rowanj Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 With great trepidation, I have been asked and have agreed to post a description of my ongoing conversion of the Great British Locomotives K3 to the unique Thompson K5.I have been posting to the GBL page on this site, but it was suggested I pull the K5 posts together. I am aware, and am nervous, of the high degree of modelling skills and striving for accuracy to be found here, and hasten to point out that I am a modeller of limited talent, starting with a model of modest design, though of intrinsic dimensional accuracy. I see no point in spending a fortune to end up with a loco that cost more and runs and looks worse than its' RTR equivalent. Having said that, I have enjoyed modelling these cheap locos .Some of what I have done can be seen on the GBL page. The starting point for the K5 was a simple motorisation and modest body upgrade of a K3 using a Bachmann V1 chassis, with the wheels painted to hide the horrid shiny bits .Pictures of the original are shown below for those who have not come across them before. I have also shown a picture of the completed K3 which gave me the confidence/inspiration to push ahead with this conversion. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted September 2, 2014 Author Share Posted September 2, 2014 Here are the parts needed for the K5.Photos are at a premium of the loco, so I invested in an Isinglass drawing. This is the first time I have used them, and have to say the quality is excellent. The changes from the K3 are fairly numerous, but not too intimidating, and will produce a different-looking loco highly unlikely ever to appear in RTR, So I obtained another V1 chassis, a Replica B1 body and tender, and a Bachmann flared -top LNER Group Standard tender, and set off to work with Dremel and file. Photo shows the "kit" Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted September 2, 2014 Author Share Posted September 2, 2014 The photos above show the cuts needed to the chassis, and then to the body This is a very tight fit, and so a fair bit of shaving and filing was needed before the loose fitting to see how the parts looked. The photo on the layout was taken to see that all ran well. By this time, boiler handrails and steampipe had been removed to be replaced in the usual manner. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted September 2, 2014 Author Share Posted September 2, 2014 And this is more or less where I am up to today .The safety valves are now just ahead and behind the rear boiler band. Two additional washout plugs have been added to the RH firebox using a drop of PVA and inspection holes (is that what they are?) added in the correct place in the lower firebox. I used Romford fibre washers, and my personal jury is still out on these. At present, all is still a loose fit, and the cruel photos show some areas which need tidying The join between the B1 and K3 footplate was too fragile, i.e it snapped and so I've reinforced it with scrap etch using epoxy. It's now very slightly out of true, but is very strong. Typical . The next job is to start fitting lubricators/sandboxes etc to the footplate, which is a problem as I don't have any.!!! I was concerned about the valve gear, as the K5 looked quite different from the V1/3.Howver, working from the drawing, I may get awaywith a cosmetic plasticard cylinder cover of the correct, larger dimensions, and cut and re-glue valve spindles etc at the requisite higher point Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted September 3, 2014 Author Share Posted September 3, 2014 Latest photos with footplate furniture added and resprayed. My camera has done the join between the B1/K3 footplate no favours and has made the boiler look "nose up". So I rushed to correct it and found I couldn't see a problem with the footplate, and the boiler, which is still loose fitted, just needed pushing down slightly. I'll use Modelmaster lining transfers, which match up nicely with the Bachmann tender, and HMRS numbers. Still need to source a whistle, and will add fairly heavy weathering from the best photo I have of the loco. Once the cylinder covers are amended, I'll have an unusual model, which won't be getting entered into any competitions but will look o.k on the layout. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted September 5, 2014 Author Share Posted September 5, 2014 I've started adding the lining, and have made the cosmetic changes to the cylinders, by simply adding a plasticard cover and cut off and moved the V1 spindles etc. Although I measured the cylinder cover from the drawing, I thought at the time, and the photo confirms it, that it looks too big, so I've subsequently taken the XActo and needle file to it, and though far from perfect, it now looks better. I'll fit draincocks, finish the lining and weathering and then that will more or. less be that. Hopefully, the next and last photos will be of the completed loco. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted September 7, 2014 Author Share Posted September 7, 2014 To complete the series, here is the weathered and completed loco ready for duties. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
