The next Ixion loco - what do you want?

[Giles]

 

I think this is too obscure, but there is a lovely rear view colour photo in the current Steam World - November 2102 on page 16-17 at Baddesley colliery.

 

Paul Bartlett

 

It may not be so very well known as some - but Garretts do hold a fascination for people ..... And the beauty of it is, that it justifies a 'big' loco on a small layout (without being too massive, I hasten to add!)

[Ruston]

I would suggest another standard gauge industrial loco in 7mm scale.

 

A Peckett R4 0-4-0ST would be my first choice because no kit is currently available an plenty were made so there is scope for a variety of individual locos to be modelled. It also can cover a decent timespan of use from the 1920s to the 1970s.

 

Or any industrial 0-4-0ST industrial steam loco would do.

 

Failing that an industrial diesel but I would not go with the suggestion of a RH 48DS because it has been done by more than one kit manufacturer.

 

I would say any early John Fowler diesel or a small Hudswell Clarke 0-4-0 diesel. The Hudswell (such as Carroll at the Middleton Railway) is something that has never been available as a kit and with a timespan of use from the early 1930s to the 1970s could appeal to a lot of modellers who want a small industrial diesel.

[edcayton]

I think it needs to be something big enough to use as the only loco on a branch-ie capable of passenger duty as well as freight. I'd have thought a Jinty, J 69, pannier or something along those lines. I don't know how difficult an 0-4-4 or 2-4-2 chassis would be, but those would allow all kinds of options.

For me, though, the Culm valley wins. That lovely 2-4-0 tank, turn the chassis round for a 517 and a 14xx, and then do the class 22 and we can run through a historical sequence.

 

Ed

[gismorail]

Some interesting thoughts coming from this thread so thought I would add to the mix. I agree that if it is not an industrial loco it should be a loco that was still around in the BR steam era so how about a Stainer or Fowler 2-6-2 tank. Both should appeal to a wide range of modellers and areas.

If the industrial theme is to be continued then I would suggest some of the Sentinal locos like the vertical boilered, geared drive locomotives which built in late 1920's but were still around in the 1950 ( one was on the Criggion branch of the Shropshire & Montgomery Railway during the WD lease period.) Prehaps a Sentinal diesal-hydraulic locomotive which was produced around the mid fifties when Rolls Royce took over the company, plenty of scope liveries etc. If you are thinking outside the envelope what about a 'fireless' industrail machine.

[PGH]

Well Chris Klein, you asked for and certainly got a large number of different suggestions for the next Ixion loco, including BR diesel (Oh Dear !), BR steam, various locos of the Big Four, industrial diesel, various industrial steam, including fireless, crane tank and Garratt locos, and even a Wickham trolley (!). How many of these, especially the more esoteric or expensive to produce, would sell 500 to 1000 units is perhaps debatable.

 

As you obviously consider the Hudswell Clarke to have been a success, consider its attributes – it is reasonably priced; attractive; small (ideal for minimum space layouts); performs well (mine certainly does) and, perhaps the most significant, its not specific to any particular railway, location or time period. Now which of those suggested would satisfy all those criteria ?

 

One prototype suggested that would tick more of the boxes than most is the Hunslet Austerity/J94, but this has been done, rather badly in my opinion, by Bachmann in brass. One drawback of this model for me is the boxed in area under the boiler for the gearbox where there should be clear space, and the Ixion Hudswell Clarke has a similar arrangement, although this is mitigated to some extent by the low boiler and partly hidden by details such as the springs. Maybe this feature doesn’t worry other folk, but if a similar drive arrangement and compromise in appearance is being considered for the next loco perhaps a side tank would be the most suitable prototype.

