Wright writes.....

[railroadbill]

Thanks for that, looks same roof design as V2.

[Tony Wright]

8 hours ago, Darryl Tooley said:

There is a well-known photograph by the late Ben Brooksbank, showing the aftermath of the derailment of 60508 at New Southgate in 1948, which resulted in the death of the fireman.

 

As well as the cab roof, it also shows the combination of 4,200 gal tender and full-height smoke deflectors that Tony mentioned.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:New_Southgate_locomotive_derailment_geograph-2261880-by-Ben-Brooksbank.jpg

 

D

 

Thanks Darryl,

 

The cab roof looks exactly the same as a V2, with twin central ventilators. 

 

I've just checked on the respective V2 and A2/1 drawings from Isinglass, and John Edgson has drawn them the same.

 

Interestingly, other locos with a (very similar) 'V'-fronted cab (the A4s and the Bugatti-nosed P2s) had extra ventilators sited above the crew's seats, as well as the central ones. The same arrangement was perpetuated on the part-'V'-fronted Peppercorn cabs. 

 

Did the cabs of the V2s and A2/1s not get as hot? 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Hollar]

On 05/10/2023 at 09:56, Barry Ten said:

 

That happened with (another) rc Mustang that a friend and I tried to fly. In our ignorance, we hadn't put any side-thrust on the electric engine we'd put in the plane, so as soon as it was off the ground it yawed hard to left. It went into the road/verge so not as bad as the wall but still a fair bit of damage to put right.

 

It does give you a renewed appreciation for model trains. Imaging building a DJH pacific then throwing it up into the air to see if it "works".

My one brush with r/c aircraft was when I was umpiring a Middlesex trial colts cricket game on Hackney Marshes.  I had to suspend play because some idiot was buzzing the pitch with a very large plane.  Tw*t stopped play, you might say.  A possee of very angry dads was very quickly organised and they stalked off to remonstrate with the flier.  At least a couple of the dads were keen to show him what a cricket bat looks like. Perhaps fortunately for everyone, they didn't find him. We continued the match confident that there wouldn't be a repeat.

 

Tony

[Tony Wright]

Thompson's least-numerous Pacific class keeps on popping up from time to time. Thompson himself called the four A2/1s 'The orphans of the storm!', so he was well aware of the controversies caused by his various re-buildings. To me the irony is, had he fitted Kylchap double chimneys to the final four V2s (rather than have them built as Pacifics), then we would have seen what the 'super V2s' could do years earlier than when BR eventually fitted these enhanced-performance devices to handful of them towards the end of their lives.  

 

Apologies if these pictures have appeared before, but loads of pages (hundreds?) back.

 

 

I was fortunate enough to inspect Bachmann's new V2s in their 'proving model' stages. 

 

On this example, the sliding ventilators alternated as to what was opened and what was closed, depending on which side. I was told this was correct, so if modellers make their A2/1 roof ventilators able to be opened or closed, please take note. 

 

The A2/1 lubricators were on the other side, though were they offset?

 

 

A weathered new Bachmann production V2 showing the same roof ventilators.

 

 

On this Bachmann/King A2/1 conversion, the ventilators are closed.

 

This is the guise in which 60508 was derailed at New Southgate.

 

 

On this PDK A2/1s, the cab roof ventilators are also modelled as closed. 

 

 

They're not very prominent on this Nu-Cast example (built by me and painted by Ian Rathbone), now the property of a Scottish chum.

 

 

They're even less-prominent on this Jamieson hand-cut A2/1 kit from 47 years ago. 

 

 

However, from this sort of angle they're invisible anyway. 

 

Here we have two classes which will probably never be available RTR, but who knows? 

 

When I was assisting Hornby's (at the time) designer with the development of the firm's A2/2s and A2/3s, the commonality of the A2/1s with these two classes was mentioned. The problem is (though at initial glance, similar) there is not enough commonality of parts to make an RTR A2/1 viable. 

 

So, thankfully, it's still down to scratch- or kit-building if one wants one! 

