RMweb Gold Revolution Ben Posted December 30, 2014 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted December 30, 2014 Hello all, Just one more thing: because we cannot reach every corner of the internet, if you know someone who might be interested in this - either as an N Gauge modeller, or a collector of iconic trains, or someone who wants to support a new and exciting development in model railways - please let them know about this and impress upon them the "all or nothing" nature of the scheme. I found at our last club meeting that there were several members who had not seen this in model railway magazines or read about it on the internet, so there are lots of potential backers out there who just need to be alerted! If everyone reading this thread could mention it to like-minded friends, or at their local club, then we can reach some of those people. The deadline is January 18th. If, by then, we don't have the funding together then nothing happens and no one gets anything!! cheers Ben A. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu from EGDL Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 Hi Ben, It's getting to crunch time soon....and it is good to see a flurry of post Christmas activity in the pledges. alas, I have stretched as far as I can with 2 x 11 cars with sound (1 poppy version). I hope the project gets over the line as this is a far sighted and worthwhile endeavour and it would be a shame to see the good work wasted... Regards, Stu from EGDL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve-e Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 Have you thought about approaching the "Box sellers" or even smaller shops or even the N Gauge Society to see if they are interested in pledging for a set amount. eg the £255 set seems most popular so they pledge for 100 sets which will be uniquely numbered so they can sell them as "Limited editions", they pledge say £25500 for 100 with the promise they will have unique number /name for x years and can sell for whatever price say £330 and make £7500 profit? or is this margin too small for them?? This way those that haven't heard of the scheme will get a chance to buy, those who perhaps cannot afford it now but can get one but at a premium rate in the future and the box shifters put something back into the hobby. Just a thought. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Revolution Ben Posted December 30, 2014 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted December 30, 2014 Hi Steve, We have sent emails and flyers to numerous traders. I am aware of at least one who has indicated they will be pledging. Having said that, we'd be delighted if more were to pledge! cheers Ben A. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Igor Posted January 1, 2015 Share Posted January 1, 2015 Some interesting comments from DJ Dave in his end of year report. He is still working on the Pendolino and can now do it considerably cheaper than before. With pricing always an issue, it muddied the waters somewhat I thought. Not exactly what you need at this point in time! Could we see another 'duplication' debacle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium jjb1970 Posted January 1, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 1, 2015 The DJM announcement is interesting, the tone seems to infer that he will push on if the crowd funding effort fails. As such it offers an insurance policy to N gauge modellers wanting the Pendolino. I have no idea how much DJM did for the project before it switched to Rapido but if he expended some effort and has materials to give him a good start on a Pendolino model then he has every right to continue. I'm guessing that DJM will await confirmation of whether Rapido goes forward before making a decision as the potential returns from such a project will be compromised if a large part of the potential market has already bought a rival product. If the crowd funding fails then there will be no duplication. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJM Dave Posted January 1, 2015 Share Posted January 1, 2015 The DJM announcement is interesting, the tone seems to infer that he will push on if the crowd funding effort fails. As such it offers an insurance policy to N gauge modellers wanting the Pendolino. I have no idea how much DJM did for the project before it switched to Rapido but if he expended some effort and has materials to give him a good start on a Pendolino model then he has every right to continue. I'm guessing that DJM will await confirmation of whether Rapido goes forward before making a decision as the potential returns from such a project will be compromised if a large part of the potential market has already bought a rival product. If the crowd funding fails then there will be no duplication. Hi everyone, I thnk it fair that I clear this one up. I have been working on a pendolino for some time now, and apart from finance am ready to go. However, things changed a lot when I got a confirmed quote from China for cheaper tooling and unit costs, and this moved the goal posts. But......... I don't have the finance to do it myself at this time. Which is why I urge everyone to support Ben and Mikes Kickstarter. Only if it fails will I offer everyone a second bite of this cherry, but don't not pledge on my say so, please do it and do it soon as the guys deserve success on this. Cheers Dave 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium amwells Posted January 1, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 1, 2015 Seems like a most sensible and measured approach all round. Just the sort of goodwill we need in the hobby. While I won't change over to N gauge (sorry, way too invested in OO now), this project has got me closest to being tempted! Best of luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Revolution Ben Posted January 1, 2015 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted January 1, 2015 Hello all, We're getting close to 50% funded now, so still an enormous way to go. I do think that there will be a surge toward the end, but it's going to be a close-run thing! The Sidekick predictor is still giving us an 80% chance of success (last time I looked) and I hope it's right! Thanks to Dave for being very gracious indeed in urging people to support us - in turn I must say that whether our Pendolino project is successful or not, 2015 promises to be very exciting year and I'm very much looking forward to seeing first shots of the DJM N Gauge Clayton which appear to be really close now... cheers Ben A. