RMweb Premium PMP Posted April 16, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 16, 2013 [ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adams442T Posted April 16, 2013 Share Posted April 16, 2013 A sad day indeed. When I was in The Met, on a squad working against the London Bombings in the 70s, we were all too aware that we had to get it right every time, whereas 'They' only had to get it right once. The only thing society can do, apart from show support to the victims, is to refuse to be 'Terrorised' and continue everyday life as usual. Otherwise they do win. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkC Posted April 16, 2013 Share Posted April 16, 2013 A sad day indeed. When I was in The Met, on a squad working against the London Bombings in the 70s, we were all too aware that we had to get it right every time, whereas 'They' only had to get it right once. The only thing society can do, apart from show support to the victims, is to refuse to be 'Terrorised' and continue everyday life as usual. Otherwise they do win. Well said. Mark Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted April 16, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 16, 2013 A sad day indeed. When I was in The Met, on a squad working against the London Bombings in the 70s, we were all too aware that we had to get it right every time, whereas 'They' only had to get it right once. The only thing society can do, apart from show support to the victims, is to refuse to be 'Terrorised' and continue everyday life as usual. Otherwise they do win. I think some of us find that easier to do than others. In the wake of some nasty events in London, I can recall a fellow-traveller (a lawyer) saying that she'd be avoiding the tube, and walking from Charing Cross to Westminster every day. No doubt when 7/7 happened, she felt vindicated - and probably fitter, too! Not having children, I have always found such responses beyond reasonable, and was able to avoid train delays when suspicious packages etc were reported by picking them up and examining them. In the very unlikely event that they were live, I'd not have known about it, and by proving otherwise, nobody knew about it. But then, I'd happily get on an aeroplane that hadn't been security checked if it meant I didn't need to turn up three hours beforehand! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted April 16, 2013 Share Posted April 16, 2013 I remember when the IRA started putting small (but powerful) devices into Waste Bins on London streets - that was the hardest time because of the difficulties in finding them - and caught out the "walkers" like Ian's fellow commuter. Luckily this strategy didn't last long... Best, Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted April 16, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 16, 2013 I remember when the IRA started putting small (but powerful) devices into Waste Bins on London streets - that was the hardest time because of the difficulties in finding them - and caught out the "walkers" like Ian's fellow commuter. Luckily this strategy didn't last long... Best, Pete. But we still bear the scars of the response - there are no litter bins anywhere on railway stations beyond transparent plastic bags. A senior BT policeman tried to tough it out on the day of the coded warning in 1991, and people died at Victoria. No-one in authority is now going to relent on the cautious stance if they value their pension, and every train journey seems to be accompanied by PA warnings to be vigilant. In that respect the perpetrators' aims of disrupting life have been achieved for decades after their individual atrocities, sadly. No doubt marathon organisers world-wide are currently in despair about the future. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted April 16, 2013 Share Posted April 16, 2013 Someone has told me that the Boston bombs were, in fact in Trash Cans and it is "assumed" that they were 2 - 5lbs (probably the lower) of a military grade explosive, like "Semtex" rather than a homemade concoction which would have been bulkier. I can't guarantee the accuracy of the source. As I'm writing, this info has been made public knowledge. Ian, they stopped doing that when two American tourists were severely injured who reputedly had backgrounds from the country concerned. The Paymasters didn't like it. Best, Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Colin_McLeod Posted April 16, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 16, 2013 My sympathies are with the injured, bereaved and killed at Boston. Reminders of Belfast that I'd rather forget. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceptic Posted April 16, 2013 Share Posted April 16, 2013 My sympathies are with the injured, bereaved and killed at Boston. Reminders of Belfast that I'd rather forget. Along with Warrington, Manchester, London, New York, Baghdad, Birmingham, Tel Aviv, Kabul, Guildford,........the list seems to be endless...Is this really the future.?....... