Hermes and similar 'cheaper' parcel services.

[berwicksfinest]

Well BH I cannot comment on your courier, I can only quote how we conduct ourselves.

 

It certainly sounds that you are out of your place of residence a fair few times, However again I can only quote on our custoners and whilst tracking info can be sketchy items has to be inputted at source for tracking info to be valid, but that something a courier has no control over I would suggest requesting a explanation from Hermes.

 

To your courier again I don't know the couriers route/workload etc, your property etc. However we would never leave items on a doorstep that is unacceptable.

However over a locked 6ft gate I would have done myself. it is a secure location, and I am sure your defintion of hurled and mine slightly differ.

 

But I would say would you travel out in any weather and make repeated calls (if you had to take the parcel away, then that would be at your own cost. You would not get paid for it) ? and if by virtue you left the parcel whether by safe place or whether by signature you would get paid the princely sum of 50p. If the answer is yes then sign up, come and be a courier believe me, Hermes would love people with your standards in their employ.

However as you say your courier would benefit from a brain cell and think where to leave them (your words) I am sure the courier may well be saying I wish this customer would also benefit from a bit of cerebrum activity and actually make something available which I can leave his parcel without getting wet and is completely safe.

[berwicksfinest]

I'd dearly love to get to know my local myHermes courier, who in the past has forged my signature (badly) on the POD when presumably he'd lost the parcel.

 

Whether it's worth getting to know your local courier is very dependent on their personal work ethic.

 

If any courier did deliver when I was out provided they left a card with a phone number I would make sure at least the second delivery was successful. Also if I received notification of delivery BEFORE the parcel was out for delivery and I'd be out I'd rearrange for when I'm in. However I don't always get the opportunity.

Norm81 please report this this is bang out of order POD is proof of delivery if its forged Hermes need to know !!

 

As Hermes we always leave a card. However as an incident that happened today yesterday in fact the missus had 3 "crank" calls from a group of lads having a laugh (strangely enough its the phone we use for Hermes business. obviously somehow someone has been less than confidential with the number. As this makes you wonder why we actually leave a point of contact if these things continue to happen.

I wish everyone would make these arrangements thankfully 90% of our round do and is very much appreciated but 10% are very much like our previous forum poster !

[Jonboy]

My current favourite is Amazon - I have always had the majority of stuff sent to work to avoid all this hassle of someone being in/safe place etc. etc. but now Amazon Logistics keep attempting Saturday or evening deliverys and their advance notifications don't allow you to change the proposed times...a simple message box at point of order would safe lots of these carriers lots of hassle me thinks.

[kernowtim]

I have started using Hermes in preference to royal mail mainly on cost grounds and the fact that its easier to get to one of their drop off points than the local post office. I have always paid for proof of delivery and sent parcels well wrapped and usually double boxed, so far had no problems!!

[Butler Henderson]

Seems to be some vast different qualities of delivery people as I have never had a card from Hermes through the letter box. Surprised that "berwicksfinest" thinks it okay to drop a parcel over a 6ft gate - I used the phrase hurled as the distance over the gate was clearly impossible for the parcel being merely placed over the gate and dropped. What "drop off points" (kernowtim)  - KMRC using Hermes now ? No more orders with them then,

[Quarryscapes]

As with all couriers it's almost entirely down to the driver who collects and the driver who delivers. Everything in the middle is usually much of a muchness no matter what the company. I did use Hermes a lot, but they became too unreliable and I had to resend several parcels with other couriers because Hemes just weren't turning up to collect, and to get them to come back meant having to go through all the booking again, printing a new label, cancelling the old delivery and waiting 2 weeks for a refund. I've still got credit on my account with them due to these issues (after complaining to customer support who were at least human and friendly) but I won't use them. Receiving has been a lottery with them too, and I'll avoid any sellers using them or ask if they can use RM even if it costs more to me. 

 

The best firms round here were City Link who eventually got all my business, DPD, UPS and Fedex. 

[Keith George]

If you are not in you cannot get to know the courier, parcel tracking is vague at the best and usually some time behind what is actually happening and neighbours could be out. What hardly any of the delivery firms do is communicate with the person they are delivering to in any responsible manner. Would it be beyond reason to send a text 90/60/30 mins before delivery and there ought to be some secure method to redirect / delay delivery etc

Do Royal Mail do this. ???

 

I think not.

