Wright writes.....

[great northern]

Those photos of Lincoln certainly take me back Tony. Ourebi was quite a late arrival there, as was Hartebeeste. For a long time before that we had Geoffrey Gibbs, and that was the only one we ever saw, except for once when Gemsbok turned up on the York-Yarmouth. Happy days.

[jonny777]

We used to get quite a few named B1s on trains to Skegness and Mablethorpe; especially in the early to mid-60s after the K2 and K3 slaughter. 

 

Ourebi was such a regular that we probably boo-ed it when we saw it "again". 

 

Other regulars were Hartebeeste, Oliver Bury, A Harold Bibby, Geoffrey Gibbs. One strange one that I have underlined, but with no idea where I saw it, or even if I really saw it (misread the number, possibly) is Alexander Reith Gray 61242 which was a Scottish engine, and I had never been north of Scarborough by the end of BR steam. 

[Michael Edge]

I've not built many B1s and I don't own one but here are two.

 

 

Scratchbuilt in 1980, now re-gauged to EM and running on Carlisle.

 

 

This is a 7mm one, built from the Piercy kit (I never want to see another one!) and painted by Ian Rathbone.

[Tony Wright]

Afternoon Tony

I was always really pleased with the finish I managed to achieve on 61175. Has the weathering come adrift slightly on the tender, I can patch that up at some point if you like?

 

You don't happen to have any photos of 61061 in your collection do you?

Good afternoon Tom,

 

The weathering hasn't come adrift at all - it's Hornby's oil. I've never seen stuff which creeps so much. I have a couple of modified Hornby O1s, which I detailed/renumbered/weathered, and they were fine until about a year later. Though it's not a disaster (parts just look 'wet'), the oil originally-applied by the factory is just so persistent. I've not oiled any of them, there's just so much at source. 

 

I'll look through my collection of pictures and see if 61061 is among them. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Edited April 10, 2018 by Tony Wright

[Tony Wright]

I've not built many B1s and I don't own one but here are two.

 

80-25 B1 61032 fl.JPG

 

Scratchbuilt in 1980, now re-gauged to EM and running on Carlisle.

 

07-06 painted rf.JPG

 

This is a 7mm one, built from the Piercy kit (I never want to see another one!) and painted by Ian Rathbone.

Thanks Mike,

 

Ah, Nu-Cast motion (I'm sure that's a Nu-Cast crosshead on 61032); what useful stuff. Along with Jamieson frets of the period, just about all my ECML outside valve gear locos were built with it at the time - long before the likes of Comet came along. 

 

What was wrong with the Piercy kit? It looks wonderful (not just the painting). Didn't DJH take it over? 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Edited April 10, 2018 by Tony Wright

[Tony Wright]

Those photos of Lincoln certainly take me back Tony. Ourebi was quite a late arrival there, as was Hartebeeste. For a long time before that we had Geoffrey Gibbs, and that was the only one we ever saw, except for once when Gemsbok turned up on the York-Yarmouth. Happy days.

I'm glad the pictures evoke memories, Gilbert. 

 

As I mentioned, I only went to Lincoln twice, and never by train. My dad trained as a teacher with a chap from the city, and we went to see him and his family on two occasions in about 1960/'61. He lived in a large house on the city-side, overlooking the Brayford Pool, on a steep hill (not the Steep Hill). From his garden, we could look across towards 40A, which, on both occasions being a Sunday, was packed. My brother and I were allowed to go to East Holmes on the first visit, and the signalman allowed us to walk by the side of the railway adjacent to the shed, but not to cross the tracks. No matter, because we could see a fair bit, including 70011 HOTSPUR simmering outside (a 'cop'!). OUREBI was also present and, to my astonishment, a Crab and an 8F. These types of locos were the sort from my neck of the woods, unexpected so far east; or were they common? On the second visit, activities were more 'family' orientated, though it looked like the shed was still busy. 

 

I have to say, the first day was most-memorable, not at Lincoln itself, but for having (very luckily) been stopped by the gates at Lincoln Road crossing, just south of Markham Moor on the A57 for trains to pass. Given the choice (though I never would have been, being only 14), I'd have asked my parents to leave my brother and me there, rather than go further east. Still, 60088 BOOKLAW was a 'cop', and I never saw it again. 

 

I've written about these experiences, and they'll be published in BRILL later this year. 