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 It's not the future if we don't want it to be... But how do we get rid of these sadists? (whatever the screwed up reasons for doing what they do might be for that is what they are..) Unfortunately they are in the world and more are being freshly minted on a daily basis with the help of others with probably even more sinister motives. They are someone's somewhere ground troops in some bogus ideological war. Bogus as it is in many all a front for either making money or some kind of corrupted need for power or infamy... Evil is an unfortunate fact of existence on our planet and is finding fresh outlets by leaping on the bandwagon of technological progress. What happened in Boston is compounded Terror for it's method not only killed and maimed but has also caused untold psychological trauma to those present... Healing it is going to take a lifetime. These attacks are indeed an attack upon the whole world, you and I included. What can be done? Does any decent person want this sort of thing in the world - anywhere? Perhaps this might make a start... Mentally and with feeling each day make a personal mark against the causes, cruelty, tyranny, corruption, hypocrisy, deception, etc.. Anything but acceptance! In the 1990's I had a studio in Boston right where the bombs went off...so . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceptic Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 It's not the future if we don't want it to be... But how do we get rid of these sadists? (whatever the screwed up reasons for doing what they do might be for that is what they are..) Unfortunately they are in the world and more are being freshly minted on a daily basis with the help of others with probably even more sinister motives. They are someone's somewhere ground troops in some bogus ideological war. Bogus as it is in many all a front for either making money or some kind of corrupted need for power or infamy... Evil is an unfortunate fact of existence on our planet and is finding fresh outlets by leaping on the bandwagon of technological progress. What happened in Boston is compounded Terror for it's method not only killed and maimed but has also caused untold psychological trauma to those present... Healing it is going to take a lifetime. These attacks are indeed an attack upon the whole world, you and I included. What can be done? Does any decent person want this sort of thing in the world - anywhere? Perhaps this might make a start... Mentally and with feeling each day make a personal mark against the causes, cruelty, tyranny, corruption, hypocrisy, deception, etc.. Anything but acceptance! In the 1990's I had a studio in Boston right where the bombs went off...so ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Hi Bill, .I was once told, by a close friend, that aggression is inherent within the genes of mankind. Stretching way back, to when early ###### Sapiens viewed their neighbour / brother / sister, as a rival. If he / she was picked out as an easy, un-agreeable target, then,... as Darwin put it, ...it was survival of the 'fittest'.? Seemingly, this pre-historic method of trying to gain the 'upper hand' is still with us. ....unless ?...as you say, in your last, but one, paragraph, .. we see through the spin, proper gander , hype, go with flow etc. mentality,... Looking at recent world events, it appears that little has changed since ....well...since Man once stood... upright ? Regards, Frank. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adams442T Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 These attacks are indeed an attack upon the whole world, you and I included. What can be done? Does any decent person want this sort of thing in the world - anywhere? Perhaps this might make a start... Mentally and with feeling each day make a personal mark against the causes, cruelty, tyranny, corruption, hypocrisy, deception, etc.. Anything but acceptance! In the 1990's I had a studio in Boston right where the bombs went off...so . The trouble is Bill that however we commonly see our role as 'peace-keepers' and 'liberators' others see it as our Tyranny, Hypocrisy, etc., etc., and this is the source of their grievances. It doesn't then take much, amongst people who are fanatical, whatever their ideology, to 'justify' their heinous acts. They are not what you and I would call 'decent people' or 'right thinking people', they are fanatics, with all the unbalanced views that state encompasses. It seems, as I write, that it is possible that the two suspects have been detained. In my experience, gleaned from interrogating just such people, they will probably show no remorse and say that 'their cause' allows them, indeed demands, such actions. As Frank says above, it seems to be something programmed into humans, and what can we do about it? Now being an historian, primarily of the Middle Ages, I have often thought that you don't have to scratch very deeply to cut through the 'veneer' of modern society. We can, I think, only hope that democracy and the rule of law continues to be a just path for humanity to take, otherwise what will we become? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 One suspect dead after shoot out with the Police. The other on foot in Watertown. Believed to be brothers from Chechnya. Best, Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob D2 Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 Kyrgyzstan , I used to go there alot . Same ' religion of peace' once more. