Hornby Magazine OO Gauge Brake Tender

[CloggyDog]

Also useful for passenger workings...

 

 

I'm guessing the Brush 4 burst and was rescued by pinching a passing Derby 2 off it's freight.

 

Note the car carriers at the back of the train.

Edited December 6, 2013 by CloggyDeux

[Porcy Mane]

Marcroft 1/557s:

 

I'm off to revise my text!

 

I'm also thinking to compile a full Brake Tender database to nail down the detail differences.

And the end faces don't look as steeply raked.

Your database could turn out to be a lifetimes work... and after the last couple of pages, I'll bet my bottom dollar there was loads of variations from new to scrap, on each individual tender over their short life.

I gave up on mine after looking at how the signwriters seemed to go mad with them during the rail Blue Period. Some looked like they had just had a bucket of fonts tipped over them.

P 

[Porcy Mane]

Also useful for passenger workings...

 

 

I'm guessing the Brush 4 burst and was rescued by pinching a passing Derby 2 off it's freight.

 

It may also have been Mr Ermel that just south of here, photographed the down Heart of Midlothian(double headed by Class 24s) being rescued by another Sulzer with two brake tenders. That in turn had to be rescued by another Class 24 with DBT. It was reported in the contempory railway press at the time. 

 

I'm told the photo definitely exists.

 

Trumpted Ya...

 Edit: Whilst checking back through old Trains Illustrated to see if I can find the report of the above incident (And just to check the facts so as not to let the truth get in the way of a good story!) I came across a rather nice pic of D1 with DBT leaving Kirby sidings being piloted by 4F 43888. 14/07/1963. This in turn reminded me that I have a neg of a V2 hauing a DBT on the east Coast main Line near to Chester le Street. 

So who needs a nasty Diesel to pull a DBT.

Edited December 6, 2013 by Porcy Mane

[CloggyDog]

Your database could turn out to be a lifetimes work... and after the last couple of pages, I'll bet my bottom dollar there was loads of variations from new to scrap, on each individual tender over their short life.

I gave up on mine after looking at how the signwriters seemed to go mad with them during the rail Blue Period. Some looked like they had just had a bucket of fonts tipped over them.

 

 

You could be right... I was working through the detail differences (handwheel spokes, hand grabs (side and end), guard irons, bogie end steps, access holes, coupling compartment, lamp irons, OLE warning flashes...), plus the more obvious diag, bogie type. Hadn't even considered livery/lettering... Maybe if I get bored over Xmas

[adrianbs]

Hi All Both 557s in one day!! I don't think 30 has tumblehome either, maybe these two are the ones built with new

underframes rather than second hand. 29 certainly looks like a short body by comparison with 556 photos.

so whose going to fiddle about with the H/M model and fit LMS bogies. Maybe quit a few if the bogies need replacing

anyway. Regards all adrianbs

[Porcy Mane]

You could be right... I was working through the detail differences (handwheel spokes, hand grabs (side and end), guard irons, bogie end steps, access holes, coupling compartment, lamp irons, OLE warning flashes...), plus the more obvious diag, bogie type. Hadn't even considered livery/lettering... Maybe if I get bored over Xmas

 

A mate and I started doing the same for BR Brake vans. We soon realised life’s too short.  (but it showed up some interesting anomalies.)

 

Porcy.

Who should be getting on with far more important "stuff".

[Porcy Mane]

Hi All Both 557s in one day!! I don't think 30 has tumblehome either, maybe these two are the ones built with new

underframes rather than second hand. 29 certainly looks like a short body by comparison with 556 photos.

I wonder if it was because Standard built 029 that accounts for the different rake to the ends???

 

P

[adrianbs]

Hi All I have just realised that Dapol could supply their own LMS bogies for a Dia 556. I have seen so little of

their range around I had forgotten they still offer the old Airfix LMS coaches which I suppose they can still produce

unless they are just old stock. Seems even stranger that H/M are producing a new bogie under these circumstances

unless there are additional reasons for tooling up a new bogie. This must be almost doubling the tooling costs with

consequent increases in the retail price. Without discount they are not exactly cheap, especially when compared with the

new Hornby Railroad BR Mk 1 coaches. It would be very enlightening to know why this route was not chosen especially as

the original CADs showed the 556 body length, albeit with tumblehome which could, had it been removed, have made the

tooling a bit cheaper.

It looks as though we will have to wait for the production models before we know exactly what is going to be offered

and if the last CADs have been significantly altered in the light of points raised in the forum.

Regards all adrianbs

[7013]

Interesting comment in Hornby magazine today with the update on the B/T. " Following feedback on the project the exact identities of the vehicles are being reviewed" Hopefully they have been reading your comments Adrian.

[Clive Mortimore]

Hi All Both 557s in one day!! I don't think 30 has tumblehome either, maybe these two are the ones built with new

underframes rather than second hand. 29 certainly looks like a short body by comparison with 556 photos.

so whose going to fiddle about with the H/M model and fit LMS bogies. Maybe quit a few if the bogies need replacing

anyway. Regards all adrianbs

Hi Adrian

 

Started 029 some time ago.