 

How many of your old split-chassis B1s need new frames?

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[landscapes]

David,

 

Though I never visited the southern end of the ex-GC main line, my memories in the Sheffield/Retford/Lincoln area are of seeing several named B1s, 61033 DIBATAG being the most common through Kiveton Park. Given its allocation to 41A at the time, then this was not unlikely. Doncaster's 61036 RALPH ASSHETON was a regular at Retford, as was Hull's 61215 WILLIAM HENTON CARVER at Doncaster. 

 

I must admit, I paid them little heed, especially when seen at Retford or Doncaster, because there were always much more exciting 'namers' to take an interest in. 61006 BLACKBUCK from Parkeston Quay was noted at Retford on the boat train one day (deputising for the usual B17?). Another Parkeston named B1 I saw was 61249 FITZHERBERT WRIGHT, observed on, of all places, Crewe South. I took its picture. One ex-namer, 61009 HARTEBEESTE (the plates were off), was seen on a siding at Worksop, having been withdrawn. On the two visits I made to Lincoln, 61026 OUREBI was present. 

 

We'd occasionally get named B1s at Chester, the most-unusual being 61022 SASSABY, standing (not stood) on 6A after working a summer extra into Chester. It's the only time I saw a Gateshead-based loco this far south west. Low Moor's 61039 STEINBOK also worked a special into Chester one day, from the Manchester direction. It came off its train in the General, reversed on the triangle, re-coupled, then headed off towards Crewe, then down the long-closed line to Malpas and Whitchurch. It seemed the special was for ramblers; does anyone have a date for this, please? There was at least one B1-hauled train along the N. Wales coast on a summer Saturday in the '50s, on one day hauled by 61024 ADDAX. I had no idea where Haverton Hill (its home shed) was, but the special must have originated in the North East. I actually saw a named B1 in North Wales, though I cannot now remember which one, at Connah's Quay on the ex-GC (my mother threw out many of my notebooks when I went to teacher training college, assuming I'd grown up!). Looking at my mouldering 61 year old Combined Volume it's one of 61017/18/19 or 61021. Anyone any ideas?

 

61023 small.jpg

 

61026 small.jpg

 

61028 small.jpg

 

Lincoln Central was obviously a good place for seeing named B1s.

 

61033.jpg

 

As was Doncaster.

 

B1 61033.jpg

 

Here's my over-40 year old model of 61033 DIBATAG. I built it from a Jamieson kit and it's all my own work (and it shows). Where are the front steps? The chimney is, err, a chimney and the tender is incorrect for a B1, having the larger cut-out in the sides at the front. Spoked wheels? Speaking of wheels, it's carried on ancient Romfords and Jackson types. Shouldn't the cabside numbers be larger as well? The 'plates were made to my order by Kings Cross Models, and I doubt if they should be red. Looking (critically) at an old model such as this (in comparison with a Hornby B1, say) I wonder whether sometimes I should keep it. It really is poor in comparison (though Hornby's B1 chimney and bogie wheels are just as dud). That said, it still runs, it means I've had a B1 for over four decades and, most importantly, I made it myself. Have I improved in my model-making since 1977? One hopes so! Of course, one can purchase an RTR B1, do it up yourself (with is laudable) or get someone else to 'improve' it for you (which is less so in my opinion, though it does keep professionals in work). And, I do admit to owning a modified Hornby B1, which Tom Foster weathered for me (do you get a whiff of hypocrisy here?). 

 

B1 61175.jpg

 

This modified Hornby B1 is obviously superior to my ancient Jamieson B1, but, in a way, so what? I bought this, and a replacement chimney and bogie wheels, bought the front coupling, renumbered it and added a bit of detail, and good friend Tom weathered it (beautifully). It probably gets used more than 61033, but it's nowhere near 'mine' in the same way. Or, am I being sentimental? 

 

B1 61022.jpg

 

Here's my SASSABY, arrived at by using a Bachmann loco body and tender, and building a Comet chassis to go underneath. Unfortunately, the tender came from a V2, so has the vacuum cylinder on the back (I'll remove it). It has generic Markits wheels. If nothing else, it runs far better than the original split-chassis nonsense which was underneath.

 

B1 61028.jpg

 

This is Ian Wilson's 61028, though I did the work (horse trading, again), fitting yet another Comet chassis under a Bachmann B1 body. This one has the right tender. It's also got Markits proper LNER wheels for a B1, which do make a big difference. 