 

 

Edited October 17, 2023 by Tony Wright
to add something

[Barry Ten]

2 hours ago, Hollar said:

My one brush with r/c aircraft was when I was umpiring a Middlesex trial colts cricket game on Hackney Marshes.  I had to suspend play because some idiot was buzzing the pitch with a very large plane.  Tw*t stopped play, you might say.  A possee of very angry dads was very quickly organised and they stalked off to remonstrate with the flier.  At least a couple of the dads were keen to show him what a cricket bat looks like. Perhaps fortunately for everyone, they didn't find him. We continued the match confident that there wouldn't be a repeat.

 

Tony

 

Unfortunately there will always be idiots who give a bad name to any hobby. I had to take the CAA online competency test for drone and and r/c planes, which includes all the rules about where you can and can't fly, then the BMFA "A Certificate" for basic flying competence, before my club would allow me to fly "solo". Of course I could still go out and do something stupid or antisocial on my own but at least I've had an awareness of the rules.

[railroadbill]

Thanks, Tony and Darryl, I knew this would be the thread to post  the question on!  The A2/1 roof being the same as the V2 is just what I needed to know.  Some excellent models there!

The lubricators on my Nu-cast model are in line on the right hand side, but that is how Nu-cast moulded the holes for them!!

I can now press on, having got back into this one after a long time.

Got the Hornby A2/2 and A2/3 models which you mentioned, which I think are very good. (Plus the usual A3s A4s etc.) and a early  Bachmann V2 I'll measure the roof from, and a Jameson V2 I built in er, 1978...

 

This one kept getting put back in the box because of it being 2 steps forward one back all the time (or seemed like the other way round!) For example  I had great difficulty in getting the smokebox castings round, so made a smokebox out of brass tube which was nearly the right diameter...etc etc. 

 

Thanks again.

[45568]

On 16/10/2023 at 16:02, Tony Wright said:

 

With Hornby's RTR 'Coronation' train in the offing (including the cars in BR condition) then this train will only need the Thompson types to be built (Bachmann/Hornby providing the Mk.1s). 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

You have mentioned this before Tony, but I can find no evidence of any statement by Hornby, (yet!), that they are going to release the 'Coronation' stock in BR form, presumably in maroon. Can you enlighten me as to where you have this please? ( I will need to start saving!!!).

Cheers from Oz,

Peter C.

[Barry Ten]

Over the last couple of months I've been mostly modelling in N, adding an extension to the peninsula board on my American layout

 

The new stuff starts more or less where the road in the foreground goes from grey to unpainted card, which is where the original fascia board went.

 

 

Similarly, this service road along the yard tracks used to run along the edge of the board, but there's now room for a bit of water to poke into the scene. I feel that the additions have given the scene a bit more room to breathe, setting the trains back into the landscape.

 

 

Cheers, Al

[Dylan Sanderson]

Ta da…

 

finished my most challenging and complex kit yet, the 51L NER Diagram C1. A beautiful wagon kit that I really enjoyed putting together.

 

Any tips on improving it? I’ve got another on order to bolster my fish van. I wasn’t really sure how the underframe should look, so I guesstimated. I left off the steam pipes as well as the casting looked a bit naff and over scale.

 

Anyone know that the best paint is for NER Indian red?

 

 

 

 

 

[Tony Wright]

5 hours ago, 45568 said:

You have mentioned this before Tony, but I can find no evidence of any statement by Hornby, (yet!), that they are going to release the 'Coronation' stock in BR form, presumably in maroon. Can you enlighten me as to where you have this please? ( I will need to start saving!!!).

Cheers from Oz,

Peter C.

Good afternoon Peter,

 

As part of my assisting Hornby in the development of its 'Coronation' cars, examples of types I'd built (in BR condition) were loaned to the firm (certainly not to copy, but as physical examples). 

 

I spent two fruitful days in Margate, going over the models, drawings, photographs and documents with the designers. It was clear that the BR manifestations were being considered (the CADs proved this), with details such as extra doors noted. 