[Crosland]

There lies the problem people order the items and expect delivery when they are in, usualy outside work times etc. You expect the courier work to your timetable

 

No, we order items knowing there may well be issues, but it needs give and take on both sides. Courier firms know full well that deliveries will fail, for all sorts of reasons.

 

What we expect is that the courier has a system in place to cope, rather than just leaving the parcel in a bush or chucking it over a gate with no regard to the contents.

 

Perhaps there is an opportunity for a courier firm that only delivers outside working hours. They could make a killing.

 

Andrew

[EddieB]

My current favourite is Amazon - I have always had the majority of stuff sent to work to avoid all this hassle of someone being in/safe place etc. etc. but now Amazon Logistics keep attempting Saturday or evening deliverys and their advance notifications don't allow you to change the proposed times...a simple message box at point of order would safe lots of these carriers lots of hassle me thinks.

First time I think I've been on the receiving end of Amazon Lostlogics and not a good start.  After advising that a delivery would be made tomorrow (Monday), the tracking status shows that they had failed to deliver yesterday (Saturday), even though there was someone at home all day.

 

Then, the whole family having been out this morning, I get back to find the status is now "delivered, handed to resident" timed at about fifteen minutes before we returned home.  Clearly not handed to us, not left in an obvious place and (of course) no note put through the letterbox (which is probably big enough to post the package anyway).  Is it with a neighbour?  If so, it could be one of at least seven adjacent or similarly numbered properties - unless they drop it by, I don't fancy knocking on half the doors in the street on the off-chance they might have it.

 

Yes and of all things for them to misdeliver, a complete set of "Where's Wally" books seems most apt.

 

Still it's Amazon's problem to sort out.

 

Edit: Happy update, no sooner finished typing that and a neighbour from further up the street came by with the "lost" package - it seems the courier couldn't read house numbers!

[EddieB]

 

 

What we expect is that the courier has a system in place to cope, rather than just leaving the parcel in a bush or chucking it over a gate with no regard to the contents.

 

 

 

For then they would be Parcelfarce?

 

(From experience).

[berwicksfinest]

Seems to be some vast different qualities of delivery people as I have never had a card from Hermes through the letter box. Surprised that "berwicksfinest" thinks it okay to drop a parcel over a 6ft gate - I used the phrase hurled as the distance over the gate was clearly impossible for the parcel being merely placed over the gate and dropped. What "drop off points" (kernowtim)  - KMRC using Hermes now ? No more orders with them then,

Again as previously stated I don't know your courier however if a delivery has been attempted a card should be left, whether left or taken away.

 

I stated I would leave over a 6ft locked gate, to clarify I would place the parcel over said gate and lower as far as I could, again your courier may have some dispute with continous calls without answering

 

One question though I would ask so far you have brought into question Hermes and there method of delivery, However what have you done to aid in the delivery of your parcels.

when making orders was arrangements made so if you wasn't home then your alternative arrangements could be used (these actually show in red on our hand helds).

You obviously don't know your courier but did you ask someone to keep an eye out, or a note on the door if you went out ?.

Did you make anythng available to leave a parcel (garage, porch, secure postal box ?

 

The problem lies that we get paid for a delivery, not a call. so the courier travels around his round gets to your address, your not in, if the courier goes away with your parcel he doesn't get paid. Day 2 same thing happens so twice he or she has called to deliver your parcel your not there and they haven't earned anything in fact its cost them time on their round and fuel to call. when the customer has made no alternative arrangments.

Give us a fighting chance, however as you said you will not use a seller that will use Hermes, your choice but if you were on my round i'd be breathing a sigh of relief, now

[Crosland]

I stated I would leave over a 6ft locked gate, to clarify I would place the parcel over said gate and lower as far as I could,

Unless you are proportioned like an Orangutan that would mean dropping it anything up to 5'.

 

Sorry, but that's exactly the sort of behaviour that is unnacceptable.

 

Andrew

[stewartingram]

If I am using a courier, or more precisely, if a courier is delivering to me, the internal workings of the company involved are of no interest to me. The company is (supposedly) providing a service, which has of course been paid for by the sender. If the parcel is not delivery promptly (within specicifed contract) or safely, they have failed to carry out that service. If repeated calls are necessary, then they should have arrangements in place to accomodate this. If their internal workings include sub-contractors, and the delivery person is effectively running at a loss, then that is between the company and the sub-contractor, it shouldn't involve the customer. So no tipping over gates 6' high to cause damage, or leaving items exposed on wet doorsteps! Sorry, this may sound harsh to the person delivering, but it is not providing the service. And as a sub-contractor, in my opinion the same rule applies as has always applied to me in my work career. If the company cannot treat me properly, find another.