 

Does anyone else have models of B1s for us to see. I've now got ten, but only three are named.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

Hi Tony

 

Thank you so much for the insight into your transporting days and for posting those lovely photos of the Antelope named B1's.

 

Like you I lost my combined volumes when we moved house in 1970, back in those days I never dreamed there would be a huge preservation movement I thought steam locomotives apart from the museum pieces were gone forever so I didn't worry to much, how I wish I had them now.

 

I do like your B1 locomotive models and all weathered to perfection, in answer to your question I have three B1's two of the new Hornby models, one is 61243 Sir Harold Mitchell as it was produced the other is 61025 Pallah which I renamed and renumber from 61032 Stembok.

 

I also have 61244 Strang Steel again another Haymarket based B1 this is an old Replica Railways B1 with the split chassis I believe which I punched second hand on Ebay about eight years ago very noisy when it runs this one I also renamed and renumbered.

 

I have photos of both Hornby locomotives at Haymarket MPD in the late 1950's early 1960's so they are both authentic for my layout.

 

Once again thank you for taking the time to add your comments and photos.

 

 

Regards

 

David

Edited April 10, 2018 by landscapes

[stewartingram]

Talking of named B1s, we had Bongo (61005) at 31A Cambridge towards the end of steam. I was still at school then, at the "County" which backed onto the line just South of Hills Road bridge. I actually made official enquiries about buying a nameplate off Bongo, but at £5 it was too expensive.....how I regret that decision.

 

Stewart

[Theakerr]

Mayflower was a regular on the Cleethorpes Kings Cross run and was kept in pretty good condition.  She also worked more lowly duties on the Grimsby Louth pick-up goods and as such I 'cabbed' her many times, so it is a no brainer that I have a Mayflower on my layout.  No picture though because the base model I acquired (I modified it a bit more) does not have electric lights and Mayflower appears to have been built with electric lights.  One day I will get round to renaming a brand new Bachmann B1 that is still in its box.  To date I have replaced three of the old split chassis Bachmann B1s but I have used the new chassis as a donor because I was able to pick up three of them when they were going very cheaply a couple of years ago.  They fit perfectly but don't haul as well and there is very limited room to add more weight.

[Tony Wright]

Hi Tony

 

Thank you so much for the insight into your transporting days and for posting those lovely photos of the Antelope named B1's.

 

Like you I lost my combined volumes when we moved house in 1970, back in those days I never dreamed there would be a huge preservation movement I thought steam locomotives apart from the museum pieces were gone forever so I didn't worry to much, how I wish I had them now.

 

I do like your B1 locomotive models and all weathered to perfection, in answer to your question I have three B1's two of the new Hornby models, one is 61243 Sir Harold Mitchell as it was produced the other is 61025 Pallah which I renamed and renumber from 61032 Stembok.

 

I also have 61244 Strang Steel again another Haymarket based B1 this is an old Replica Railways B1 with the split chassis I believe which I punched second hand on Ebay about eight years ago very noisy when it runs this one I also renamed and renumbered.

 

I have photos of both Hornby locomotives at Haymarket MPD in the late 1950's early 1960's so they are both authentic for my layout.

 

Once again thank you for taking the time to add your comments and photos.

 

 

Regards

 

David

Thanks David,

 

Fortunately, it wasn't my Ian Allan Combined Volumes which were chucked away; it was my notebooks. Because they were written in a boy's hand, my mother must have thought I'd grown out of them. 

 

She also disposed of some of my negatives. What a shame. If I still had them, there'd be a picture of a named B1 at Kiveton Park (obviously, 61033) and BRITANNIA herself, belting through the same station on the boat train. 

 

If I do ever get to build Kiveton Park as my final exhibition layout, both of those will feature. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[31A]

No 'namers' I'm afraid and these are just a couple of Hornby ones, which I think are lovely models although I did have to 'recreate' the electric lighting conduits on the side of 61270's smoke box - I suspect they used the wrong smokebox mould!  61138 looks rather down at heel.

 

 

[Tony Wright]

No 'namers' I'm afraid and these are just a couple of Hornby ones, which I think are lovely models although I did have to 'recreate' the electric lighting conduits on the side of 61270's smoke box - I suspect they used the wrong smokebox mould!  61138 looks rather down at heel.