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DDolfelin Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 It's such a sad thing to happen. I believe others have been injured/killed in trying to apprehend them. Don't expect there will be a trial at the end of this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 They appear to be born in Chechnya. Their Father has been on TV from hell telling us that his boys (sic) were shot by "cowards"............. Best, Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adams442T Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 They appear to be born in Chechnya. Their Father has been on TV from hell telling us that his boys (sic) were shot by "cowards"............. Best, Pete. Par for the course I'm afraid. Every murdering thug, half-wit slaughtering driver, and level crossing chancer is always someones son. Thank heavens they're not our children. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 More shots this evening in Watertown - looks like they now have the little creep cornered.... Best, Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozexpatriate Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 They appear to be born in Chechnya. Their Father has been on TV from hell telling us that his boys (sic) were shot by "cowards".............Chechnyan and an opinion from a their mother on Russian TV that the FBI was watching the older one for three years. EDIT: Current reporting is that they got him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mallard60022 Posted April 20, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 20, 2013 It is going to be a very different world in which my grandchildren mature and grow old. I am rather sad about that. P Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ohmisterporter Posted April 22, 2013 Share Posted April 22, 2013 When the day arrives that we have lost our sense of humour the lunatics will have won. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adams442T Posted April 23, 2013 Share Posted April 23, 2013 When the day arrives that we have lost our sense of humour the lunatics will have won. Wouldn't say I've been quite that bad, but, in an earlier life, I did once smash my way though a 'terror suspect's' door only to find it was a broom cupboard - and that was unlocked too! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Colin_McLeod Posted April 23, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 23, 2013 The surviving suspect has been charged with using a weapon of mass destruction, This is the Wikipedia description of the term: A weapon of mass destruction (WMD) is a weapon that can kill and bring significant harm to a large number of humans (and other life forms) and/or cause great damage to man-made structures (e.g. buildings), natural structures (e.g. mountains), or the biosphere in general. The scope and application of the term has evolved and been disputed, often signifying more politically than technically. Coined in reference to aerial bombing with chemical explosives, it has come to distinguish large-scale weaponry of other technologies, such as chemical, biological, radiological, or nuclear. This differentiates the term from more technical ones such as chemical, biological, radiological, and nuclear weapons (CBRN). Hardly a pressure cooker containing an IED!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozexpatriate Posted April 23, 2013 Share Posted April 23, 2013 People (and perhaps Americans particularly) struggle with a sense of proportion. There were calls to have this individual (a nationalized US citizen) hauled off to Gitmo and tried as an enemy combatant. Arguably the WMD charge is a compromise position. "In an infinite universe, the one thing sentient life cannot afford to have is a sense of proportion." - Douglas Adams Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluebottle Posted April 23, 2013 Share Posted April 23, 2013 .I was once told, by a close friend, that aggression is inherent within the genes of mankind. Stretching way back, to when early ###### Sapiens viewed their neighbour / brother / sister, as a rival. If he / she was picked out as an easy, un-agreeable target, then,... as Darwin put it, ...it was survival of the 'fittest'.? Seemingly, this pre-historic method of trying to gain the 'upper hand' is still with us. ....unless ?...as you say, in your last, but one, paragraph, .. we see through the spin, proper gander , hype, go with flow etc. mentality,... Looking at recent world events, it appears that little has changed since ....well...since Man once stood... upright ? As a scientist, Darwin didn't regard his “Origin of Species” as a bible, perfect and immutable, and he expected his ideas to be developed, even superseded by others. One of the Neo-Darwinist ideas relevant here is that of Reciprocal Altruism; the trait that predisposes one to perform an altruistic act in the expectation of reciprocation from the recipient. Some such principal is necessary to explain the construction of civilisations, and an expression of hope rather than despair. Edit: simplification for clarity. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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