 

Stewart

[Butler Henderson]

Do Royal Mail do this. ???

 

I think not.

 

 

The big difference is that if Royal Mail cannot deliver safely the parcel goes back to the local sorting office.

 

 

One question though I would ask so far you have brought into question Hermes and there method of delivery, However what have you done to aid in the delivery of your parcels.

when making orders was arrangements made so if you wasn't home then your alternative arrangements could be used (these actually show in red on our hand helds).

You obviously don't know your courier but did you ask someone to keep an eye out, or a note on the door if you went out ?.

Did you make anythng available to leave a parcel (garage, porch, secure postal box ?

 

The problem lies that we get paid for a delivery, not a call. so the courier travels around his round gets to your address, your not in, if the courier goes away with your parcel he doesn't get paid. Day 2 same thing happens so twice he or she has called to deliver your parcel your not there and they haven't earned anything in fact its cost them time on their round and fuel to call. when the customer has made no alternative arrangments.

Give us a fighting chance, however as you said you will not use a seller that will use Hermes, your choice but if you were on my round i'd be breathing a sigh of relief, now

When the sender opts to use Hermes rather than Royal Mail it is too late to provide specific delivery details. One of the big problems with all delivery firms is that as the end customer you have to contact the seller to make any alterations (and which is invariably too late). As indicated earlier other couriers are responsible, indeed on the day I had the parcel hurtled over the gate by Hermes another parcel deliveried by City Link RIP was left behind a shed that is outside the locked gate and a note put through the letterbox. 10/10 for City Link RIP 0/10 for Hermes.

[berwicksfinest]

Unless you are proportioned like an Orangutan that would mean dropping it anything up to 5'.

 

Sorry, but that's exactly the sort of behaviour that is unnacceptable.

 

Andrew

 

Well it has been mentioned my primate like features but hey ive got broad shoulders

 

If I am using a courier, or more precisely, if a courier is delivering to me, the internal workings of the company involved are of no interest to me. The company is (supposedly) providing a service, which has of course been paid for by the sender. If the parcel is not delivery promptly (within specicifed contract) or safely, they have failed to carry out that service. If repeated calls are necessary, then they should have arrangements in place to accomodate this. If their internal workings include sub-contractors, and the delivery person is effectively running at a loss, then that is between the company and the sub-contractor, it shouldn't involve the customer. So no tipping over gates 6' high to cause damage, or leaving items exposed on wet doorsteps! Sorry, this may sound harsh to the person delivering, but it is not providing the service. And as a sub-contractor, in my opinion the same rule applies as has always applied to me in my work career. If the company cannot treat me properly, find another.

 

Stewart

 

As said previous I help the missus, my chosen profession is driving the 12in to foot scale trains, (freight) to passengers thankfully

 

Right as a source of personal amusement, and being there is so much feeling regarding Hermes lets have an experiment. facts are thus

 

Our round is approximately a 25 mile round trip,

Our round (non Christmas) comprises of approx 120 parcels.

Approximate time for days work Start at 08.30, finish approx 18.00 (thats loading and time to nip for something to eat and a PNB)

 

I have your parcel, I arrive at your address and your not there, What do you propose to do with your parcel ??

 

*Mr B Henderson I know your answer you'd use City LinK RIP and there would be no way you'd entertain Hermes and shop elsewhere to avoid us (even though I have asked what you would do to assist delivery)

[Revolution Mike]

I have sympathy for both sides - recipients and the poor b*ggers delivering parcels.  It is an incredibly competitive market where the customer is often not willing to pay much for P&P.

 

I know from costing P&P for the N gauge Pendolino project that I was surprised at the cost of deliveries.

 

Someone else mentioned that the big problem is that if the customer is not in then either that means re-delivery costs for the carrier or it gets sent back to some (generally) inconvenient depot. Amazon offer evening deliveries (as do supermarket deliveries) and I can only think that this is sensible and more likely to become more common.

 

Cheers, Mike

[Super D]

Over the past year my wife has used Hermes to collect and deliver her artwork to her customers. She has not had one complaint and delivery has always been prompt with well over 200 so far.