 

P1000910.jpg

 

P1010288.jpg

Very nice weathering, Steve, but, please, change those bogie wheels!

 

 

And the chimney? 

 

I think it really is worth doing.

 

I don't think I've ever seen a more naturally-weathered loco than this. Tom Foster is the master in my opinion. 

 

Thanks for posting the images of your work, and please keep them coming.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Edited April 10, 2018 by Tony Wright

[31A]

Sometimes reliable running takes priority over appearances and in the case of the bogie wheels, having struggled somewhat with a Black 5's running after fitting Alan Gibson bogie wheels, I think I'll live with the Hornby ones!

[APOLLO]

Here's a "naturally weathered" B1, a namer too - 61189 "Sir William Gray" at Wakefield shed 7th October 1967. She looks in decent nick.

 

 

Alongside was 61123

 

 

Wakefield shed had recently closed, and was being used at this time to gather all West Riding steam locos recently withdrawn from service before forwarding to the scrapyards (mostly at Hull).

 

More photos here  http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/67100-apollos-grand-days-out/page-3

 

Brit15

[St Enodoc]

Low Moor's 61039 STEINBOK also worked a special into Chester one day, from the Manchester direction. It came off its train in the General, reversed on the triangle, re-coupled, then headed off towards Crewe, then down the long-closed line to Malpas and Whitchurch.

We could have replicated that move on Bob's layout!

[Michael Edge]

Thanks Mike,

 

Ah, Nu-Cast motion (I'm sure that's a Nu-Cast crosshead on 61032); what useful stuff. Along with Jamieson frets of the period, just about all my ECML outside valve gear locos were built with it at the time - long before the likes of Comet came along. 

 

What was wrong with the Piercy kit? It looks wonderful (not just the painting). Didn't DJH take it over? 

 

Regards,

 

Tony.

 

Yes it's NuCast motion, I thought it was good at the time - it still leaves enough room for EM gauge though.

The Piercy B1 was one of the most stupidly difficult kits to build that I've ever seen, although the result looks very good. My view of the kit designer's job is that it is to make building as easy as possible.

[jrg1]

LMS engines were quite common in Lincoln.  The Grimsby Fish trains to the Midlands could be headed by 0-6-0s, such as 44120 of Aston.

4-4-0 40419 was shdded at St Marks along with 0-6-0 41686.

LTSR 4-4-2 41962 was shedded at Lincoln briefly for LDEC services.

Compounds, Crabs, Black 5s and 8s were regularly seen in Lincoln

[Willie Whizz]

LMS engines were quite common in Lincoln.  The Grimsby Fish trains to the Midlands could be headed by 0-6-0s, such as 44120 of Aston.

 

 

I never did understand, as a small boy or now, why "Grimsby fish trains to the Midlands" were (at least in the late 50s/early 60s) commonly hauled by ER locomotioves (B1 Ourebi being a regular) but sent along the ex-Midland Lincoln to Nottingham to Derby line when there were obvious alternatives (albeit possibly slightly longer) on ER metals, e.g. via the LDEC line, Mansfield Railway and GC  Bulwell Common to the GN Derbyshire Lines.  Anyone have any ideas?

 

Aaah, teatime after school on the footbridge at Sneinton Junction ... one humble spot, close to home so even at 9 or 10 I was allowed to wander ... with no less than five different railway routes in view, plus another disused in the distance.  And if an earlier poster 'booed' Ourebi every time he saw her too often ... well sadly my pals and I felt the same about 45611 Hong Kong, using the goods lines around Nottingham Midland as a run-around ...

Edited April 10, 2018 by Willie Whizz

[Flying Pig]

Looks like one of the LMS articulated pairs (BTO + TO) leading the train behind the Jubilee in jrg1's photo.

 

I never did understand, as a small boy or now, why "Grimsby fish trains to the Midlands" were (at least in the late 50s/early 60s) commonly hauled by ER locomotioves (B1 Ourebi being a regular) but sent along the ex-Midland Lincoln to Nottingham to Derby line when there were obvious alternatives (albeit possibly slightly longer) on ER metals, e.g. via the LDEC line, Mansfield Railway and GC  Bulwell Common to the GN Derbyshire Lines.  Anyone have any ideas?

