Lymington Branch

[Les Bird]

On the way back from Bournemouth on Monday, I took the opportunity to have a quick return trip on the Lymington Branch. I noticed that the track at Lymington Pier is equipped with a conductor rail and I assume this applies to the whole branch. Does anyone know if this is so, and, if it is, why is the service run with a DEMU?

[Fat Controller]

Probably because the only EMUs available are four or five car, which would be an over-provision outside the peaks, and there aren't enough of these to go round. Until relatively recently, services had been operated by a couple of 'slam-door' trains that had been given a derogation to the rules about the withdrawal of such stock, presumably because the service was a self-contained one.

[4630]

The Lymington branch is operated by a class 450 Desiro EMU on Saturdays and Sundays.

[PaulRhB]

Yep no spare electric stock during the week so the 2 car 158 is the most efficient use of stock. The juice is always on though for security & safety as you always have to assume it's on. Switching it off all week would leave potential for misunderstanding during work on the track around the weekend.

Edited December 11, 2013 by PaulRhB

[Les Bird]

Thank you all for the replies. An Ivatt 2-6-2T would have been nice or, better still, an M7 but I suppose that's "progress"!

[AberdeenBill]

Back in the 1970s there was still an 8-Cig summer Saturday through train from Waterloo.    The branch was worked by a 2-Hap or a 4-Vep on various days of the week.

 

Bill

[Gwiwer]

The Lymington branch was the last on the Southern to be steam-worked and was electrified as part of the initial Bournemouth Line scheme.  No substation was provided at Lymington meaning power was always a "single-end feed" from the Brockenhurst end.  While traffic is normally light this does limit the potential for longer or higher-powered electric units to run normally as current can be low at the Lymington end.

 

The branch was normally worked by a 2Hap unit once an hour which was more than adequate for the traffic offering at most times.  On summer Saturdays an 8Cig formation worked for some years as a up Lymington Pier - Waterloo train mostly for holiday traffic coming off the Isle of Wight ferry.  The extra load on the power supply meant this train could only timetabled when nothing else should have been drawing current near Brockenhurst otherwise it would have difficulty starting.  I believe it was also limited to series operation on the branch.  There was no down through train - the stock worked down empties from Eastleigh.

 

Following the withdrawal of Hap units the branch went over to 4Vep operation and in more recent years has seen a half-hourly service.  It is just possible to achieve this with one unit.  Only one crew is required and apart from them sittlng idle at Brockenhurst for half of every hour on the previous service the significnat increase in use of the main line means there is no platform available for the unit to lay over.  Thus while traffic may not have increased that much the service has doubled in frequency.  In the final years of "slammer" operation this service was famously worked by 3Cig units dedicated to the branch service.

 

Since the withdrawal of slam-door stock South West Trains has found itself with a slight shortage or electric rolling stock but with adequate slack in the diesel roster.  The present class 450 units also draw rather more current than their slam-door predecessors making them a little sluggish at times due to the power limitations discussed above.  With a 10-car train (and often more than one of them) on the main line nearby on a weekday there can be very little current spare for Lymington and a sluggish branch unit may not be able to maintain the now tightly-timed service and cause unacceptable main line delays

 

The decision was made to use a Salisbury-based class 158 diesel unit on the branch on weekdays as the most efficient means of providing the service and matching rolling stock with passenger demand.  On weekends when there are fewer full-length trains on the main line - and hence when both more rolling stock and more electric current are available - the service is electrically worked by a class 450 from Northam.

 

I understand the possibility of borrowing a class 456 2-car unit from Southern was investigated but found to be unrealistic.  It would have required all staff concerned to be specially trained on a type not otherwise found with SWT and incompatible with anything else they run - in other words if it failed it would also have created quite a problem.

Edited December 12, 2013 by Gwiwer

[Classsix T]

On the way back from Bournemouth on Monday, I took the opportunity to have a quick return trip on the Lymington Branch. I noticed that the track at Lymington Pier is equipped with a conductor rail and I assume this applies to the whole branch. Does anyone know if this is so, and, if it is, why is the service run with a DEMU?

158s have hydraulic transmission BTW.

 

C6T.

[Joseph_Pestell]

I have always believed that the busy conurbation around the Solent should have a proper network of suburban services. They could have cascaded some stock down from the London suburbs and replaced it there with more suitable units (2+2 seating with more standing room).

 

Of course, to make a really sensible suburban network for Southampton one would need to electrify from Southampton and Eastleigh to Salisbury.

[roundhouse]

All the 456's are going over to SWT, many already off the Southern with the new 477's being put to use, soi maybe they might use a 456 on the branch in the future.