 

Whatever the prototype, the model should certainly have better quality control. My Hudswell Clarke arrived with some paint chips down to bare metal (sign of careless handling ?), slight red overspray from the buffer beams and a frame guard iron badly (and barely) attached. These are all annoying but fairly minor points easily rectified apart from a paint chip on the chimney rim which still shows after being retouched. The bunker backplate is not attached to the sides particularly well and also slightly misaligned, and will require removal and re-fixing. The paper discs on the wheel centres were all partly loose and curled at the edges, and had to be removed. The necessary alteration to the wiring was fairly straightforward but fiddly as the terminals are quite tiny and close together. The biggest problem with that job was removal of the saddle tank. According to the instructions it should be lifted at the front first and slid forward to avoid damaging the two protrusions at the rear of the tank, but this proved impossible as the tank was wedged firmly between the firebox and the smokebox. It was only after much fiddling that I found the protrusions had been removed and the tank actually lifted straight off. These are perhaps minor irritations and problems that can be fixed, but should you really have to do this on a new loco ?

[IWCR]

How about a Beyer Peacock 2-4-0T, this is a small locomotive of simple design, verying sizes were produced over a long timescale and some research would be needed to identify a suitable size for the most widespread appeal.

They were used by many UK railways during mid-late victorian times, Midland, GWR, Isle of Wight, MIdland & South Western Jnc etc some lasting into the 1930's. Also widley exported: Sweden, Holland and others including Australia which also built copies, some of the australian locos ran into the 1970's. A model could be produced to represent some of these with the further potential of detail alterations by purchasers for others.

 

Pete

[chaz]

If I was voting purely for myself (and I don't see why I shouldn't) I'd opt for...

 

an LNER 0-6-0 tender engine but NOT a J39....

 

how about a J6?

[Willy]

I would suggest another standard gauge industrial loco in 7mm scale.

 

A Peckett R4 0-4-0ST would be my first choice because no kit is currently available an plenty were made so there is scope for a variety of individual locos to be modelled. It also can cover a decent timespan of use from the 1920s to the 1970s.

 

Or any industrial 0-4-0ST industrial steam loco would do.

 

Failing that an industrial diesel but I would not go with the suggestion of a RH 48DS because it has been done by more than one kit manufacturer.

 

 

 

For my part, I would like to see a continuation with the Industrial/Light railway theme and the production of a loco that is not already available in kit form and one that could be found throughout the country and over a long time span and in my mind your suggestion of a Peckett R4 0-4-0ST, or similar, fits the bill perfectly and I would certainly buy one.

 

Willy

[HarryP]

Ideally a GER 209 (LNER Y5) one preserved or a (LNER J69/67/68) GER R24, C72 or S56 that you could utilise the chassis for three different engines. The 209 would suit industrial users/micro layouts and multi-liveries.

[81A Oldoak]

Thank you for the suggestions so far. We are gathering information on a couple of prototypes that has aroused our interest, but no clues for the time being and please keep the suggestions coming.

 

Just to clarify a couple of points raised on this string. We sold the tools and remaining stock of the N Gauge Manor to Dapol. We have not ruled out N Gauge, but a return seems unlikely in the foreseeable future as our interest rests with the larger scales. We have also been asked if we will produce a 4mm scale version of the Hudswell Clarke, which has sold over 550 pieces in O Gauge since its launch in August this year. We are not convinced about a 4mm version as it is not simply a matter of scaling down. It would require a completely new design and tooling and a long production run. We don't really like the look of the 4mm scale market, which tends to display some of the less agreeable features of an arms race.

 

Regards,

 

Chris Klein

Ixion Model Railways Ltd

[Tricky-CRS]

Hi Chris

Thank you for the update re N gauge, shame that the Mogel is not coming soon. Hopefully someone else will do it, come on Dapol.

[2A-Rail]

Surely the Drummond Pug, a basic model with possibilities of all variants, could be a good model? Caledonian, North British and Industrial variants that I can think of, which could be given LNER, LMS and British Railways branding too. I recall Steam Railway running an article on them being quite common, so possibly a model that could suit a fair portion of the current market.

 

Johnny

[steve fay]

Being WR biased I would say a 14xx auto tank. It does not matter that Tower do one already because if tower did the Hudswell Clarke in brass it would cost three times the amount. I think that goes for anything else thats been made previously in brass and any other metal.

I would say a pannier but I'm sure Dapol have it covered.