 

Because, as you said yourself, it was quicker that way? The object was to get the fish into batter as soon as may be, not give it a tour of the Dukeries. Any haddock that was bothered about ticking off unusual routes could always join the LCGB.

[Jesse Sim]

Well Tony I have started my kit building career as of last night. 

 

Finally decided to take the plunge and start my Wizards models NE perishable van.  A little sketchy to begin with and I doubt it will turn out the way I want it, but you have to start somewhere. 

 

I realised I hadn't put the bearings in, I took some out of an old Parkside kit I had lying around. Where could I get some wheel bearings from? 

 

The low melt solder didn't want to to stick to the iron? Is there a reason for this or is that natural? 

 

 

I'll keep you posted. 

 

Jesse 

[jrg1]

I never did understand, as a small boy or now, why "Grimsby fish trains to the Midlands" were (at least in the late 50s/early 60s) commonly hauled by ER locomotioves (B1 Ourebi being a regular) but sent along the ex-Midland Lincoln to Nottingham to Derby line when there were obvious alternatives (albeit possibly slightly longer) on ER metals, e.g. via the LDEC line, Mansfield Railway and GC  Bulwell Common to the GN Derbyshire Lines.  Anyone have any ideas?

 

Aaah, teatime after school on the footbridge at Sneinton Junction ... one humble spot, close to home so even at 9 or 10 I was allowed to wander ... with no less than five different railway routes in view, plus another disused in the distance.  And if an earlier poster 'booed' Ourebi every time he saw her too often ... well sadly my pals and I felt the same about 45611 Hong Kong, using the goods lines around Nottingham Midland as a run-around ...

The fish trains from Grimsby deserves a book, they were so varied.  apart from the Grimsby-Whitland service, there were 9F hauled trains to London, various trains via the LDEC, and single vans behind DMUs.  I once saw 61038 Blacktail on the Grimsby-Whitland Fish.  The Immingham Brits took over on this run in the sixties.

[St Enodoc]

Where could I get some wheel bearings from? 

I can let you have some to keep you going for a while. Call me.

[Tony Wright]

Well Tony I have started my kit building career as of last night. 

 

Finally decided to take the plunge and start my Wizards models NE perishable van.  A little sketchy to begin with and I doubt it will turn out the way I want it, but you have to start somewhere. 

 

I realised I hadn't put the bearings in, I took some out of an old Parkside kit I had lying around. Where could I get some wheel bearings from? 

 

The low melt solder didn't want to to stick to the iron? Is there a reason for this or is that natural? 

 

IMG_1094.JPG

 

I'll keep you posted. 

 

Jesse 

Good morning Jesse,

 

Wagon wheel bearings?

 

Get some from John, then fill your pockets when you come to stay with us in August.

 

Low melt is more difficult to pick up on the iron. If so, once you've made a tack, prepare some little 'blobs' of low melt solder (by employing the iron), then flood the joint with flux, place one of the solidified little blobs on the joint, as far away from the tack as possible, then reintroduce the iron. The blob will flash into the joint perfectly. 

 

Good looking work.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Tony Wright]

We could have replicated that move on Bob's layout!

As far as I know, the special only took the ramblers as far as Malpas, but what happened to the loco and stock after that, I have no idea. Was there a turntable at Whitchurch? There certainly wouldn't have been one at Malpas. Did the loco/stock go all the way to Shrewsbury for turning? By the time it came back (if it came back via Chester), we'd all gone home for tea. 

 

Was 61039 one of those B1s fitted with a rebuilt tender; the sort with no footplate flange along the middle? If so, I didn't notice at the time, but I recall seeing a picture of it somewhere.

 

Happy days. 

[Tony Wright]

Sometimes reliable running takes priority over appearances and in the case of the bogie wheels, having struggled somewhat with a Black 5's running after fitting Alan Gibson bogie wheels, I think I'll live with the Hornby ones!

Thanks Steve,

 

I think you'll find no problems with running Markits bogie wheels, despite others claiming to have issues. If your track is well-laid (which I assume it must be) and the radii of any curves is not too tight (minimum 26" or so), then the visual benefits of fitting them in place of the Hornby (or Bachmann) B1 bogie wheels are more than worth it. 

 

I run a B1 on the MR/M&GNR bit of my trainset, where (off scene) the curves are down to 24" in places (as you know). The loco runs perfectly on its Comet frames and Markits wheels. 

 

 

 

Regards,

 

Tony.