 

One main selling point in doing the cars in BR condition is that just one twin can be bought (say, the FOs for service in 'The Talisman', 'South Yorkshireman' and 'Master Cutler' at various times. Or a Brake Third/Restaurant as found in 'The Aberdonian' between Edinburgh and Aberdeen). Obviously, this means a much lesser cost than having to buy eight or nine cars (it was only for MALLARD's record run that a set was split pre-War). 

 

There is evidence that the streamlined sets were split immediately post-War, and some cars ran as individual pairs in their pre-War two-tone blue, but not for long. These were in original condition with skirts and no extra doors. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Tony Wright]

The Agenoria 'Victory' is now complete, and will be off the Geoff Haynes to paint for his customer..................

 

 

 

It's not been cleaned up at all (I leave that to the painter).

 

Rather a nice kit, but moribund now there's an RTR version. 

[LNER4479]

On 16/10/2023 at 09:02, Tony Wright said:

Am I right in thinking that 'The Caledonian' had two ex-LMS cars in its formation - the Kitchen Car and a BFO/BFK? I'm sure your rake is correct, but I can't tell from your first picture.

 

In my shot (which I assume shows the same train?), the penultimate vehicle also appears to be ex-LMS (an FO?). Is this correct? 

 

Good evening, Tony,

 

Apologies for slight delay in responding to your questions above re 'The Caledonian'. It's taken until this evening for me to be able to check the rake post-show.

 

Here it is, set out again on the home layout, just approaching Carlisle No.13 Box. It's currently an Iain Henderson (aka RMWeb 92220) & GN combo. Iain kindly made some of his Camden maroon stock available in order to get us running with Shap in expanded 1950s/1960s mode. So it makes best use of Iain's stock, but it's pretty close, I believe. In more detail:

 

Second class end. MkI BSK + SO + SO. The SOs should really be 48 seats, ie 2+1 seating; these vehicles are (I believe?) 2+2 64 seats, more commonly referred to as TSO.

 

Vehicles 4 to 6, the catering core. SO + Kit + FO; These are all Iain's vehicles, formed around his lovely Stanier 50ft Kitchen car. Carter doesn't differentiate these as restaurant cars as such but both first and second vehicles feature white painted tables as if they were. The First is numbered M4, ie one of the original 1951 'Festival of Britain' RFOs; I don't think that's correct for the 1957 Caledonian.

 

The remains of the First Class end FO + BFK and this is what has changed since your photo of '45 on Shap. In conversation with Robert Carroll, he highlighted that the 7th vehicle should be an early MkI FO with centre doors and that Hornby had produced such a vehicle so that was a targeted purchase. The LMS Porthole BFK was I believe purchased from 'Honest Tone's'!

 

So, it's getting closer as a rake! My coaches stand out as out-of-the-box, whereas Iain has applied some lovely, subtle weathering - I wish I had his skill in that regard.

 

And, before you say it, yes - it needs a tail lamp. 🫣 Rome wasn't built in a day.
 

Edited October 17, 2023 by LNER4479

[Buhar]

21 minutes ago, LNER4479 said:

Rome wasn't built in a day.

Surely that should be Rome Street in this context.

 

Alan

[Willie Whizz]

5 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Good afternoon Peter,

 

As part of my assisting Hornby in the development of its 'Coronation' cars, examples of types I'd built (in BR condition) were loaned to the firm (certainly not to copy, but as physical examples). 

 

I spent two fruitful days in Margate, going over the models, drawings, photographs and documents with the designers. It was clear that the BR manifestations were being considered (the CADs proved this), with details such as extra doors noted. 

 

One main selling point in doing the cars in BR condition is that just one twin can be bought (say, the FOs for service in 'The Talisman', 'South Yorkshireman' and 'Master Cutler' at various times. Or a Brake Third/Restaurant as found in 'The Aberdonian' between Edinburgh and Aberdeen). Obviously, this means a much lesser cost than having to buy eight or nine cars (it was only for MALLARD's record run that a set was split pre-War). 

