Britannia's on Freight Turns

[RateTheFreight]

Hi all,

 

Whilst appreciating that Britannia's were built as mixed traffic loco's, how often were they actually found on freight turns?

 

I'm keen to understand if there were any regular freight turns you'd have found them on and whether this varied by region (I.e. Did William Shakespeare and Iron Duke haul freights on the Southern)? We're they used on freight's from their introduction or more so at the end of their short careers?

 

As a complete side, if anyone has or knows a source of any pics or info about 70033 'Charles Dickens' I'd be grateful.

 

Thanks

 

Greg

[Fat Controller]

Have a dig around Ernie Brack's site; almost certainly something there. Here's one:-

https://www.flickr.com/photos/irishswissernie/6452989063/in/set-72157628275099399

I think the use of them on freights was more a LMR thing; the Southern and Western got them to cover certain express passenger diagrams, and there probably wasn't enough spare in the diagrams to do anything else. 

[br2975]

Get hold of 'Farewell to North West Steam' by Ivo Peters & Norman Lockett.

.

An outstanding album of photographs taken predominantly on the West Coast Main Line in Cumberland around Ais Gill, Shap etc, with some Settle & Carlisle, all taken approx 1965-1967.

.

There are a number of shots of Brits on (fitted) freight in those pages.

.

Probably the best album I've got, I actually prefer it to 'Each a Glimpse'

.

Brian R

Edited November 17, 2014 by br2975

[Irishswissernie]

70033 probably withdrawn 

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/irishswissernie/13907317507/in/photolist-

 

As Brian says have a trawl through my albums, if you click on the collections at

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/irishswissernie/collections/then your best bet is probably the London Midland collection, click on an icon for the relative album

 

Ernie

[APOLLO]

A few Brits on freights north of Wigan on my Photo thread here

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/67100-apollos-grand-days-out/page-2

 

Passenger trains with Mk2 Blue / Grey coaches and parcels trains also. Brits were common as muck thru Wigan back in 1966/7 (Wish they still were !!)

 

Brit15

[great central]

A regular Brit freight turn in the early 60s was the Grimsby-Whitland fish train which ran up the GC main line. All of the Immingham allocated ones (70035-41) turned up on it at sometime. One of the highlights of the day in my area, it came down the bank heading into Nottingham at a fair rate, fully fitted of course. The 'aroma' it left behind would linger for quite some time on a still evening. The Britannia worked as far as Banbury, I believe, but we never saw the return working, probably overnight.

[Alcanman]

My recollections of Brits at Carlisle in the last years of steam were freight and parcels trains.

 

I think 70014 Iron Duke was one of the last to be withdrawn. Here is Iron Duke departing Kingmoor with a freight on 29.12.1967.

 

 

 

Mal

[Bernard Lamb]

Several of them at Carlisle around 1965 were regulars on all manner of freight traffic.

Try and find the book Steam City, Carlisle by Howard Routledge for a good selection of photos.

Bernard

[JeffP]

Once they were displaced from express passenger services, they could, and did, turn up on almost anything.

[TheSignalEngineer]

Around 1965 during the rebuilding of New St one of the fill-in jobs for the loco off the morning train from Crewe was to return from Vauxhall & Duddeston after dropping the ECS and work the Adderley Park spoil. This was usually a lot of brick ends and scrap in a variety of superannuated 3, 5 and 7 planks, hybars, tube wagons, et al. Normally a Class 24 working, one day I called in and found 70000 working it.

[PaulG]

There is a good photographs of 70001 Lord Hurcomb on the down Norfolkman passing 70013 Oliver Cromwell on a Whitmoor-Norwich Victoria freight train at Trowse Upper Junction.

 

As with many of Dr Ian C Allen's photographs it is not dated, but J69 68555 is on the end of the freight and this loco was at Norwich from 1956 to 1958.

 

Dr Allen also photographed 70007 Coeur-de-Lion on the same working, possibly at an earlier date as the loco is in good external livery and carries the first BR emblem.

 

In Peter Swinger's booklet "Britannia No 70000" he includes the East Anglia Winter 1954/55 timetable diagrams and as an example Diagram 1 Weekdays was:

 

4.24am Liverpool St to Norwich via Cambridge

9.45am Norwich to Liverpool St via Ipswich

2.24pm Liverpool St to Norwich via Cambridge

7.20pm Class D goods Norwich Wensum to Temple Mills via Cambridge.