 

I was going to donate the bogies to a 1/556 I am building but on seeing the photos of both 1/557s I will finish it as 029.

 

I have fitted 8ft LNER bogies (Bachmann ones) to my 1/558

 

I will be using the older Hornby LNER boiges for a Cowlairs jobby as they have the footboards.

[adrianbs]

Hi Clive,   How many B/Ts do you have !!! ??    There don't seem to be many Gresley bogies, with steps, under B/Ts  I assume they may have taken them off if

  they were in poor condition.  I noticed the recent Hornby models no longer have steps, are they a "fix it yourself" item with the coach or just not supplied at all ??

  I have not bought any of their coaches due to the silly errors but may indulge in a full brake once I can find one of the latest ones with the beading in the

  right place at a sensible price   The current price reflects the cost of rectifying these errors which I assume has meant completely new side tooling for every

  coach except perhaps the full brake which I am not sure had been issued with the incorrect beading.. That Gremlin-Boffin in the back room had a field day with

  Hornby's LNER coaches.  At least the LNER is now pretty well served for coaching stock as are the SR and LMS to a lesser extent, now the poor relation is the

  GWR  with only late period Colletts and transition Hawkesworths plus an autocoach and B set to a good standard. 

      I wonder if Mike Wild has rectified any of the near a dozen errors on his LNER bogies as shown in the last CAD. Was it just lack of info (doubtful);  inabilitity

  to use CAD, or missing his appointment at Specsavers ??  All that effort when he could have used available LMS bogies and done a 556.

          Regards  all  adrianbs  B.Sc;(Eng.);  A.C.G.I;;   F.Q.R.C.   (fully qualified rivet counter)

[RCAR6015]

The comment in the Hornby magazine also states "  Tooling work for the 00 gauge diesel brake tender model  was completed in late November with the first sample expected to arrive imminently for evaluation"

So where do Hornby magazine go from here in order to arrive at an accurate model?

[cctransuk]

The comment in the Hornby magazine also states "  Tooling work for the 00 gauge diesel brake tender model  was completed in late November with the first sample expected to arrive imminently for evaluation"

So where do Hornby magazine go from here in order to arrive at an accurate model?

 

I suspect that there is some frantic research underway!

 

" Following feedback on the project the exact identities of the vehicles are being reviewed" suggests to me that they are hoping against hope that there is an authentic identity that they can apply to the model that has already been tooled. I think that they'll find that the answer is a resounding "No"!

 

I'm afraid that I have no sympathy - we did try to help when the subject was first raised but it seems that we wasted our time; our information apparently fell upon deaf ears.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

[the-gog]

The comment in the Hornby magazine also states "  Tooling work for the 00 gauge diesel brake tender model  was completed in late November with the first sample expected to arrive imminently for evaluation"

So where do Hornby magazine go from here in order to arrive at an accurate model?

The bin?

[stewartingram]

I forsee some reader offers with the subscription copies next year....................

 

Stewart

[Enterprisingwestern]

I forsee some reader offers with the subscription copies next year....................

 

Stewart

 

Also an upturn in Adrian's sales.

 

Mike.

[adrianbs]

        Hi All  No good crying over spilt milk, no doubt H/M will sell out before anyone can even get a sample for review, let alone get the review on sale in the shops.

        That is how manufacturers get away with this sort of product.  We can be sure it will get an early  rave review in at least one  magazine and the others will

        either have to buy a sample or find someone who has one, to review it.  Remember what happened with the Dapol 7mm wagons, as far as I know, no samples

        have been sent to the GOG for review and they had cleared most of their stock to their retailers before anyone had a chance to write a review or even see

        the finished article.  Quite whether anyone at Dapol was able to influence any part of this model we wait to hear. Perhaps when the reviews come out and are

        less than complimentary they will claim it was made to  "The Customer's Specification". in much the same way as the H/M  Stove R.  Of course there are other

        options but I shouldn't mention any names for fear of being criticised. The worst culprits are the modellers themselves for buying products "Sight unseen" but

        one has to have some sympathy for them, they know that if they don't, and the model turns out to be excellent, there may not be any left to buy.

                  I wonder what the next H/M "Special Issue" will be             Regards  all  adrianbs

Edited June 13, 2014 by adrianbs

[adrianbs]

        Hi all   I am beginning to realise where some of the errors on the Gresley bogies may have been derived from.  Instead of going back to basics and the

          "Real Thing"  I have a feeling that he has made the fatal mistake of considering that Hornby are the "Fount of all Knowledge"   I decided to see if there

         were any cheap  Hornby new issue full brakes and try to find some goodish closeups and Lo and Behold, 'twas not the Angel Gabrielle but Hells Angels

         Gresley bogies which looked suspiciously like Mike Wild's.  There are a number of errors on the Hornby bogies which seem to be a bit of an amalgam

         of both heavy and light duty variants and some errors just like Mike's !!   The "New" !! Hornby coaches still have the overwide solebars and I believe

         they also have other chassis errors as the old chassis is still in use, more or less, but at least the body looks rather better.  I am assuming that the H/M

         bogies are "Brand New" as they have more errors than the Hornby ones so they are not buying them in from Hornby unless it is just errors on the CADs.

