fender Posted November 3, 2012 Share Posted November 3, 2012 I've been having a look through my books and can only find references to ship building (prior to the 1930s) and ship repair thereafter. does anyone know if there would have been any significant goods traffic between the docks and the Maritime line/CML? or were the lines around the dockyard mainly for moving things around there, with the occasional delivery of some coal/parts/machines etc from the main line? thanks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torr Giffard LSWR 1951-71 Posted November 3, 2012 Share Posted November 3, 2012 Aft'noon Fender, Steam into Cornwall Vol 129 by B&R shows some nice early 1960s freight wagon footage. I'm sure that many of the wagons would also have been seen in the 50s. Fuel for the ships was a key traffic. There were many internal user wagons too. Cheers Dave Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyH Posted November 3, 2012 Share Posted November 3, 2012 I believe traffic never lived up to expectations from the outset and have never seen extensive freight in photos at the docks. Most seemed to be collected and delivered to Penryn. Transport Treasury has some interesting photos of the docks. As stated quite a bit was fuel oil and i believe other oils which linked to the pipeline as well as storage tanks at boslowick and sidings at Penmere. I would like to visit Falmouth Poly's photo archives as they have quite a collection. Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fender Posted November 3, 2012 Author Share Posted November 3, 2012 great! so if I do a Maritime line layout I'll be able to put in some tankers and a few wagon trains as well as the usual vans etc. there was a cattle dock at Perranwell as well, so could be some traffic for that. cheers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium ArthurK Posted November 3, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 3, 2012 Can't help with the traffic but this slide may be of help. Taken August 1959. ArthurK Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bon Accord Posted November 3, 2012 Share Posted November 3, 2012 What a great shot of Falmouth as was! In the 50s and 60s, Falmouth never seemed to be without a BP tanker in for repairs/overhaul, plus a few ships from NZSCo, Blue Star and Port line. The companies, the ships and the men that crewed them are all now long gone of course. The ship in the photo looks to be a wartime built BP '12' (12000dwt class), and going by the length of name I'll take a stab at her being 'British Patience'. Here's another couple of photos of the docks, a few railway wagons can be seen on the dockside lines, but it looks pretty sparse traffic wise. The good ship British Duchess taking certain stage, with a veritable who's who of the Merchant Navy in the background. For a dockyard, the place does look very tidy indeed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldSutt Posted November 3, 2012 Share Posted November 3, 2012 Touch of nostalgia. Had lunch in the early 50's on a NZ line ship in Falmouth dock and encountered my first hot curry! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fender Posted November 3, 2012 Author Share Posted November 3, 2012 ^^^thanks for those pics Arthur and Jim. I was wondering where they were taken from, if you don't mind my asking, a crane? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bon Accord Posted November 3, 2012 Share Posted November 3, 2012 Not from a crane, there's a viewing gallery adjoining Pendennis Rise, situated above the dockyard. You can see it on Google Maps here: https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?rlz=1G1GGLQ_ENUK248&q=pendennis+rise+falmouth&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hl=en&sa=N&tab=wl Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted November 3, 2012 Share Posted November 3, 2012 Might I suggest that as a (mainly) repair yard, rather than either a shipbuilding yard or a commercial cargo port, traffic in and out would be fairly limited. Inbound traffic might include plate, tube, and section for repair work, bagged shot for shot-blasting, lubricants, and things like refurbished screws. Outbound traffic would mainly have been empty wagons, and possibly scrap. Fuel oil would possibly have come by sea. In recent years, traffic has included used shot from shot-blasting (which I think went to somewhere in the north-west for disposal). Internal traffic, however, would be much more significant, with heavy components being moved around the site- in Arthur's photo, the wagon next to the loco seems to have a screw on it. The vans would probably served as tool vans for the different trades. Looking at the number of vessels in those photos, I would guess that it's about equivalent to the entire British-registered merchant fleet these days. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted November 3, 2012 Share Posted November 3, 2012 Just to support Brian W's comment, note that almost all the wagons that appear in those shots appear to be internal users (of which Falmouth had a very interesting selection - http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/falmouthdocks) so it's likely that mainline vehicles would have come in, been unloaded and thence out again. Adam Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fender Posted November 3, 2012 Author Share Posted November 3, 2012 Might I suggest that as a (mainly) repair yard, rather than either a shipbuilding yard or a commercial cargo port, traffic in and out would be fairly limited. Inbound traffic might include plate, tube, and section for repair work, bagged shot for shot-blasting, lubricants, and things like refurbished screws. Outbound traffic would mainly have been empty wagons, and possibly scrap. Fuel oil would possibly have come by sea. In recent years, traffic has included used shot from shot-blasting (which I think went to somewhere in the north-west for disposal). Internal traffic, however, would be much more significant, with heavy components being moved around the site- in Arthur's photo, the wagon next to the loco seems to have a screw on it. The vans would probably served as tool vans for the different trades. Looking at the number of vessels in those photos, I would guess that it's about equivalent to the entire British-registered merchant fleet these days. yes, that's what I thought. still, a few bits and bobs going through, but not the long trains of goods I had envisaged. thanks for that. -------- thanks for the link Adam. