcaldy area

[stevecs]

seems to be remnants of a bridge on invertiel road : http://goo.gl/maps/4d2Vi

the line going through the play park and turning left just before the trees

 

Keefer if you look at this from the other side (from the carpark of the flats) you can see the top of the bridge a bit clearer http://goo.gl/maps/kVVWZ

 

and the Tunnel as such that was under the Mainline (apologies for quality of image I can't find the original before I buggered about with it

Edited December 18, 2012 by stevecs

[asarnot]

At the risk of going off topic a bit, I was interested to see 64618 on the Leslie railtour. I also saw this tour, but following another railtour to Anstruther with a pair of J37's, 64570 and 64618, I obtained the original N.B.R. 'S' class cabside power classification plates from fortysix eighteen. I think they cost fifteen bob from the stores depot at Thornton. If you enlarge the image and look very closely at the lighter duplicate pic of 64618 (not 16) returning from Leslie, you can make out one of the plates partly obscured by the handrail under the driver's side window. Not all of the N.B.R. plates were removed by the LNER. At least one J83 carried it's 'D' plates and I believe a couple of J36's kept their 'C' class plates into BR days.

Further to Graham's point, Andrew Goodman of Moveright International has preserved WPR Austerity 0-6-0 No 15 as 'Earl David', and in full chocolate livery. Unfortunately, it now has a large pipe running along the side of the saddletank, presumably for the vacuum ejector, although I think this could better have been routed under the tank. To go even further off topic and with my Ayrshire Railway Preservation Group hat on, Andrew moved our former RBR to Ruddington, and also brought our LMS Inspection saloon from Toton to Waterside. He was most interested to know that I had seen No 15 and its sisters in daily use on the Wemyss, and I sent him the attached shot of No 15 in Muir's in 1971.

[keefer]

on another topic, someone linked to an unknown-to-me flickr : http://www.flickr.co...olycorner/sets/

 

the industrials set has NCB & WPR at methil

hunslet shunter at thornton: http://www.flickr.co...157632077178578

scottish steam in fife also has some good pics at thornton, leslie etc

 

meant to post a link earlier, but the talk of sinclairtown reminded me i'd seen the entrance to the former up-side goods yard (now a car dealer)

looks like the original gates, still with ScR light blue on the tops of the posts? : http://goo.gl/maps/HKn5m

 

go a bit further up and i wonder if these substantial gate-posts show the original station entrance? the large building (now italian restaurant) is the former station hotel, which i'm sure must've still been open as such into the 70s/80s : http://goo.gl/maps/Wqvju

Edited December 18, 2012 by keefer

[Ian Kirk]

Hi All,

 

Some interesting links there Keefer. Also you are right about the access to the original Sinclairtown Station, IIRC there was at one time a ramshackle kiosk between the gateposts. (or an extention to the "temporary structure" looking shop). Slightly further up towards Scoonie Hobbies there was a close which led through to communal gardens/drying greens. In the late 50s this allowed a small boy to access a viewingpoint over traffic on the main lines about where the old station had been and the activities of the Sinclairtown pilot which on the days I can remember was a J69.

I don't know why Tam Muir collected colliery pugs but assume he saw them as a good investment which could be easily kept until the price was right. Like a small, Fife Woodhams. Just as well he did as now most of the larger locos have been sold and restored. At least one of the small locos turned out to be a rare type (fletcher jennings?)and was saved. I presume too that he got them at a good price. In the late 60s you could buy a loco for not a huge sum of money. Unfortunately at that time few of us had any money! I was a member of the SRPS and we had had two locos put aside by BR staff in good sound working order. A Caley 0-4-4T and an NB N15 0-6-2T. The asking price was £650.00 each. two groups were formed along the lines of the old adversaries. I was (whilst a teen aged schoolboy) the secretary of the NB Group (a precursor of the NB Study Group). Dick Hollingsworth (Parkside)was the treasurer and I think Sandy McLean was the Chairman. Despite having persuded the then Earl of Elgin (the last surviving director of the NBR)to be Hon Patron we had only raised a few hundreds by crunch time for the locos being cut up. The Caley Group had a bit more than we did so rather than see both locos cut up we put the funds together and saved the 0-4-4T. If only.....