 

There is evidence that the streamlined sets were split immediately post-War, and some cars ran as individual pairs in their pre-War two-tone blue, but not for long. These were in original condition with skirts and no extra doors. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

When I looked a few weeks ago, the Coronation coaches in BR livery were no longer being shown as available to order on the Hornby website, nor on those of other major dealers. I fear - unless anyone knows otherwise - that anybody who hasn’t already got an order in may have missed the boat. Curses!

Edited October 17, 2023 by Willie Whizz

[Tony Wright]

11 hours ago, Willie Whizz said:

When I looked a few weeks ago, the Coronation coaches in BR livery were no longer being shown as available to order on the Hornby website, nor on those of other major dealers. I fear - unless anyone knows otherwise - that anybody who hasn’t already got an order in may have missed the boat. Curses!

Good morning,

 

I'll make some enquiries at Hornby to see the situation regarding the streamlined cars in BR days; then report accordingly.

 

I'm only speculating here, but it could be that the BR version streamliners might be put on 'hold' (though I should know more, later). 

 

When examining the CADS for these cars, all the underframe detail was included, even though, to all intents and purposes, it cannot be seen behind the skirts, unless a vehicle derails and lands upside down! Many kit-builds I've seen of the streamliners in original condition omit completely the trussing, battery boxes, conduits, dynamos, etc, for the reasons just given, Obviously, for BR days (in carmine & cream/maroon), all that detail will be essential. I can't imagine Hornby would leave it off, even though it's hidden on the original vehicles.

 

In BR days, the skirts were removed and on some this was taken back to even reveal the solebars. Extra doors were added to some of the cars where they met at the articulation, but not on both sides (it was usually the inner LH end). This was as a result of passengers being trapped in a fire, with no means of escape. So, the tooling suites will need to incorporate these detail differences, at a greater cost, of course (though nowhere near the original tooling costs). 

 

How Hornby will apply the raised lettering, I don't know (though it should be raised - a flat transfer won't do). The spare set just had roof boards proclaiming the train's identity, and it was used for all the streamliners (including the 'Silver Jubilee' at times). 

 

I have to say that it's a great 'leap of faith' for Hornby to produce these iconic trains. As I mentioned previously, the whole eight/nine cars will have to be purchased (unless one just buys six to go behind MALLARD on her record run), which made me think (on cost grounds alone) the BR versions would be popular - just a pair needed in many cases. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Bucoops]

Definitely the "easier" of the two streamliners being pairs. The Silver Jubilee of course being twins, triplets and even a twin that was extended to be a triplet!

[45568]

18 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Good afternoon Peter,

 

As part of my assisting Hornby in the development of its 'Coronation' cars, examples of types I'd built (in BR condition) were loaned to the firm (certainly not to copy, but as physical examples). 

 

I spent two fruitful days in Margate, going over the models, drawings, photographs and documents with the designers. It was clear that the BR manifestations were being considered (the CADs proved this), with details such as extra doors noted. 

 

One main selling point in doing the cars in BR condition is that just one twin can be bought (say, the FOs for service in 'The Talisman', 'South Yorkshireman' and 'Master Cutler' at various times. Or a Brake Third/Restaurant as found in 'The Aberdonian' between Edinburgh and Aberdeen). Obviously, this means a much lesser cost than having to buy eight or nine cars (it was only for MALLARD's record run that a set was split pre-War). 

 

There is evidence that the streamlined sets were split immediately post-War, and some cars ran as individual pairs in their pre-War two-tone blue, but not for long. These were in original condition with skirts and no extra doors. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Thank you for your full explanation Tony. I agree that a BR Maroon twin would be very nice to add a little variation to a rake. However, try as I may, I can find no reference to any part numbers for post-war examples on the Hornby website, (which is slightly less frustrating than the Hampton Court maze), or even in the thread about these models in the Hornby section of Products area.

 Can anyone point me to part numbers/descriptions anywhere for BR liveried models, for my information?

Cheers from Oz,

Peter C.

[APOLLO]

Found this very interesting video last night after getting fed up with watching the news.

 

Better days.