Edited December 12, 2013 by roundhouse

[jamie92208]

When they first started using the 158 there were a lot of letters in vaious magazines and one of the reasons mentioned was that the shuttle is so tightly timed that it was impssible to keep to the timetable due to the 450's taking longer to turn round (something to do with software,) than the 3 Vep's. 

 

Jamie

[PaulRhB]

All the 456's are going over to SWT, many already off the Southern with the new 477's being put to use, soi maybe they might use a 456 on the branch in the future.

It'll depend a lot on diagrams. The 158's are nearby and only return to a Salisbury at weekends, except for failures, and berth at Bournemouth. That's a possibility if they did the same idea as Branksome & Northam depots are now equipped for working on Desiros only. Edited December 12, 2013 by PaulRhB

[Gwiwer]

In that context it is worth remembering that when the branch service was run with 2Hap units that these were in daily use on the main line between Waterloo and Bournemouth and were fully serviced at both Bournemouth and Eastleigh depots.  They were used as additional peak-hour capacity on the slow trains for which a single 4Vep wasn't enough beyond Basingstoke.  They shared some commonality with the 2H / 3H DEMU units of the era which were maintained by Eastleigh and (to an extent) Fratton and Haps were also common at Fratton / Portsmouth also, usually, as peak hour additional capacity on slow trains and in later years along the coast to Brighton.

 

They were thus very familiar units with all staff routinely trained on them and could couple with any other EP-type EMU, or class 33, 73 or 74 locos which was handy in times of emergency.

 

That flexibility has been lost.  Partly as the result of the segmentation of the privatised railway but not entirely.  If class 456 units become spare in due course - and there is no suggestion that they will at this stage - there would still be a need for specific type training for possibly a small number of staff, for some means of emergency recovery (they can't couple to more modern 444 / 450 units and locomotives are not readily available any more) and they would require servicing somewhere.  Either involving a lengthy and costly transfer back to the London area or with dedicated facilities somewhere else; that somewhere else would not be Northam and Eastleigh is no longer an option either.

Edited December 12, 2013 by Gwiwer

[4630]

 

The branch was normally worked by a 2Hap unit once an hour which was more than adequate for the traffic offering at most times.  On summer Saturdays an 8Cig formation worked for some years as a up Lymington Pier - Waterloo train mostly for holiday traffic coming off the Isle of Wight ferry.  The extra load on the power supply meant this train could only timetabled when nothing else should have been drawing current near Brockenhurst otherwise it would have difficulty starting.  I believe it was also limited to series operation on the branch.  There was no down through train - the stock worked down empties from Eastleigh.

 

 

Just to add a correction here and to also provide a little additional detail. there has been a regular timetabled down through services from Waterloo to Lymington on Summer Saturdays.

 

My copies of the Working Timetable for 1977/78 and 1980/81 show this as a 10:00 departure from Waterloo with reporting number of 1B93 and headcode 97.  Arrival at Lymington Pier was scheduled for 11:53.  This working also effectively covered the normal hourly service from Brockenhurst as departure from there was timed at 11:41.  My copy of the Carriage Working Notice shows that the 4 Vep diagrammed for the full Saturday on the branch was berthed in the siding at Brockenhurst, while the service from Waterloo was on the branch, until the next scheduled departure.  At that time there was an electrified siding at Brockenhurst on the down side adjacent to platform 4.

 

 

 

Following the withdrawal of Hap units the branch went over to 4Vep operation and in more recent years has seen a half-hourly service.  It is just possible to achieve this with one unit.  Only one crew is required and apart from them sittlng idle at Brockenhurst for half of every hour on the previous service the significnat increase in use of the main line means there is no platform available for the unit to lay over.  

 

 

 

There is an additional consideration here too concerning the track layout at Brockenhurst and the former Lymington Junction.

 

Prior to 17^th October 1978 the service from Lymington terminated at platform 1 at Brockenhurst, generally at xx:09 each hour as this provided a connection with the hourly XX:20 Up semi-fast service to Waterloo.

 

Following departure of the Up semi-fast, the unit working the Lymington branch had to shunt from platform 1 to platform 4 to form the next xx:41 hourly departure to Lymington Pier.

 

From 17^th October 1978 the single reversible line adjacent to the down mainline was opened from the former Lymington Junction to Brockenhurst.  This allowed the Lymington service to operate direct to and from platform 4 and independent of the main line, avoiding the need to block the mainline with a regular shunt each hour.

 

I hope the above helps.

[lmsforever]

I wonder how this line has survived as every time I use the ferry to Yarmouth the train when it arrives does not have many passengers on board.Maybe they get off at the Town station as the amount of foot passengers on the ferry does not seem high,hopefully the line will continue in the future.

[TomJ]

So it would seem the main problem is that their DCC bus isn't powerful enough and they should have added more droppers at the Lymington end. Instead they chose the option of relying on rail joiners at the mainline end. Like countless modellers they will learn that cutting corners only leads to hassle later!!