 

best wishes,

 

Ian

[Ian Kirk]

Hi All,

This photograph could be titled "first of the many". Further along the track towards Balgeddie from what became Muir's Yard was a riding stable. I helped out there in the early 60s (having discovered that there were a lot more girls than boys interested in horses)Pete sometimes cycled up to meet me as there was another track which led to a bridge over the River Ore and the back view of Thornton Shed. Amongst the trees where the scrapyards were to come were some old industrial or mining buildings. Taking a look there one day we came upon a blue painted locomotive just sitting on the ground.I was quite surprised to see a scrapped diesel, there were still 70 year old steam locos working on the main line,I still tended to think of any diesel as "modern image".We had a good climb over it. I was greatly taken with the starting handle. Within weeks the clearing filled up with old lorries etc. Perhaps though this was the purchase that gave Tam Muir the idea of collecting locomotives when the NCB and WPR ones became available. This first little loco was a 1941 Hunslet which had come from the Naval Ordnance depot at Crombie.

 

Seasons Greetings to all followers of this thread.

 

best wishes,

 

Ian

Edited December 30, 2012 by Ian Kirk

[keefer]

just come across this cracking pic of 06002 waiting by the signalbox, 15/6/79

 

http://www.flickr.com/photos/roger_sutcliffe/5954065600/in/set-72157626278361184

[Neilgue]

Hello Folks,
I have been lurking in the background here since I discovered this thread a few weeks ago. I have had nothing to contribute, what with me living in Australia and all. However, my family background is well and truly Langtonian, having been traced back at least four hundred years. I lived in KDY until I was about 5 or 6, though we still had lots of contact until we left for Australia when I was 12 in 1969. We actually started our journey to Australia from KDY station on the sleeper to London.

Anyhow, to cut a long story short, I am back on holiday visiting rellies and am having a great time checking out the sites on this thread. The following pics may be of some interest:


Sinclairtown Station - Outside


Sinclairtown Station - Inside
Must have been great when the big expresses went under!


Sinclairtown up-side goods yard.
Lots of railway type buildings left.


Invertiel Viaduct.


Invertiel branch tunnel.
The other end of the tunnel has been blocked with a huge pile of branches and debris. I went around the other way, but it was a bit too wet and muddy to scamble down into the cutting.


Invertiel Branch Tunnel - View from the park.


Invertiel Rd Bridge
The red brick arch is still visible.


Kinghorn Rd Bridge.
I followed the line further and was surprised to see that the parapet of the Kinghorn Rd bridge is now a garden wall. It looks really good from the other side, but it felt a bit creepy to take pictures of someones garden...


Nairnses Power Station

 

The people responsible for allowing buildings like this to rot should be shot.


The Harbour Branch passing under Victoria Rd.


The harbour is still in commercial use!

And finally, Den Rd:





This poor guy is on the other side from the steamies.


And finally, what a great detail...

Cheers.

[keefer]

excellent pics neilgue! welcome to the forum and the thread too

 

i was always sure i had seen a small diesel at muir's, but had never heard any more about it, only the steamers.

[Chameleon]

Seems such a shame that Muirs got hold of all those locos and just left them to rot. They probably aren't even worth much as scrap value any more.

[keefer]

someone posted a question about when the lines over dunnikier rd. went from 4 to 2 (or more accurately 2+2 to 2+0) after the harbour branch closed (possibly on the harbour branch thread!)

 

noticed a while back that the bridge over dunnikier rd. has old and new styles of bridge, depending on what side you view it from

 

going down the road towards the traffic lights, modern concrete bridge deck under the ECML: http://goo.gl/maps/HUyUB  (notice the state of the chevroned bit - usually skelped about once a year when a stagecoach double-decker tries to go somewhere he shouldn't even be near!)

 

going up from the traffic lights, older metalwork version is still in place: http://goo.gl/maps/ScMoq

i suppose there's no point renewing it if it's not used anymore

 

looking underneath gives some good detail: http://goo.gl/maps/W0P4g   (it is straight, just the joining of the photos makes it look kinked)

 

not too clear, but an interesting detail for modellers?: http://goo.gl/maps/2NR7E

 

and finally, i don't know how common this sort of reinforcement was?: http://goo.gl/maps/eu0uM

interesting that it was required on one side only

 

 

[stevecs]

"someone posted a question about when the lines over dunnikier rd. went from 4 to 2 (or more accurately 2+2 to 2+0) after the harbour branch closed (possibly on the harbour branch thread!)

 

noticed a while back that the bridge over dunnikier rd. has old and new styles of bridge, depending on what side you view it from

 

going down the road towards the traffic lights, modern concrete bridge deck under the ECML: http://goo.gl/maps/HUyUB  (notice the state of the chevroned bit - usually skelped about once a year when a stagecoach double-decker tries to go somewhere he shouldn't even be near!)"