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Revolution Ben Posted January 2, 2015 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted January 2, 2015 Hello all, CJM PLEDGES FOR A PENDOLINO! We are delighted to say that Chris Marchant of CJM has given his full backing to the N Gauge Pendolino project, having been sent a Rapido GMD-1 chassis to test after the Warley National Model Railway show. Chris Marchant established CJM in 1987 to create bespoke, high specification N gauge models aimed at the modern image enthusiast. In the early 1990s he was asked to assist in construction of the large Channel Tunnel display layout, and advised Kato in production of their highly regarded Eurostar while developing his own Class 92. Since then CJM has produced Classes 56, 59, 60, 66, 67 and most recently the Class 50 to his own design and each individual customer's specification in livery, identity and weathering. CJM models are not cheap - retailing at around £500+ - but offer superb levels of finish and detailing. Chris has offered valuable assistance and advice in our N Gauge Pendolino project, for which we are extremely grateful. For more information about CJM see here: http://www.cjmmodels.co.uk/ The GMD-1 is Rapido's first N-scale loco and features powerful motor, smooth low-friction drive and directional lighting. DC and DCC Sound versions are being produced. (Photo courtesy J Portal/Model Rail) Chris tested the GMD-1 on a large 30' x 13' model he is building for a customer that represents Lancaster in the present day. He tested the model on 13 "out of the box" RTR coaches against brand new items from Farish, Dapol and Kato. Only the Kato locomotive was able to match its performance. Chris says: "In continuous running tests failed to show any weaknesses, even over a prolonged period of running. Test running back at CJM subjectively suggested it was now smoother and quieter than when it first arrived! "In terms of detail and finish the model looked exceptionally good, with some very fine etched grills and step details, the injection moulded parts and printing looking very crisp!" (Photo courtesy CJM studio) Chris says he'll be urging any of his customers who want a Pendolino to support the project, and can see the potential for crowd-funding in the future, adding: "It is fair to say that if this project succeeds then it opens the door to a wide range of N gauge models which have so far gone unnoticed!" We are now at £106k funded, so just over halfway, with just over a fortnight left of the pledging period. We have sourced plans from Alstom, Virgin Trains have given us their backing and permission to 3D scan the real thing - now all we need is N Gauge Modellers to pledge for this model to make it happen. We are now 51% funded with just over a fortnight to go until our DEADLINE of JANUARY 18th. We had hoped to be nearer the target by now, so there is obviously something holding people back. Just to reiterate:* The Pendolino isn't going to come from the major manufacturers - projected sales v the cost of tooling for this complex vehicle don't stack up, sadly. In the US and elsewhere crowd-funding or pre-order systems are fairly standard now.* If you pledge now NO MONEY IS TAKEN unless we reach our FULL TOTAL target by JANUARY 18th.* If we fall short the project won't happen, unless we get very close in which case Rapido might proceed anyway, but the model will be at least 25% more expensive as they will distribute it via retailers* If we succeed then we will produce ONLY the models pledged for - there will be no chance to jump on board later. And Rapido have undertaken not to use the tooling to produce more models for at least two years. If you don't want to miss out now then register at our website http://www.ngaugependolino.com and we will send out a reminder if you don't want to pledge now.* If we can fund an RTR model in this way we will make model railway history. This model will have unique packaging and will be highly collectable in years to come.* Even if you don't want a Pendolino why not pledge as an investment? For a year you'll have the excitement of being part of something new, and when you receive your model you can just eBay it. Given the amount of excitement that will be generated by then, and the number of people who will want one, it shouldn't be hard to sell for at least a small profit - and in percentage terms quite probably more than you'd get leaving money in a savings account or an ISA!cheersBen A. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold roundhouse Posted January 3, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2015 Too true Ben. My ISAs interest rate keeps on falling. Might have to invest it in Pendolinos!!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium njee20 Posted January 3, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 3, 2015 Great to have Chris Marchant's endorsement! Interesting to see how volatile the success calculator is - but still generally quite high c70%. I've been trying to find out the 'profile' of successful projects in terms of how big the spike is within the last week(s), but unsucesfully! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Revolution Ben Posted January 3, 2015 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2015 Yes, the sidekick predictor does seem to be very up and down as we enter the final fortnight! It's apparently produced by a Dutchsrudent as a PhD project, and just crunches data from previous campaigns to generate its prediction. I suppose as it's a live changing display its impossible to say how accurate it is at any given time! We are delighted that CJM has decided to endorse our project - his track record in British N is second to none in terms of quality, reliability and innovation. Cheers Ben A. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy L S Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 I remain thoroughly impressed by the creativity, professionalism and sheer hard work that Ben, Mike and no doubt others have put in to get the project this far. Probably best to take the predictor with a "pinch of salt" (either positively or pessimistically) as widely different projects will doubtless have totally different market/demographic appeal. What is very apparent to me is that there has been a sudden pick up to push the project beyond £100k and then over half way, and I hope it continues. 300 pledges will be the next barrier to breach, then £110k etc.. I have no doubt that there are sufficient potential buyers to hit the target, but as Ben has rightly said it is hard to reach everyone. Other challenges remain a reticence in this "instant" world to stump up cash and then have to wait for something.. What I would reiterate to those who are wavering is that in many ways the "Pendo" is a massive test of the will of modellers of British N to get behind a Kickstarter project and make it succeed. It may well set a precedent for future projects (or not) in terms of both viability and being taken seriously by manufacturers. That is why I have pledged, it is not from an era I model, I do not "do" AC electrics, but there couldn't be many better "Rule 1" models for my layout AND if successful it might just mean the opportunity for one that DOES fit my modelling preference. So, I guess my specific appeal would in particular go to all the potential "Rule 1" modellers out there who haven't yet pledged.... Roy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ash39 Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Without wanting to put a dampener on things, I think we all know to get the same amount of 'new' backers in 2 weeks as we have already had in 6 weeks is going to be tough. I appreciate there may still be people out there who would be interested and haven't heard about it yet, but certainly not the amount needed to reach the total. Couple of things I can think of that could push the project over the line, some of which I'm sure have been investigated or pursued already. 1 - Trader pledges. I'm sure some small to medium sized traders would be interested in a handful. For example, if you could persuade 10 traders to pledge for 3 sets, that's obviously a large chunk of the remaining requirement. 2 - Special liveries or incentives. I'm aware of the Royal British Legion 'poppy' version which has been offered, and I recall earlier in the thread someone saying the film promotion liveries would be difficult due to licencing, but how about the Alstom or Traindeer versions? These are linked only to Alstom and Virgin who are already backing the project. The idea behind this is not so much to get new backers, but to tempt existing backers to pledge for another set. Another option would be to offer a small percentage discount to people pledging for two or more sets, whilst this obviously is counter productive towards reaching the total, at least it's more money in the pot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-CRS Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 (edited) I think this project has been a massive success up to this point and hope it can push on all the way. Even if it fails it will have moved the goal posts and pushed at the boundaries. More people will be aware of this system of modeler funding and be more open to it in the future. As railway modelers we have gone from raising a few thousand like I did and others have like building in your hand to raising 10s of thousands and topped the 100 thousand truly amazing. Keep up the good work I truly wish success with this project and will continue to follow with interest. Edited January 3, 2015 by Tricky-CRS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Revolution Mike Posted January 3, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2015 Hi Ash Ben and I have already been through one round of contacting traders and we are embarking on a second round aimed at the smaller traders. Special liveries - despite best efforts we did not get very far with the film liveries. Ben and I discussed the Traindeer livery but we were worried about its relatively short life span. Our experience of the RBL Poppy set is that it doesn't generate large numbers of new pledges as typically people switch pledges rather than pledge for another set. Discounts - unfortunately we can not do that. We made the very conscious decision from day 1 that if we were handling other people's money and asking people to pay up front that we had to keep the price as low as possible so there is no margin for discounting as Ben and I are not trying to make any profit. Cheers, Mike 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaGrange Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Was a good and bad idea launching at Warley - good as its the ideal place to do it, bad as its close to Christmas... All a big gamble at the end of the day.