Small pre grouping multi franchise terminus - interchange ?

[ThePurplePrimer]

I have been thinking about something and wondered if there was a prototype for something that is floating around in my head

 

What I am imagining is a small terminus somewhere ( not in any city ) that is barely big enough to warrant two separate railway companies going there but they do all the same.

 

If this did happen ( or if it didn't- how would you imagine it ) ...

 

Would each line come into a separate fixed platform ? - I can't imagine they would share one ( but then I don't know what I am talking about ) - if separate want about run around loops - each have their own ones ?

 

If this ever happened then the more compact the better but quite happy to have two platforms - might even be better for what I am thinking

 

And who would own the station - and what livery would the station be in ?

[The Stationmaster]

Merthyr was relatively small although it boasted 5 platform faces (but one platform was extremely narrow) and was served by 5 companies.  Stations used by two companies, including termini with a single platform were not unusual in South Wales in Pre-Group days.

[IWCR]

Ryde  on  the  Isle  of  wight.

 

This  was  opened  in  1864  by  the  Isle  of  Wight  Railway

From  here  a  tramway  opened  to  Ryde  Pier  in  1871  worked  by  the  Ryde  Pier  company  with  horse  drawn  trams.

IWR  locomotives  worked  goods  trains  over  part  of  this.

At this  time  the station  had  3  platforms  for  trains,  one  alongside the  station  building    and  an  island  platform  with  two  faces  the  other  side  of  the  run round  loop.

A  level  crossing  then  lead  to  the  head shunt  and  an  end  on  junction  with  the  tramway.

In  1875 the  Ryde  &  Newport  railway  arrived,  the  station  remained  owned  by  the  IWR  which  now  used  only  the  island  platform  faces  with  the  building  platform  being  used  by  the  R&N.

 

I  would  expect  any  similar  mainland  station  would  be  owned  and  in  the  livery  of  the  first  railway  company on  site,  the  second  arrival  being  accomodated  within  depending  on  circumstances. 

 

Ryde  later  became  a  through  station  (Ryde St  Johns)  when  the  line  was  extended  to  the  pier  replacing  the  tramway

This  was  carried  out  by  the  LBSCR  &  LSWR  jointly,  ownership,  staff  and  liveries  on  the  extension  were  theirs.

The  IWR  and  R&N  (later  Isle  of  Wight  Central)  then  used  this  extension  sharing  stations  at Ryde  Esplanade  and  Pier  Head,  no  services  being  worked  by the  mainland  companies.

 

Pete

,   

[James Harrison]

Areas of the west midlands saw the Midland, London North Western and Great Western railways living cheek by jowl. 

 

E.g. Walsall- described in some detail in 'The South Staffordshire Railway', volume 1- southbound seeing three routes by the LNWR (Walsall, Dudley, Wolverhampton) and northbound four routes (Rugeley and Lichfield by the LNWR, Water Orton and Wolverhampton by the Midland) comes to mind.  This from a five platform station on a very compact site.  Yes, it's a through station but then that is what modeller's licence is for....

 

Or Dudley even, where the LNWR and GWR met end-on.  

 

In both instances the stations were finished in the colours of the majority user- the LNWR in this case.   

[edcayton]

St Albans (Abbey) is the nearest that comes to mind. IIRC it was LNWR, but had GN trains from Hatfield running into it.

 

Ed

[travelintrev]

Dunstable (North or Town)  was end-on with GNR from Hatfield and LNWR  from Leighton Buzzard.  IIRC there was one through platform (GNR) and the LNWR trains used the bay.  There was if memory serves correctly a turntable (LNWR)  opposite the GNR platform. I only went there a couple of times as a lad, so memories a bit dim.

 

 

Trev.

[Andy Hayter]

If you forget the "not in a city" requirement - York Queen Street.  The original station (not the later and current through station) built just inside (and piercing) the old city walls.

[Velopeur]

Portmadoc had both Ffestiniog and Welsh Highland

[ThePurplePrimer]

Thanks for the replies

 

What I am thinking is two platforms - one for each company but for them to both share the same goods yard somehow

 

I see both lines coming into the station via a junction off scene somewhere

 

I don't see them sharing each other's line into the station ( do you ? )

 

How do you imagine the run around loops might work - and one of them is going to need to cross the others line to get into the goods yard if it's a shared line

[Miss Prism]

I don't see them sharing each other's line into the station ( do you ? )

 

If the two companies are not sharing track infrastructure, two separate stations are likely.

 

The facility most unlikely to be shared would be a single goods yard.

[Tim H]

What about Aberystwyth - Cambrian coming in from the north, GW (formerly Manchester & Milford) coming in from the south.  Think there were five(?) platforms, though.

 

Did any GW trains run thruugh to Infracombe or did the trains on the line from Taunton only run as far as Barnstable?

 

Weymouth was definitely shared between GW and LSWR.

[IWCR]

There  were  some  GWR  through  trains  to  Ilfracombe  though  most  terminated at  their  own  Barnstaple  station.

Through  carriages  were also  used  being  worked  round  to  the  LSWR station  and  attached  to  their  trains.

 

Pete

[The Stationmaster]

And of course GWR trains ran through to Padstow - which only had a single platform (although perhaps not in Pre-Group days?)

[queensquare]

Bath Queensquare (Green Park after 1951). Midland and SDJR. Two platform branch terminus, separate loco sheds till 1930, separate goods sidings but shared goods yard/shed. The principal, and only, daily express except for summer saturdays, was the Manchester Diner (precursor to the Pines) which was formed of a MR and LNWR  rake on alternate days. LSWR coaches were also common as through coaches on trains such as the 'Monkey specials' from the south coast to Bristol zoo.

 

Jerry

[ThePurplePrimer]

Thanks for the replies so far

 

Now I know there is some real life examples of what's in my head I am now onto thinking how the trackwork might look in it's most basic level

 

I am imagining two single sided passenger platforms' one either side of the trackwork

 

Being as this is steam era the locos will need to runaround the trains in this terminus

 

So do you think there would have been 4 tracks going in so each platform had it's own runaround or could you have a situation where there was a third line in the middle that operated as the runaround for both platforms ?

[Miss Prism]

So do you think there would have been 4 tracks going in so each platform had it's own runaround or could you have a situation where there was a third line in the middle that operated as the runaround for both platforms ?

 

Depends on traffic density. A 3rd middle line was not uncommon, and seems a reasonable compromise. (For the really high density situations, running round and runround loops were often dispensed with, with new train locos or station pilots backing onto the train to take it back out again, e.g. GER 'Jazz' services.)

[ThePurplePrimer]

Thanks Miss Prism

 

Could you ( or anyone ) point me to a track plan like that please

[Velopeur]

Sounds like Newcastle (Northern Ireland) would fit the bill - subject to the same regulations as England, Scotland and Wales. I can't find a plan online, but if you consider it useful, I could do a sketch. This was served by the Belfast & County Down and the Great Northern Railway (Ireland).

[keefer]

Brechin in Angus had a middle release road between 2 platforms - I know there was the 'main' line to bridge of dun and the branches to forfar/edzell, but I don't know if each service stuck to its own platform or just used either.

 

Plan from NLS maps:

 

http://maps.nls.uk/view/82882890#zoom=6&lat=8824&lon=14182&layers=BT

[ThePurplePrimer]

I think I might have found something that is really very interesting and unusual and fits all my needs - I really like this.

 

It's the original ( I assume ) terminus at Ramsgate

 

I am excited by this it has a lot of features that I need and a freelanced version of it will make an interesting model

 

Off to work on a track plan and some scribbles

[ThePurplePrimer]

Some pictures ...