 

As an aside just last year about 20 yds further back up the road from here they changed the road layout slightly and a big electronic warning sign is now in place that flashes up when high sided vehicles approach and tells them to divert.  It is here where you can see the existing warning sign is http://goo.gl/maps/wCgfe

Edited January 11, 2013 by stevecs

[asarnot]

Very interesting photos by Neilgue, especially of the former Invertiel Harbour branch. I hadn't realised that there were so many traces left.

Following a bit of rummaging for something else entirely, I discovered the following couple of slides in my 'discards' box. The originals are unviewable, but a bit of 'Photoshopping' discovered scenes of the Dubbie branch, taken in 1981.

The loco is NCB No. 30, a Barclay 16 incher, works 2259 of 1949, sitting amongst the general dereliction, and the other pic is of the fine North British Railway lower quadrant 'home' guarding the White Gates crossing of Normand Road. I do hope this signal has been preserved, as it must have been one of the last few working LQs in normal service. Perhaps Keefer or Lochty will know.

 

[Lochty no more]

 

Very interesting photos by Neilgue, especially of the former Invertiel Harbour branch. I hadn't realised that there were so many traces left.

Following a bit of rummaging for something else entirely, I discovered the following couple of slides in my 'discards' box. The originals are unviewable, but a bit of 'Photoshopping' discovered scenes of the Dubbie branch, taken in 1981.

DSC00305.JPG

DSC00306.JPG

The loco is NCB No. 30, a Barclay 16 incher, works 2259 of 1949, sitting amongst the general dereliction, and the other pic is of the fine North British Railway lower quadrant 'home' guarding the White Gates crossing of Normand Road. I do hope this signal has been preserved, as it must have been one of the last few working LQs in normal service. Perhaps Keefer or Lochty will know.

I am afraid the scrap metal merchant got that one. The windlas from the signal on the other side of the crossing has been preserved and will be re - fitted to a "Stevens & Son" single lattice signal from "Methil Central" that is undergoing restoration at the Kingdom of Fife Railway Preservation Society in Leven

The "Dubbie pug" is also being restored at the KFRPS we hope to have it back in steam within 2 years

[Neilgue]

Just to keep things moving along, I thought you may be interested in this building near the corner of Den Rd and Smeaton Rd. (It can be seen clearly on Google Earth street view, but I haven't been able to work out how to include the link in this post.)

 

I don't know what the building was used for, but it is right next to the line and has a railway look about it. It also looks as if it was extended a couple of times in it's life. The brickwork on the front part is quite detailed compared to the back and the roof line changes completely. The arches look to have been bricked up much later. It looks like the building was much bigger, but has been knocked down.

 

Cheers,

Neil

[keefer]

streetview here: http://goo.gl/maps/lSwTa

 

satellite image: http://goo.gl/maps/ijEup

 

1938 OS map shows an 'ingleside works' but as you say, it seems to have been altered since then: http://maps.nls.uk/os/25inch-2nd-and-later/view/?jp2=82881930#jp2=82881930&zoom=5&lat=5348&lon=2352&layers=BT

 

interesting how one house has remained standing and that there used to be railway lines curving round to connect with the mainline. i think this used to got to the dunnikier colliery

 

unfortuneately that's the latest large scale map at the NLS and old-maps doesn't let you zoom in enough on the 1:10560 ones

 

EDIT: found an entry on RCAHMS, it was a steelworks: http://canmore.rcahms.gov.uk/en/site/83547/digital_images/kirkcaldy+5+smeaton+road+ingleside+steel+works/?&sort_typ=archnum&sort_ord=desc

 

EDIT again: was designed by william syme in 1912 and is now 'B' listed: http://www.britishlistedbuildings.co.uk/sc-45548-5-smeaton-road-glenaber-engineers-polychr

Edited January 22, 2013 by keefer

[Ian Kirk]

Hi Neilgue/Keefer,

 

IIRC in the 1960s this was the "Fife Forge" . There is or was a tall corrugated iron clad building on the opposite side of the complex from the building with the arches.This is what you saw from the train or the top deck of a bus (heading towards the town centre) as it turned the corner just before going under the railway. My memory is of a black painted building with Fife Forge in white. This was still rail connected in the early 60s.

 

best wishes,

 

Ian

[asarnot]

This thread is turning into a fascinating account of the industrial archeology of Kirkcaldy, thanks to Keefer and Nielgue. I was particularly intrigued by the Aerofilms shot of the Den Road and Nairns' complex to the north of the railway, as this is how I remember it from my youth. How sad to see the whole area of linoleum production south of the railway has completely vanished, as has Kilgour's flour mill and maltings and Ferguson's timber yard to the north of Smeaton Road. There were rail connections across Den Road to serve the latter - these possibly being the rump of the lines to the old Pannie Pit (Dunnikier Collieries?), which occupied a site between the East Burn and Hayfield Road.