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy L S Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 I think any suggestion is worth considering but realistically the issue I see with getting smaller traders to sign up is about tying up working capital. Let's say they were asked to pledge for 5 sets, that's circa £1.3k of cash locked into the project for many months and therefore unavailable to invest in other stock and potentially turn that over a number of times for profit in the same period. They would have to be very confident of their ultimate return to commit. Roy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acko22 Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 I know it's kind of late in the day now, But as has been pointed for a retailer to splash out for say 10 of the 9 coach sets and have to wait for them is a relatively big ask, would it not be worth trying to get them towards the 5 coach sets instead with an option to buy the 2 coach add on pack in this first period. The with agreement between all parties then say after 1 year then have a second 2 coach pack come out so those retailers that have had interest in extra coaches to make a 9 coach set from the original 5 coach set. I just makes it less of a financial burden on the retailers and gives them some incentive for follow up sales with he 2 extra coach packs, at the end of the day they all have one aim to make money and using the 5 coach sets in this way would give them potentially bigger rewards for a potential risk! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Revolution Ben Posted January 3, 2015 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2015 Hello all, Thanks for the help and suggestions. The Pendolino we are offering is, in essence, at trade price. As Mike's said, there is no room for discounting or any other price-based incentivising. From a trader's point of view backing us does tie up capital but it is a relatively small amount - max £5k - and offers a potential return on investment in roughly a year. We will only provide models to those who've pledged, but I feel there are sure to be plenty who pick up on this after the event via mags, internet or shows, and decide they "must have" one. And with Kickstarter upper limits on pledging there is no chance of the larger retailers offering them at discounted rates. I am sure that the buzz around the models when they are imminent this time next year will create an instant market for traders or indeed any private individual who wishes to pledge to support us and then immediately eBay the model. At the moment, if you have £2000 to invest in something I reckon this project is a better bet than an ISA or a building society interest account!! cheers Ben A. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold roundhouse Posted January 3, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2015 Add to Ben post that once these units are in pledges hands that there will be a fair few layouts on the exhibition circuit and then more people will want them so buying a few with some of them for resale is likely to help towards the purchase of the ones you keep for yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Revolution Ben Posted January 3, 2015 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2015 Hello all, As we look toward mounting the "final push" to the finish line, upcoming shows could be critical. Today there was the Marlow and Maidenhead MRC exhibition - did anyone with any flyers go? Next weekend (Jan 10th/11th) we have: Chiltern MRC (St Albans) Bognor Regis MRC, Bognor Orpington and District MRC Then on the final weekend we have: Astolat (Guildford) Harpenden Pennine (Huddersfield) Canterbury Kilmarnock Bentley (Calne) E Lancs (Blackburn) There is the potential for reaching an awful lot of modellers at these shows, so let's really give it our best shot. I know quite a few of our supporters still have flyers and are planning to attend various shows now; can I please have a "virtual" show of hands (PM is fine) so I can see who is where, and where I need to try to recruit backers. And if anyone has flyers but, for whatever reason, does not think they will be able to use them please let me know and I will try to arrange more useful distribuition! cheers Ben A. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctc Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Think its such a shame (whilst probably understandable) these Kick Starters schemes have such a all or nothing flavour. It really is incredible and something that you should be very proud of that you raised so far £100k but all that can be undone if it does not hit the final target seems quite cruel. In some ways its a shame the system couldn't be adapted and more flexible. Unlike other sectors people whilst not wishing to stereotype we generally appear to be quite considered purchasers when it comes to investing in product compared to others. Please don't take this as criticism me talking aloud. Wonder whether in future if this scheme was to be repeated with other models whether the success chances would be enhanced if half was raised from a pre order type system (like Kernow did) and half was the Kick Starter route. Am tempted myself to go for it although not a N Modeller purely to be part of it mind. Love to see this type of scheme do well and evolve into something that becomes more mainstream. Good Luck. Feels like defining moment for the hobby. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold roundhouse Posted January 3, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2015 We will have the fliers out on Banbury at Canterbury Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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