[4630]

I wonder how this line has survived as every time I use the ferry to Yarmouth the train when it arrives does not have many passengers on board.Maybe they get off at the Town station as the amount of foot passengers on the ferry does not seem high,hopefully the line will continue in the future.

 

Annual passenger usage statistics for recent years are here;

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lymington_Town_railway_station

 

I hesitate to use Wikipedia but the statistics originate from an official source so should be reliable enough.  Well as reliable as any statistics are ! 

 

In my experience of living locally the service is well supported albeit with a significant increase during the summer months.  From an accounting point of view though I would doubt if the line more than barely covers its direct running costs.

 

 

 

Edited for typo.

Edited December 12, 2013 by 4630

[4630]

All the 456's are going over to SWT, many already off the Southern with the new 477's being put to use, soi maybe they might use a 456 on the branch in the future.

 

It's an interesting suggestion and one that seems to have been picked up by Porterbrook (who own the 456s) as they make reference to their possible future use on lightly used SWT services in their brochure.  See;

 

http://www.porterbrook.com/downloads/brochures/456%20Brochure.pdf

 

The one possible issue is that the 'well heeled' of Lymington and Brockenhurst would have to do without first class as the 456s will be standard class only when they're refurbished for SWT.

[Gwiwer]

The well-heeled of Lymington (and there's a fair few in the immediate area - you don't own yachts on a minimum wage ) may be working from home these days but if they are obliged to use the train I'm sure 10 minutes in a 158 standard class saloon compared with the greater part of a trip to Southampton or London in a first class seat is no undue hardship.

 

Year-round most traffic uses Town station.  Pier is largely a link with the ferry service which has suffered declining use recently.  It has always been the quietest of the IoW crossings which fact has been used to advantage by some when booking summer holiday crossings when Portsmouth - Fishbourne can be full and the Ryde catamarans likewise.

 

Traffic is therefore very highly seasonal.  In that regard the branch can be likened to many others from St. Ives to Mallaig.  Like them it sustains a base of daily travellers year round albeit a few were lost when the Ampress works close and the private station (in full Wellworthy Ampress Works Halt) with it.  

[Andy Y]

I was reading an article about the branch in the 1956 Railway Magazine and noted this:

 

 

Special authority is given for motor trains running between Brockenhurst and Lymington Town to run without a guard, one of the Town Station staff performing this duty on those trains that run to the pier. 

 

 

It seemed a bit surprising to me, after all a guard is responsible for the train's safety etc. but how widespread a practice was this and did it just apply to pull-push?

[Fat Controller]

The well-heeled of Lymington (and there's a fair few in the immediate area - you don't own yachts on a minimum wage ) may be working from home these days but if they are obliged to use the train I'm sure 10 minutes in a 158 standard class saloon compared with the greater part of a trip to Southampton or London in a first class seat is no undue hardship.

 

Year-round most traffic uses Town station.  Pier is largely a link with the ferry service which has suffered declining use recently.  It has always been the quietest of the IoW crossings which fact has been used to advantage by some when booking summer holiday crossings when Portsmouth - Fishbourne can be full and the Ryde catamarans likewise.

 

Traffic is therefore very highly seasonal.  In that regard the branch can be likened to many others from St. Ives to Mallaig.  Like them it sustains a base of daily travellers year round albeit a few were lost when the Ampress works close and the private station (in full Wellworthy Ampress Works Halt) with it.  

I remember a former girlfriend, Lymington born and bred, telling me that the only way the natives got on a yacht was as crew; the owners were all 'Northern Toffs' as she described them (actually it was slightly more colourful)

[Gruffalo]

I was reading an article about the branch in the 1956 Railway Magazine and noted this:

 

 

It seemed a bit surprising to me, after all a guard is responsible for the train's safety etc. but how widespread a practice was this and did it just apply to pull-push?

Gents, I was living on the IoW at this time and we very occasionally used the Yarmouth - Lymington ferry and thence train onwards. I can assure readers that the "guardless" operation was performed very safely - passengers could walk at the same speed the carriages were propelled between the Town station and the pier! Brockenhurst to Lymington Town positively flew by in comparison. I suspect the average speed between Brockenhurst and Lymington Town would not be more than 15 mph anyway, given the curves, level crossings and the short distance involved.

[Les Bird]

158s have hydraulic transmission BTW.

 

C6T.

I should have known that. I used to travel on them regularly when they worked Transpennine services.

[Classsix T]

No harm done Les, it's just I thought they must've turned out the Hastings unit when I read your OP.

 

C6T.

[lmsforever]

Agree about the yachts always see a really big one in the harbour it never seems to move ,perhaps its a floating board room for a northern toff!