 

 

Brit15

[Dominion]

26 minutes ago, 45568 said:

Thank you for your full explanation Tony. I agree that a BR Maroon twin would be very nice to add a little variation to a rake. However, try as I may, I can find no reference to any part numbers for post-war examples on the Hornby website, (which is slightly less frustrating than the Hampton Court maze), or even in the thread about these models in the Hornby section of Products area.

 Can anyone point me to part numbers/descriptions anywhere for BR liveried models, for my information?

Cheers from Oz,

Peter C.

I don’t think they have been announced, only the LNER livery so far. Tom

[LNER4479]

1 hour ago, APOLLO said:

Found this very interesting video last night after getting fed up with watching the news.

 

Better days.

 

 

Brit15

Fantastic vid! Thanks ever so much for finding and posting🤗

[Tony Wright]

9 hours ago, Dominion said:

I don’t think they have been announced, only the LNER livery so far. Tom

Good evening Tom,

 

That's my understanding, too. 

 

The BR versions have yet to be officially announced.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Tony Wright]

A plea for help, please. And, also an admission of my complete ignorance of GWR wagons.

 

 

I've been sent these 3D-printed 4mm GWR wagons by 247 Developments, the intention being to put a short review in BRM. 

 

To call them kits is a bit of a misnomer because one gets these, plus four axleboxes for each. Wheels, bearings, buffers and couplings have to be sourced from elsewhere. The instructions merely advise that the holes in the axleboxes might need opening out to fit bearings and where to source the extra bits. 

 

Here's the plea for help (and please don't laugh). Did the 'Coral' (top) carry its loads like that or are some of the parts supports for the 3D-printing process? I think the triangular supports must be kept, but the little 'pips' on the ends? The 'Hydra' seems complete as it is.

 

Both seem to be crisp and well-printed, but even the axleboxes have supports to be removed.

 

Thanks in anticipation. 

Edited October 19, 2023 by Tony Wright

[Tony Wright]

I'm on rather firmer ground with this..............

 

 

Heljans latest O Gauge Deltic manifestation, in preserved condition. 

 

It's still mounted on its plank of wood for transportation (has anyone tried putting the collars and the screws back in place after its been taken off?). Having lifted it from its box, I might enter the competition for the 'World's most perfectly-ruptured man'!

 

What a fabulous beast; I've now got to find a layout to test it on..............

 

 

[LaScala]

41 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

A plea for help, please. And, also an admission of my complete ignorance of GWR wagons.

 

 

I've been sent these 3D-printed 4mm GWR wagons by 247 Developments, the intention being to put a short review in BRM. 

 

To call them kits is a bit of a misnomer because one gets these, plus four axleboxes for each. Wheels, bearings, buffers and couplings have to be sourced from elsewhere. The instructions merely advise that the holes in the axleboxes might need opening out to fit bearings and where to source the extra bits. 

 

Here's the plea for help (and please don't laugh). Did the 'Hydra' (top) carry its loads like that or are some of the parts supports for the 3D-printing process? I think the triangular supports must be kept, but the little 'pips' on the ends? The 'Coral' seems complete as it is.

 

Both seem to be crisp and well-printed, but even the axleboxes have supports to be removed.

 

Thanks in anticipation. 

[Barry O]

43 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

A plea for help, please. And, also an admission of my complete ignorance of GWR wagons.

 

 

I've been sent these 3D-printed 4mm GWR wagons by 247 Developments, the intention being to put a short review in BRM. 

 

To call them kits is a bit of a misnomer because one gets these, plus four axleboxes for each. Wheels, bearings, buffers and couplings have to be sourced from elsewhere. The instructions merely advise that the holes in the axleboxes might need opening out to fit bearings and where to source the extra bits. 

 

Here's the plea for help (and please don't laugh). Did the 'Hydra' (top) carry its loads like that or are some of the parts supports for the 3D-printing process? I think the triangular supports must be kept, but the little 'pips' on the ends? The 'Coral' seems complete as it is.

 

Both seem to be crisp and well-printed, but even the axleboxes have supports to be removed.

 

Thanks in anticipation. 

Ask  @jwealleans Jonathan Wealleans..he has just built one of each. You need to look 8n the Russell GW wagons book.

 

Baz