 

Hope the above is of interest and would suggest in East Anglia from new, the locos were used as MT.

 

Paul

[bike2steam]

In the days when Aston shed had Brits on it's allocation, you very often would find one lurking on Bescot shed, and that was a shed that dealt with very little passenger work.

[byron]

I was Assistant Power Controller at Stoke during the last years of steam (my "boss" had the diesels - I had the fun steam). The remaining Britts at Crewe when not called upon to replace failed diesels north from Crewe were diagrammed on parcels and fitted freight.

 

Mike

[RateTheFreight]

Hi all,

 

Thanks for all the really helpful info and links, especially the pictures which are fascinating.

 

It's safe to say there's plenty of scope then to model them on freights (and rescuing failed diesel services!).

 

G

[Karhedron]

In 1958, one of the Cardigan/Whitland milk trains was a regular Brit diagram (in place of the more usual Castle). Haven't found a photo yet though.

[bike2steam]

I was Assistant Power Controller at Stoke during the last years of steam (my "boss" had the diesels - I had the fun steam). The remaining Britts at Crewe when not called upon to replace failed diesels north from Crewe were diagrammed on parcels and fitted freight.

 

Mike

Yep, funny you should say that, one of those memories that remains imprinted on the brain; just finished a shed bash at Warrington, and standing watching main-line action at the shed 'throat' when 70013, not long after being Crewe works last overhaul, came thrashing thro' northbound, nice 'n' shiney, on a fast freight.

[roythebus]

I understand the Southern Brits were used as Bullied Pacifics, returning from Salisbury and places west with freight/milk/parcels, whatever needed a loco!

[mow]

I'm sure I saw Oliver Cromwell being used in a freight yard at Carlisle c. 1966. 

Edited November 19, 2014 by mow

[Dampflok]

Here's a few more shots to add to the above - I have quite a few more not yet added to my site. Photos are "clickable" to take you to larger images on my site with full captions:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hope that's of some help!

 

Cheers, Geoff

[roythebus]

All in the same livery of BR sh*T!! Fascinating shots, thanks.

[JeffP]

The post about Warrington reminded me of my only visit there, march 1966, SADRES "Crewe Trip", cost 12/-.

 

We had just done Dallam shed, when a Brit thundered through on parcels. I remember turning away as it passed under the road-bridge, and looking sadly at "Jubilee" 45568, "Western Australia", it's rods removed and awaiting it's last journey........

[Norton961]

The Brits were built as mixed traffic engines hence the 6'2" driving wheels and while in later days (1966 to late 1967) they were seen on freights frequently it was not unknown for them to be on freights in the late 1950,s and early 1960,s. The Express fish from Grimsby has already been quoted but they were also seen on the Aberdeen Fish and the Holyhead meat trains as this traffic had to run fast due to the perishable nature of the traffic.

Attached is a pic of 70017 at Bangor with a freight in 1963.

 

David

[edward66]

There used to be a boat train into Fleetwood normally pulled by a mainline passenger loco which returned the following day hauling an express fish train, greatly anticipated by spotters who got a good "cop", very often a Scot, Patriot or Jubilee. I don't know when these trains ceased or if they lasted long enough to perhaps use a Brit. The evening boat train into Heysham's loco was serviced overnight at Lancaster Green Ayre giving spotters a similar "good cop" . One morning I had a cab ride in Lord Hurcomb but only from the shed to Green Ayre station. This was all in the fifties which is an awful long time ago now!

 

Edward

[Michael Delamar]

70017 at Northenden in 1963. My dad recalls seeing a large green loco on Walton on the hill shed around this time. I wonder if that could be the one?

 

[t-b-g]

Not really a regular working but trials were run using two Britannia locos, double heading, from Mansfield up the GC main line, with a rake of fitted 16t mineral wagons.

 

This was part of the preparation for the famous Annesley "windcutters". In the end they decided that the trains would be OK with more conventional motive power but the trials were to see how things went with super power and 60mph running.

 

I only ever saw one photo in a cutting from a local newspaper but my Dad saw the trains and said they were quite something.