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium ArthurK Posted November 3, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 3, 2012 The ship in the photo looks to be a wartime built BP '12' (12000dwt class), and going by the length of name I'll take a stab at her being 'British Patience'. Good guess, it is indeed 'British Patience', 'Britsh Bulldog' was in the next dock. Give me a little time and I will post that as well. I think that I have about five photos of the docks. The first wagon four(?) large 'buckets' on it. Looks like a tarry substance. ArthurK Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bon Accord Posted November 3, 2012 Share Posted November 3, 2012 Good guess, it is indeed 'British Patience', 'Britsh Bulldog' was in the next dock. Give me a little time and I will post that as well. I think that I have about five photos of the docks. The first wagon four(?) large 'buckets' on it. Looks like a tarry substance. ArthurK Arthur, Many thanks - I've always thought British Bulldog was a simply fantastic name for a ship! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyH Posted November 3, 2012 Share Posted November 3, 2012 Thr Middleton Press 'Branch Lines to Falmouth, Helston and St. Ives' is useful too. Regard Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bon Accord Posted November 3, 2012 Share Posted November 3, 2012 In the book Steam in Cornwall by Peter Grey there is a picture of British Guardsman in dry dock too British Bombardier, British Dominion, British Dragoon, British Faith, British Fidelity, British Grenadier, British Hero, British Honour, British Industry, British Justice, British Pride, British Progress, British Resolution, British Respect, British Spirit, British Valour.... All great names, and mostly forgotten, a victim of the more politically correct times we live in - the present fleet (a connection in name only, and a mere shadow of its former self) has names like 'British Environment'. Pfffftttt..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium ArthurK Posted November 3, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 3, 2012 Two more photos as promised. "British Patience" and "British Bulldog" ArthurK Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold chris p bacon Posted November 3, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 3, 2012 What a great shot of Falmouth as was! In the 50s and 60s, Falmouth never seemed to be without a BP tanker in for repairs/overhaul, Off topic but that's how my Father & Mother (from Penryn) met, as he was such a regular visitor to Falmouth. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bon Accord Posted November 4, 2012 Share Posted November 4, 2012 Two more photos as promised. "British Patience" and "British Bulldog" ArthurK Arthur, What a cracking brace of photos. The steam emanating from the Bulldog (and of the Duchess in my earlier shots) is of course form the steam windlass, whilst in the penultimate photo I can see a Port liner, a Hains tramp, a Federal liner (I think either Piako or Essex) and another BP job in the background. The detail on deck of both ships is something else, obviously well looked after and a complete contrast to modern times where most ships go into dock in a right state, both on deck and overside. You can see the canvas windsails projecting vertically from the tanklids - these were used to induct fresh air into the cargo tanks so that they'd be safe to enter, these having been replaced by air/water powered fans these days. Another long forgotten feature is the awning spars around the accommodation, used to support the canvas awnings rigged in tropical climes and not required on modern ships what with the universal adoption of air conditioning. Tell the kids today that you went 'up the gulf' in summer, enduring 50 degrees celsius with no AC, and sleeping at night on deck wrapped in a thin cotton blanket (in temps of 30 odd) because it was impossible to sleep in your cabin, surviving for weeks/months on copious amounts of desalinated water, G&T's, barley sugars and salt tablets and they won't believe you! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Tankerman Posted November 5, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 5, 2012 What a great shot of Falmouth as was! In the 50s and 60s, Falmouth never seemed to be without a BP tanker in for repairs/overhaul, plus a few ships from NZSCo, Blue Star and Port line. The companies, the ships and the men that crewed them are all now long gone of course. The ship in the photo looks to be a wartime built BP '12' (12000dwt class), and going by the length of name I'll take a stab at her being 'British Patience'. Here's another couple of photos of the docks, a few railway wagons can be seen on the dockside lines, but it looks pretty sparse traffic wise. The good ship British Duchess taking certain stage, with a veritable who's who of the Merchant Navy in the background. For a dockyard, the place does look very tidy indeed. All of these photos brought back happy memories, and made me realise just how old I am, as I worked in Falmouth Docks from 1962 to 1968. The first five years as an electrical apprentice and then tradesman until I went to sea with Trident Tankers in 1968. However the second photo in this post has been printed back to front as the wharf behind No 2 dry dock was/is the Northern Arm, and the ship on the inside of it would have had her bow pointing seaward, i.e. to the right not the left. She is one of the trio built during the war by Alexander Stephens in Glasgow which were named Papanui, Paparoa and Pipiriki. The Federal isn't the Essex as she had a long midships superstructure, I am almost certain that she is one of the group built as war loss replacements after WWII, some of which took 'County' names under Federal and some 'New Zealand' names for the New Zealand Shipping Co. They used to come in every year for about two or three months during the off season for the Australia/New Zealand trade and one of the jobs for the electrical shop was to strip down all the winch controllers in the deckhouses and repair/replace all the contacts in the drum type speed controllers. I did so many that