 

Yodel on the other hand are a joke. Parcels delivered by them have been left at our front door in full view of passers bye with a note through the letterbox saying 'Parcel left in a safe place by the front door'! To date we have had three stolen and after contacting them they still persist in leaving parcels by the door when we are out despite the fact that they are instructed to leave them under a covered area at the rear of my property.

[TheWeatheringMan]

Again as previously stated I don't know your courier however if a delivery has been attempted a card should be left, whether left or taken away.

 

I stated I would leave over a 6ft locked gate, to clarify I would place the parcel over said gate and lower as far as I could, again your courier may have some dispute with continous calls without answering

 

One question though I would ask so far you have brought into question Hermes and there method of delivery, However what have you done to aid in the delivery of your parcels.

when making orders was arrangements made so if you wasn't home then your alternative arrangements could be used (these actually show in red on our hand helds).

You obviously don't know your courier but did you ask someone to keep an eye out, or a note on the door if you went out ?.

Did you make anythng available to leave a parcel (garage, porch, secure postal box ?

 

The problem lies that we get paid for a delivery, not a call. so the courier travels around his round gets to your address, your not in, if the courier goes away with your parcel he doesn't get paid. Day 2 same thing happens so twice he or she has called to deliver your parcel your not there and they haven't earned anything in fact its cost them time on their round and fuel to call. when the customer has made no alternative arrangments.

Give us a fighting chance, however as you said you will not use a seller that will use Hermes, your choice but if you were on my round i'd be breathing a sigh of relief, now

Having read this thread thoughout and noted particularly your comments it is very clear that in many ways you sum up just what is wrong with cheapjack couriers and the problems they cause for people.

When a person makes a perfectly fair comment about not using a seller who uses hermes you make the comment that you'd breathe a sigh of relief - very clearly illustrates just what standard of customer service you operate.

Having had first hand experience of the disgusting 'service' provided by Yodel I think its high time that the government stepped in and passed laws to regulate this industry.

Properly set up companies with branded vans and uniformed drivers, a code of conduct (legally enforceable) as to how deliveries are handled (much like RM and what we had a few years ago with operations like Red Star and BRS/Roadline.

The prevention of outfits that employ anyone with a rust bucket handling peoples property.

Forging signatures, throwing parcels over fences etc would result in the sack from a decent operation.

And as for these cowboys using station car parks as a 'sorting hub' - its my bet that its illegal under the railway tresspass byelaws - perhaps the British Transport Police should take an interest in this practice.

The decent companies could offer a competitive service pricewise is the cheapjack cowboys were stopped from 'creaming off' the work with low prices - only possible because they pay a pittance to the uncaring end handler - something which i'm sure most will agree is very wrong as the guy trying to deliver is having to work long hours to make anything like a decent wage - but of course this situation will hardly build pride in the job by the poor souls.

Deffinatly time for more regulation in this sector.

[Crosland]

I have your parcel, I arrive at your address and your not there, What do you propose to do with your parcel ??

 

 

You leave it in a safe place, or with a neighbour, etc., and leave a calling card that has details of where it is, or how to arrange re-delivery at a mutually convenient time if it cannot be left.

 

What do you propose to do with the parcel? Hint: leaving it out in the rain or dropping it on concrete floor are not acceptable answers.

 

I wonder if you consider dropping parcels over gates should be reported to Hermes in the same manner as fake PODs?

 

Andrew

[stewartingram]

And don't forget, couriers are drivers. Drivers should obey traffic laws.

Insurance on their vehicle for busisness use - no cheapskate use of a private car.

No parking except on the road (not path), or on yellow lines.

Obey speed limits.

Need I go on? If you say "but we have to do this because we are pushed" - get another job.

 

Stewart

[berwicksfinest]

You leave it in a safe place, or with a neighbour, etc., and leave a calling card that has details of where it is, or how to arrange re-delivery at a mutually convenient time if it cannot be left.

 

What do you propose to do with the parcel? Hint: leaving it out in the rain or dropping it on concrete floor are not acceptable answers.

 

I wonder if you consider dropping parcels over gates should be reported to Hermes in the same manner as fake PODs?

 

Andrew

Thank you Andrew

 

Correct However no saf place being available as previously mentioned gate is locked, believe me we do try the neighbours unfortunately in our neck of the woods there are a lot of the East Europeans who refuse point blank to have anything to do with the neighbours  Again to reiterate we left a card with a mobile number on which has since been abused with a call received at 0200 and now 3 crank calls so now because of this we will not leave contact details.

