scouser Posted March 4, 2014 Share Posted March 4, 2014 In this situation legally it does end at the platform edge - Mersey Rail has a legal responsibility and has to produce and apply safety procedures for the area it manages. If its platform staff are issued with, & trained etc in Rule Book Module G1 then they know the procedure to follow if an obstruction is reported to them - if they are not so trained then they don't. However in my view Module G1 should be issued to platform staff, maybe Mersey Rail think differently from me but I do note from the OP that the person involved said they would report it - and that is what the Rule Book expects of them and to be blunt that is all they could do. Whether they did, or didn't, report it is another issue but there will be records to confirm that either they did or did not. Let me get this straight, you are saying that a railway rule book overides Health and Safety legislation? Ok, so if a person falls off the platform then this is no business of the station staff because that person is now on the track, beyond the platform edge. Hmmm, this begs the question , regardless of rules or laws, of what kind of people are we talking about? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJM Dave Posted March 4, 2014 Author Share Posted March 4, 2014 I must admit I was kind of hoping for a Jenny Agutter character to jump down an start waving a red flag in the 4 foot as the train approached. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted March 4, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 4, 2014 The coins are normal on the magnets, the tiny amount of ferrous material in the coin is attracted to the very high magnetic field on the ramp - so don't worry about them. The coin fairy removes them every now and again. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted March 4, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 4, 2014 Let me get this straight, you are saying that a railway rule book overides Health and Safety legislation? Ok, so if a person falls off the platform then this is no business of the station staff because that person is now on the track, beyond the platform edge. Hmmm, this begs the question , regardless of rules or laws, of what kind of people are we talking about? In third rail territory it makes sense to get assurance the juice is off before doing anything - DC attracts and victims stick to it - the wooden paddles supplied can knock people off the juice if needed. It might sound callous but one victim is enough, adding more is not the way to help them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted March 4, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 4, 2014 Let me get this straight, you are saying that a railway rule book overides Health and Safety legislation? Ok, so if a person falls off the platform then this is no business of the station staff because that person is now on the track, beyond the platform edge. Hmmm, this begs the question , regardless of rules or laws, of what kind of people are we talking about? No - the Rule Book is compliant with H&S legislation and the employer's duty under that legislation plus numerous other requirements and legislation - so I can't understand why you should think otherwise. In this particular situation the response the OP got was in accordance with exactly what the Rule Book says so I'm puzzled to understand not only why you don't think it agrees with the H&S Act but also in what way you think it doesn't agree with that Act because on the basis of my knowledge of the Act and its provisions and application it wholly agrees with it. What other action do you think the member of Mersey Rail staff should have undertaken, or indeed what other action could he have undertaken. As far as someone falling off the platform edge is concerned the situation is quite simple - any platform staff must take whatever steps they can to get in touch with the controlling signalbox and arrange for trains to be stopped and if necessary exhibit a hand danger signal to try and stop an approaching train. What else do you expect them to do or be able to do - don't forget that platform staff have been disciplined for getting down onto running lines which is not only a breach of the Rules but is also technically an offence under the H&S Act and are thus liable to prosecution if they do so. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingsignalman Posted March 5, 2014 Share Posted March 5, 2014 I've only just seen this topic but as a Signaller at Sandhills I can say that all reports received are taken seriously. An example is that earlier in the week, a report was received from the Police regarding a suicidal female at about 02:30 in the Fazakerley area (not necessarily in the vicinity of the railway though). The first ECS at 0530 approx. was duly cautioned through the area and fortunately nothing was seen. I was on night turn, on the Wirral panel on the 1st March but I don't recall comments about an explosive device affecting a Kirkby line train. I'm off until Saturday night so I will check then. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tpe driver Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 there is one number for things that are a danger to life or property and is 999 don't be scared of using it pete Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tpe driver Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Let me get this straight, you are saying that a railway rule book overides Health and Safety legislation? Ok, so if a person falls off the platform then this is no business of the station staff because that person is now on the track, beyond the platform edge. Hmmm, this begs the question , regardless of rules or laws, of what kind of people are we talking about? they are not pts trained any more due to cost !!!!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingsignalman Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 A quick look in the occurrence book shows that at 16:40 a Kirkby train hit a gas bottle between Kirkdale tunnel and Walton Jcn. The driver of the following Ormskirk train, after being cautioned, removed the bottle at 16:47. At 17:28 the Kirkby to Liverpool train was declared a failure at Kirkby station. It was assisted by another, being cleared by 17:59 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dagworth Posted March 8, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 8, 2014 Hi Kenton, The aerosol can was perfectly placed square on on the AWS ramp, it was no discarded cad it was that well placed. It was also brightly coloured and in mint condition, however if that wasn't suspicious enough the coins placed around it (also on the AWS ramp) were! I must admit, I'd have thought that this would be classed as urgent, especially combined with that evenings explosion and 'device' at Kirby. It's not as though we are talking anything minor here, this could have resulted in tragedy. I've seen coke cans stuck to the top of AWS magnets in the past, if the aerosol can was steel it will stick to the magnet quite happily, as will the coins as Jim says. Nothing anywhere to suggest that such an item had to be deliberately placed there, more than likely just thrown from the platform. Andi Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingsignalman Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 Further to my last reply, the train that failed at Kirkby was the same one that hit the gas bottle. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJM Dave Posted March 14, 2014 Author Share Posted March 14, 2014 Hi everyone, A reply from Hayley Smith at MerseyRail today..........................................her words are copied and pasted here exactly.......................... "She has advised me that when you reported the aerosol that was on the track at Fazakerley to the member of staff in the booking office, they did indeed report it straight away to our Control Centre. As aerosol cannisters are magnetic, children attempt to throw coins at them to see if they stick to it.I can confirm that the incident that occured later in the day was on another part of the line and had no relevance to the aerosol incident that you reported to staff at Fazakerley station earlier in the day. This was confirmed by the British Transport Police and our Operations Manager." So that's all right then. cheers Dave Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold roundhouse Posted March 14, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 14, 2014 I will report any safety issues but these days anything else I tend not bother as I am normally wasting my time. A few months ago I contacted Southern to say that there was only one ticket window open at our station with a large queue and most of the ticket machines had Out of order on them. there were staff about but nothing was being done to sort the queues out. The reply was that all the machines were working as thats what their system said!! So my eyes were obviously deceiving me!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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