knobhead Posted September 29, 2014 Share Posted September 29, 2014 Looks good, Rowan! What's next? Regards, Stefan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted October 3, 2014 Author Share Posted October 3, 2014 I have been on a break both from WiFi and modelling for a few weeks but managed to pick up a couple of GBL D11's. Finding cheap chassis's is going to be an issue, but I do have the chassis from a tender-drive D49 at home, so will look to see how easy, or otherwise, it would be to remove enough material to fit a Mashima/ gearbox combination. If anyone has any idea, pls let me know. If it's feasible, I'll change the header of this topic and show photos if it goes ahead. To be honest, I can't be bothered with the frothing on the GBL thread, - though each to their own. Has anyone motorised the GBL D11? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
will5210 Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 It might be easier to use the loco drive Railroad D49 chassis, or perhaps a Triang L1? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
knobhead Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 Would a Triang L1 chassis fit the D11 without fouling the backhead? Regards, Stefan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted October 3, 2014 Author Share Posted October 3, 2014 I think the D49 Railroad is the best option, but they are almost impossible to find. Hornby are showing deliveries in 2015 at over £100 which makes motorising the GBL this way a silly proposition when the Bachmann model would be clearly superior at virtually the same cost. I've read the Railroad County is an option if one amends the wheel spacing, which is an inbuilt option in the chassis, but, once again, they are hard to get hold of. I suppose a tender-drive D49 might work, but I'm unsure about the tender wheelbase until I get home and can do some proper research. I don't have an L1 chassis, and so am unsure how easy a fit it would be. The sheer bulk of the X04 won't help. But I'll keep investigating after we get home on Sunday, and really would welcome any suggestions. Thanks for the ideas so far. John Edit - GEM have a readily available chassis kit for the Precursor, but my quick search can't give me a match o the D11 wheelbase. It might be another possibility. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
will5210 Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 The d49 & the L1 chassis coupled wheelbase are 40mm (10ft). As you say the County chassis can be converted to the longer wheelbase but you'll need to buy new coupling rods. The Gem D34 Glen chassis available from lychett models will have a 40mm wheel base as the Glen was designed for the Triang L1 chassis. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted October 4, 2014 Author Share Posted October 4, 2014 Thanks for the tip - I hadn't heard of Lytchett models, but will give the Glen chassis a go, as I already have a motor and suitable, if not strictly accurate, drivers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
will5210 Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 http://www.lytchettmanor.co.uk/ They seem to be the people selling the Gem stuff now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted October 6, 2014 Author Share Posted October 6, 2014 Just to complete this topic, a couple of photos of the K5 "in service" ,plus a GBL 9F which I photographed for another purpose. The photos, on examinations, show a white "splash" on the K5 which I need to investigate - it may be flash bounce off the chassis. It also seems as though things are not quite level, which I had not noticed before, but this may be either, a) dodgy trackwork,, B) an optical illusion/dodgy photography or c) the boiler needs resitting - its a force fit over the mechanism. It's only recently that I started taking photos of my models, and I really recommend it. Photos reveal a multitude of sins not always visible to (my) naked eye, most of which are actually simple to remedy. Those that are not develop skills, or show what not to do next time. The 9F, just for info, is GBL body, elderly Hornby tender body, running on a tender-drive mechanism which I picked up on EBay for, I think £20. I'm always chary of these mechanisms, but this one runs as sweetly and smoothly/slowly as you like. It will certainly do until a reasonably priced Railroad or Bachmann chassis turns up. But -oh - I've still got another GBL 9F in the loft! Other than wire handrails, altering the strange error to the cab-sheets and painting/ weathering, there is nothing much to this conversion. The loco represents a loco transferred to York from the SR. in 1960. I've amended the topic title in the event that I manage to motorise any more of these models. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted October 9, 2014 Author Share Posted October 9, 2014 Because I managed to pick up a tender - drive D49, I decided to see how the GBL D11 might work. The photos are self-explanatory. The motor is all you can use, as the tender frame is too long, too wide and would be a nightmare to cut, unless you have access to some serious kit. In any event, fitting the GBL tender is straightforward. The big fault is the wheelbase, but I'm hoping that, once the wheels are painted, it won't look too bad. In any case, nothing I've done to the tender means it still can't be used with a chassis of the correct wheelbase if I get round to finding or making one. I couldn't work out what was making the tender sit too high, and assumed the motor was hitting the moulded coal, so cut out a piece. It than transpired it was a moulding just behind the coal, so I cut that out. I hope it can be seen in the photo . I fit real coal anyway so the hole isn't a problem. Only one of the weights can be refitted unless you choose to cut them - not a job for the fainthearted! As you can see, I've tried it and it runs o.k. I'll try to fit the loco body tomorrow, and will post my success or otherwise! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cb900f Posted October 9, 2014 Share Posted October 9, 2014 Don't suppose an airfix/Hornby 4f tender drive would be nearer the wheelbase would it ? Pete Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted October 9, 2014 Author Share Posted October 9, 2014 ]Don't suppose an airfix/Hornby 4f tender drive would be nearer the wheelbase would it ? It may well be.I have one which I never really use, so will check the wheelbase and also see how easy it is to link to the D49 chassis. Thanks for the tip. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted October 10, 2014 Author Share Posted October 10, 2014 Today was spent fitting the body to the D49 chassis. I was amazed at the number of wires I found after removing the body! The photo shows the cuts, very simple, needed to the footplate. The boiler/cab needed no cuts, other than the removal of one of the fixing spigots which was being interfered with by the wiring loom and pushing the boiler up. I am struggling to work out how to secure the tender body to the motor, and there is still a noise in reverse where a plastic gear is touching the tender body, but otherwise all runs well. It's a shame to paint over the lovely GC livery, but for my era, BR unlined black is the order on what will become 62666 ZEEBRUGGE. As such, I have removed the valences, and will also remove the casting on the LH side of the smokebox. I'm not sure yet about the merit of using a D49 tender-drive, but having got this far, I'll push on. As cb900f suggested in post 18, the 4F tender is a better match but I couldn't see an easy way to link it to the D49 chassis, and the whole point, for me, in using these GBL models, is to keep the cost down but finish up with a decent "layout" loco. The other issue I'm looking at is replacing the driving wheels which had the valve gear fitted with a plain pair, which I have .My problem is that I can't see an easy way to drop the plastic keeper plate, and I have had several disasters with locos when pick-ups went flying and I couldn't put them back together!! Anyway, here are photos of the loose fitted bodies on the chassis. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DS239 Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 ]Don't suppose an airfix/Hornby 4f tender drive would be nearer the wheelbase would it ? It may well be.I have one which I never really use, so will check the wheelbase and also see how easy it is to link to the D49 chassis. Thanks for the tip. The Airfix 4F tender has a wheelbase of 6'6"+6'6" which is the same as the D11.The other alternative is the drive unit from the Hornby Schools [as I mentioned over on the GBL thread] Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted October 11, 2014 Author Share Posted October 11, 2014 The problem is getting hold of these things at a reasonable cost. The 4F and Schools tender drives are better than the D49 for wheelbase dimensions, but you still need the D49 loco chassis. I have got mine running now,and it looks o.k from normal viewing distance, but is the least satisfactory of my attempts so far with GBL.I see the D11/2 can be had for £85 so spending more than, say, £50 to motorise the GBL seems false economy. I,m still waiting for delivery of a Gem Glen chassis,which includes a tender chassis kit,which should produce a decent model. I,ll post a photo of the Mk 1 D49 version later so folk can judge if it's worthwhile. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted October 18, 2014 Author Share Posted October 18, 2014 Poor lighting today for photos, but attached is one of the D11, complete other than naming/numbering and some weathering. I'll also do something to tidy up the front handrail. The wheels need more black to hide the green still showing through here and there. I found a photo site with some pics of D11/1's in BR condition, including 62666 in1961. It shows how much had been modified from the Butler- Henderson as modelled by GBL.No doubt there are others I have missed, but, other than fitted handrails, I fitted a snifter valve behind the chimney, a new reversing lever from scrap etch, some very prominent wiring along both sides of the boiler to the smokebox, and removed the valances, as well as the clack valve on the LH smokebox side. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted October 19, 2014 Author Share Posted October 19, 2014 Though I can see a few bits to tidy up, these are the test-shots of the virtually completed D11.The incorrect tender wheelbase is exposed in the photos, though isn't as obvious in the flesh. There is nothing that can't be done to replace the tender motor with either a correct 4F or Schools motor, or with a chassis etch if the need arises. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Corbs Posted October 19, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 19, 2014 Absolutely top banana - I was going to get rid of my D11 but your one looks so good I may have to attempt to do something useful with it! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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