We also carry forward to the next day, however i the following day we are in the same situation then it is left over the locked gate (no not an olympic shot putt throw) again another card is left.

With regards to dropping over I do this as carefully as I can, This is done after the above and no arrangements are forthcoming. forging a POD is another matter.

 

 

 

 

And don't forget, couriers are drivers. Drivers should obey traffic laws.

Insurance on their vehicle for busisness use - no cheapskate use of a private car.

No parking except on the road (not path), or on yellow lines.

Obey speed limits.

Need I go on? If you say "but we have to do this because we are pushed" - get another job.

 

Stewart

Yes Stewart it is, and this was put to the test when I admit we were pulled over by the local constabulary for no seat belts, who believed me went through our paperwork (which we carry when delivering) and the roadworthiness of the vehicle.

and ys I got my ear chewed for no seat belt !!!

 

But I will reiterate because you seem to have missed this (in bold) I am a train driver, I help the good lady, who does is for a little extra,

 

John

[berwicksfinest]

Having read this thread thoughout and noted particularly your comments it is very clear that in many ways you sum up just what is wrong with cheapjack couriers and the problems they cause for people.

When a person makes a perfectly fair comment about not using a seller who uses hermes you make the comment that you'd breathe a sigh of relief - very clearly illustrates just what standard of customer service you operate.

Having had first hand experience of the disgusting 'service' provided by Yodel I think its high time that the government stepped in and passed laws to regulate this industry.

Properly set up companies with branded vans and uniformed drivers, a code of conduct (legally enforceable) as to how deliveries are handled (much like RM and what we had a few years ago with operations like Red Star and BRS/Roadline.

The prevention of outfits that employ anyone with a rust bucket handling peoples property.

Forging signatures, throwing parcels over fences etc would result in the sack from a decent operation.

And as for these cowboys using station car parks as a 'sorting hub' - its my bet that its illegal under the railway tresspass byelaws - perhaps the British Transport Police should take an interest in this practice.

The decent companies could offer a competitive service pricewise is the cheapjack cowboys were stopped from 'creaming off' the work with low prices - only possible because they pay a pittance to the uncaring end handler - something which i'm sure most will agree is very wrong as the guy trying to deliver is having to work long hours to make anything like a decent wage - but of course this situation will hardly build pride in the job by the poor souls.

Deffinatly time for more regulation in this sector.

you are having a laugh ?!? when we had "visitors" to the depot, I rang for the very same to be told the nearest BTP on duty were 75 miles away. thankfully Civils did turn up

[Crosland]

we will not leave contact details.

So HTF is the recipient supposed to arrange redelivery? Have you not heard of turning the 'phone off?

We also carry forward to the next day, however i the following day we are in the same situation then it is left over the locked gate (no not an olympic shot putt throw) again another card is left.

With regards to dropping over I do this as carefully as I can, This is done after the above and no arrangements are forthcoming.

How can arrangements be forthcoming if you refuse to leave contact details?

 

It's clearly you who is having a laugh, at the recipients expense.

 

Andrew

[berwicksfinest]

So HTF is the recipient supposed to arrange redelivery? Have you not heard of turning the 'phone off?

How can arrangements be forthcoming if you refuse to leave contact details?

 

It's clearly you who is having a laugh, at the recipients expense.

 

Andrew

HTF ?!? I presume you mean how does the customer arrange redelivery ?? On our calling cards are the Hermes office number which I believe is open until late.

Who have our home number and they contact us direct.

 

John

[TheWeatheringMan]

you are having a laugh ?!? when we had "visitors" to the depot, I rang for the very same to be told the nearest BTP on duty were 75 miles away. thankfully Civils did turn up

No I'm not having a laugh as you should realise.

Its of no matter where a BTP officer might have been in your case.

This carry on has been reported as being a regular happening so it does not need a BTP officer to be able to get there fast.

All they have to do is start an investigation and build a case over a number of weeks - then act.

I'll go so far as to say that they will be aware of this trespassing within the next few days so what should happen might soon do so.

 

That you say you dropped a parcel over a six foot gate so it was then left in the open air this just goes to show why outfits like hermes need to be removed from the industry - or at the very least they should employ people who show a bit more care with their customers property.

That you are only helping your wife actually makes it worse as it shows that hermes has little control over the very people that it should.

 

This thread has been very educational and has made me determined to make sure that I do my very best to prevent any item for me ever being sent by hermes - as I suspect will a lot of other people.