                  Perhaps everyone should write to Hornby or Bachmann and suggest a Dia 556 provided they use the correct variant of the LMS bogie !!

                                   Goodnight All     adrianbs 

[Clive Mortimore]

Hi Clive,   How many B/Ts do you have !!! ??  

Hi Adrian

 

Lets see, there is your one needing some exhibtion damage repair, new brake handwheels. There is the Inter city one, needing a good lick of paint. then there is my 1/557 as in the photo, two scratchbuilt 1/555s in the same state, the two new scratchbuilt tenders , a 1/555 "Cowlairs jobby" and a 1/556 long un and a 1/558 Stratford square body. Not forgetting a vac formed body I picked up years ago that tonight had filler put on all its rounded corners that are ment to be square.

 

The two new ones had Millput slapped on this evening and hopefully tomorrow I will get time to file it smooth. Photos of progress will appear on http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/79397-diesel-brake-tender/ tomorrow.

[Jack]

Hi Adrian

 

Lets see, there is your one needing some exhibtion damage repair, new brake handwheels. There is the Inter city one, needing a good lick of paint. then there is my 1/557 as in the photo, two scratchbuilt 1/555s in the same state, the two new scratchbuilt tenders , a 1/555 "Cowlairs jobby" and a 1/556 long un and a 1/558 Stratford square body. Not forgetting a vac formed body I picked up years ago that tonight had filler put on all its rounded corners that are ment to be square.

 

The two new ones had Millput slapped on this evening and hopefully tomorrow I will get time to file it smooth. Photos of progress will appear on http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/79397-diesel-brake-tender/ tomorrow.

 

Love me tender, love me true ...

[Enterprisingwestern]

Love me tender, love me true ...

 

Stop it, you're braking me up.

 

Mike.

[CloggyDog]

Confirmation in the Feb 2014 Hornby Magazine that the model will be diagram 1/555 short/rounded with tumblehome and Gresley bogies - running numbers being amended to suit.

[adrianbs]

      Hi All    Pity it will be a 555 but if the bogies have not been vastly upgraded  it will only appeal to those who don't care much about accuracy, 

       Attached is a list of faults,  just on the bogies if the last CADS are what the model will be made to.

  1).  No radius to bottom edge of side frames 

  2).  Massively overthick frames, more like a class 66 ( I think those are the ones)

  3). Top flange of frames too narrow

  4). Top flange continues to end instead of tapering off to finsh short of the end frame.

  5).  End of end frame not shown on side detail 

  6).  Incorrect rivet pattern around axleboxes and some missing. 

  7)   Missing and incorrectly positioned  rivets on side where spring stops are fitted 

  8)  No rear detail of spring stop etc behind sideframe.

  9)  Centre spring cluster in wrong plane 

 10)  Mirrored handles etc on axleboxes due to forgetting to change handed items 

 11)  Incorrect  shape of sideframes particularly at ends. 

 12)  Axlebox keeper area seems to be completely missing 

 13)  Brakeshoes wrong shape,and size  

 14)  Brakeshoes in wrong position  vertically and  laterally even for OO and probably will have to be removed  for EM and P4 and replaced somehow. 

 15)  End cross member rivet detail incorrect. 

 16)  End cross member does not have radiussed edges.  And that is only the obvious faults visible on the fairly rudimentary CAD drawings.  Of course 

        there may have been some upgrades since the drawings were published but they have not been seen on the forums or elsewhere nor indeed any

        further comments from Mike Wild.

                              I wonder what the next  Hornby Magazine project will be       Regards  All   adrianbs

Edited June 13, 2014 by adrianbs

[250BOB]

Confirmation in the Feb 2014 Hornby Magazine that the model will be diagram 1/555 short/rounded with tumblehome and Gresley bogies - running numbers being amended to suit.

 

So....how close is this to the real thing.??

[rembrow]

 Of course there may have been some

  upgrades since the drawings were published but they have not been seen on the forums or elsewhere nor indeed any further comments from Mike Wild.

          I wonder what the next  Hornby Magazine project will be       Regards  All   adrianbs

 

The item quoted by Cloggydog from Hornby magazine relates to new information, in that they showed the first photos of the first engineering samples. They also advise that further work is to be done on the brakes and rivet detail on parts of the body. The photos are only partly helpful, as again the sides are only showing at a 45 degree angle, so impossible to judge the length. Mike Wild did state in the article, that further photos of the EP sample and a video of it on a layout could be seen on the hornbymagazine.com website, however I couldn't find these when I looked yesterday.