[hespertalbahn]

_{A Fowler diesel (early version) as a standard gauge loco -very useful for small shunting layouts- or the Southwold Railway 2-4-0 (Sharp Stewart) as an appealing narrow gauge loco in 0-16.5 (I know, the gauge isn't correct).}

 

_Dirk

[Guest Isambarduk]

"_{A Fowler diesel (early version) as a standard gauge loco -very useful for small shunting layouts}"

 

Indeed, it would be, Dirk. Something along these lines, perhaps: www.davidlosmith.co.uk/LMS_Fowler.htm or the GWR version which is superficially very similar but which is actually quite different in many dimensions and in most details.

 

Trouble is, if Ixion do decide to release this prototype, 'everybody' will have one without having to go to all the research and effort that I did to have mine! Actually, Ixon already did this with their Hudswell Clarke because I was making good progress on my 'small engine project with Easingwold No. 2 when their RTR model was announced - of course, I had to have one and it will be 'knocked about a bit' to become GCR no, 278, which worked at Immingham Docks and did have 10-spoke wheels (like Ixion's model); my Easingwold No.2 has the correct Slater's 12-spoke wheels.

 

Nevertheless, a Fowler 0-4-0DM is a sound suggestion for the very reason that you give.

 

We'll have to wait and see!

 

David

[The Nth Degree]

Please not GWR. Every man and his dog have it covered and I'm already bored of hearing about it after less than three years in the hobby.

 

Although I'd love to see a diesel type 2 loco, I doubt this is where you're going to head so I would stick to a winning formula - it's doing well, after all. PGH above has made some excellent points in his second paragraph and from a pure business perspective you can't ignore these. However, unlike him, if my loco arrived damaged it would have gone straight back to you, regardless of what it cost. It's one thing making a sale - keeping it is something else.

 

Best of luck

[Guest Isambarduk]

If you mean "... it is reasonably priced; attractive; small (ideal for minimum space layouts); performs well (mine certainly does) and, perhaps the most significant, its not specific to any particular railway, location or time period. " when you say "PGH above has made some excellent points in his second paragraph" then I would have thought that an early Fowler 0-4-0DM ticks all those boxes, particularly the "not specific to any particular railway, location or time period". It makes no difference to me, though - I've already got one! It's LMS as it happens, but most of them were in industrial use and lasted a good long time, so they could reasonably be posed as anywhere at anytime. Or am I missing the point?

[Nick]

I'll change my approach and say that I would be interested in something small and industrial that could be found into the late '70's.

 

Cheers!

 

Nick

[Chris Heighton]

Possibly a little too niche, but might I suggest an Armstrong Whitworth 0-4-0DE shunter? One of the forerunners of modern Diesel Electric traction, and used all over the country from the 1920s to the late 1960s in industrial sites from Tyneside to Llanelly, Chatham and Shoeburyness. One even worked a regualr passenger service in the 1950s on the famous North Sunderland Railway. Two survive in preservation, with a similar one still apperently in active service in Sri Lanka.

[marsa69]

Another idea would be the Hudswell Clarke locos from the Manchester Ship Canal system. Very handsome little industrials and could possibly use the current chassis. (or am I wide of the mark on that one?)

JF

 

I'd agree with this having worked on one as a lad at the ELR. But I'm another one that would love to see a RTR Class 25

[gwrman]

I'd like to see a ready to run Beatie Well Tank to make a nice china clay layout.

Nigel

[PatB]

I'd go along with the suggestions of a light, general purpose 0-6-0 tender loco from any of the pre-group companies. Dean Goods is the obvious choice but, as noted at least once upthread, the GWR was not the only company in Britain. Something ex-GE perhaps.

 

Mind you, I'd be very tempted by the Armstrong Whitworth diesel. I'm interested in the NSR but don't yet feel up to scratchbuilding The Lady Armstrong.

[boeing757]

Just a J15 please.

B

[Hugh Flynn]

Hi

Simple for me either class 24 or 25 both ran green / blue period not to big a loco also chance for a few limited editions ones in other liveries.

Hugh

[Jack]

I'll change my approach and say that I would be interested in something small and industrial that could be found into the late '70's.

 

That'd be a 1:43.5 model of Andy Y then