after nearly 50 years I can still remember how it was done. The tanker at the landward end of the Western wharf is one of H E Moss', probably the Lucellum, the very interesting one is the one behind the Bulldog and Patience which looks as if she is fire damaged. Sorry about going off topic so much, the problem is that ships get into the blood just like railways, to get back to the original query about rail traffic. In the '50's and early 60's there was quite a variety of rail traffic, but not necessarily large quantities. Traffic to the Docks included fresh meat for the ship suppliers in either insulated vans or sometimes insulated containers, steel plate came in on bogie bolsters or well wagons, bitumen in tank wagons, which were discharged into the heated storage tanks to the left of No 1 Dock and in the 1960's 'grit blast pellets' in vans. The latter were put in a siding to the left hand side of No 4 Dock and the internal wagons put on the parallel track and the bags transferred from one to the other. Traffic to Falmouth station included some cattle feed from Avonmouth, although as Andy H said most of this went to Penryn. An occasional traffic was the delivery of tractors and other agricultural vehicles using one of the end docks behind the goods shed, and some coal traffic to one of the sidings accessed from the small lane to the north of the station. It was also common to see a Fruit D van attached to one of the afternoon passenger trains for Truro. Hope this has been of some use, and sorry again for going on about the ships. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xerces Fobe2 Posted November 5, 2012 Share Posted November 5, 2012 A number of cranes in the photos are still in use today at the docks. Oil tanks ran to the docks to what ik new in later years as the FOC - Falmouth Oil Company. My namesake and good friend D820 wiill no doubt have more in-depth information on freight workings to the docks XF Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fender Posted November 6, 2012 Author Share Posted November 6, 2012 All of these photos brought back happy memories, and made me realise just how old I am, as I worked in Falmouth Docks from 1962 to 1968. The first five years as an electrical apprentice and then tradesman until I went to sea with Trident Tankers in 1968. However the second photo in this post has been printed back to front as the wharf behind No 2 dry dock was/is the Northern Arm, and the ship on the inside of it would have had her bow pointing seaward, i.e. to the right not the left. She is one of the trio built during the war by Alexander Stephens in Glasgow which were named Papanui, Paparoa and Pipiriki. The Federal isn't the Essex as she had a long midships superstructure, I am almost certain that she is one of the group built as war loss replacements after WWII, some of which took 'County' names under Federal and some 'New Zealand' names for the New Zealand Shipping Co. They used to come in every year for about two or three months during the off season for the Australia/New Zealand trade and one of the jobs for the electrical shop was to strip down all the winch controllers in the deckhouses and repair/replace all the contacts in the drum type speed controllers. I did so many that after nearly 50 years I can still remember how it was done. The tanker at the landward end of the Western wharf is one of H E Moss', probably the Lucellum, the very interesting one is the one behind the Bulldog and Patience which looks as if she is fire damaged. Sorry about going off topic so much, the problem is that ships get into the blood just like railways, to get back to the original query about rail traffic. In the '50's and early 60's there was quite a variety of rail traffic, but not necessarily large quantities. Traffic to the Docks included fresh meat for the ship suppliers in either insulated vans or sometimes insulated containers, steel plate came in on bogie bolsters or well wagons, bitumen in tank wagons, which were discharged into the heated storage tanks to the left of No 1 Dock and in the 1960's 'grit blast pellets' in vans. The latter were put in a siding to the left hand side of No 4 Dock and the internal wagons put on the parallel track and the bags transferred from one to the other. Traffic to Falmouth station included some cattle feed from Avonmouth, although as Andy H said most of this went to Penryn. An occasional traffic was the delivery of tractors and other agricultural vehicles using one of the end docks behind the goods shed, and some coal traffic to one of the sidings accessed from the small lane to the north of the station. It was also common to see a Fruit D van attached to one of the afternoon passenger trains for Truro. Hope this has been of some use, and sorry again for going on about the ships. very useful! and don't worry, the ships stuff is interesting too. thanks Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubbles2 Posted November 6, 2012 Share Posted November 6, 2012 Some pictures here. http://www.flickr.co...s-45603744@N06/ and here. http://www.flickr.co...in/photostream/ and some more. http://www.flickr.com/photos/38339202@N00/6089261061/in/photostream/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xerces Fobe2 Posted November 6, 2012 Share Posted November 6, 2012 Excellent pictures there I see one shows the Peckett gonig up the freshly ballasted connection to the branch - Were the Docks locomotives allowed into the run round loop of the branch at Falmouth station? The Dock locos would never be allowed access to the branch as BR very rarely allowed provate loco on there lines and also after the Falmouth Signal Box closed in the 1960's there would have been no safe way managing this type of operation. The Dock locos collected and returned wagons from the exchange sidings behind the station; these sidings are still in place under a lot of foliage XF Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyH Posted November 6, 2012 Share Posted November 6, 2012 I do have a photo of a docks engine on the Bar Road bridge in the late 60's. I think it is a transport treasury image, but do not have it to hand. Andy P.S.I like the way the current PW staff have painted the sign for the points in Chocolate and Cream. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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