I was also intrigued by Lochty's pix of NCB No. 17. Would this be AB 2292 of 1951, by any chance, and is the lettering original? If so, she was delivered new to the Nellie Colliery, passing to Bowhill in 1953. Although not, as far as I can see ever 'allocated' to the Dubbie, she did spend some time at Dysart workshops, and would doubless have also been employed shunting at the pit. This loco went to Manor Powis in 1966, and then Kinneil in 1971. By this time records are a bit confused, as the NCB amalgamated Scottish Area had no fewer than 4 working locos - all numbered 17. I do hope you manage to restore her to steam in the near future, but watch out for cracking round the firehole door.

Andy.

['CHARD]

Hi Neilgue/Keefer,

 

IIRC in the 1960s this was the "Fife Forge" . There is or was a tall corrugated iron clad building on the opposite side of the complex from the building with the arches.This is what you saw from the train or the top deck of a bus (heading towards the town centre) as it turned the corner just before going under the railway. My memory is of a black painted building with Fife Forge in white. This was still rail connected in the early 60s.

 

best wishes,

 

Ian

 

By the time I was a regular in the Lang Toon as a pre-teen in the early seventies, I clearly remember my uncle mentioning 'the Fife Forge' in conversation, principally with my dad as they traded industrial gossip. 

 

My uncle was Works Technical Manager at British Aluminium down the line at Burntisland, and I suppose the health and wellbeing (or otherwise) of the other heavy metal outfit in the district would be a topic of interest.  I hadn't heard or thought of the Fife Forge for probably 30 years until I revisted this thread just now.

 

However, I have some recollection of seeing it, its derelict shell or the site of it from the train during the 1974-84 era. Black corrugated iron with the name painted in white - or maybe this is all autosuggestion....?

Edited January 24, 2013 by 'CHARD

['CHARD]

Back to Invertiel Road and Kinghorn Road bridges.  That has cleared up a nagging suspicion I had harboured since childhood.  Specifically that the landscape and road topography at either end of Peebles Road (which was built along the old alignment presumably in the 30s, if my guess as to the housing stock is any good) bore witness to bridges having been there at one time.  I never knew until now that the Invertiel branch also had the spur back towards Seafield, and that two bridge parepets are still there to this day.  Thanks for the explanation on the ground.  Excellent.

[keefer]

like 'CHARD, i may be misremembering, but i have in my head the logo for fife forge, was there not a red or orange background and an arrow pointing? i suppose what we'd now call a 'corporate' logo.

 

thought i might've found an image online - alas no, but there is an archive 'glasgow herald' article from nov. 1967 on a new forging press:

 

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=e35AAAAAIBAJ&sjid=uqMMAAAAIBAJ&pg=2620%2C1587883

 

EDIT: just noticed it's a whole page article and shows the 'logo' on the right of the page

Edited January 24, 2013 by keefer

[keefer]

have known of this for a while, but reminded of it while looking for something else

 

http://www.flickr.com/photos/kingfisher24/6348213861/in/set-72157628139736522

 

i always thought set numbers were a late 70s/80s thing, anyone know more about haymarket (possibly dundee) formations in the mid-late 60s?

['CHARD]

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=e35AAAAAIBAJ&sjid=uqMMAAAAIBAJ&pg=2620%2C1587883

 

EDIT: just noticed it's a whole page article and shows the 'logo' on the right of the page

 

Great spot.  The arrow logo is familiar.

 

 

"Marine shafting specialists."  Sounds like something from a Cousteau documentary.

[keefer]

wow, thanks for that!

 

always found it a bit odd when set numbers appeared on front ends, but without any strict diagramming to keep the vehicles together.

 

thanks again

[Neilgue]

I don’t have any information on DMU formations for the late 1960s.  I suspect the formations would change in accordance with maintenance requirements.

 

The Railway Observer for January 1971 gives the following allocations:

 

Blah Blah Blah

 

Dundee

No permanent set formations are operated.

 

Please excuse my ignorance, but how do you translate between the descriptions above and the Class 101 / Class 105 etc descriptions of the RTR models. I'm sure Mr Google could tell me, but that would require work...

 

I suppose the question I really want to ask is what would be the most representative RTR DMU for Kirkcaldy in in the late '60's?

 

Neil

[jeff mcghie]

There is a note in the 1996 sectional appendix thus :-

 

Between North Queensferry and Inverkeithing

 

Isolation of Engines on Diesel Multiple Unit Trains - Should a triple DMU set working over the Up line between Inverkeithing and North Queensferry require to have more than one engine isolated, assistance must be provide.

 

 

HTH

Jeff.