Henley-on-Thames - GWR in the 1930's

[john dew]

1 minute ago, The Stationmaster said:

One pob;ished set of figures gives the following detail for trucks of livestock handled per annum -

1903 - 264

1913 - 238

1923  - 123

1933  - 37

 

This might well include draught horse sent at Goods Rates but it's not clear if it includes animals sent at Passenger Rates.   But clearly such traffic dropped from an average of c.5 trucks weekly in 1903 to fewer than one a week in 1933

Will do John but not tonight as it is a rather complex subject and of course it chghanged over the years.  Basically down to teh number of wheels permitted behind the rearmost brake van.  but also the question of wewhene  two Guards were required or not trequired.

 

I don't know about modern racing shells but when they hulls were made out of plywood an eight was normally in three sections which bolted together to form the complete boat.   So relatively easy to transport from a ength viewppoint.  Fours, coxed or not, and smaller boars were monohull so the maximum length that needed to be handled was coxed four -s eating four oarsmen and the cox.

 Thanks Mike thats very kind of you - no rush I am still weathering siphons and waiting for the replacement

 

1947 would be great! I had a feeling it was related to the number of Axles.

 

off topic but as a retired sailor I have to ask - when they bolted the hull sections together how did they make the section joints water tight?

 

Best wishes

[The Stationmaster]

3 minutes ago, john dew said:

 Thanks Mike thats very kind of you - no rush I am still weathering siphons and waiting for the replacement

 

1947 would be great! I had a feeling it was related to the number of Axles.

 

off topic but as a retired sailor I have to ask - when they bolted the hull sections together how did they make the section joints water tight?

 

Best wishes

Don't know the answer to yyour latter quwa stion John but I presume some sort of gasket was used.  I've definitely never seen an eight letting in water via the joints and taht incudes the one we restored to usability at school which was quite an old hull.

[Neal Ball]

To finish off yesterdays parcels train photos, we have a shot of Blakesley Hall on the turntable before stabling the stock for emptying.

 

 

This loco is one of the so-called "design clever" locos from Hornby - recently I have come across some parts from an old Crownline kit for the even older Hornby Hall loco. Ive eyed up the steam pipes to replace those on the loco... I'm not in a hurry, but it will be good to change them. It also needs a fall plate made up.

 

To be continued!

[Neal Ball]

Work yesterday afternoon then turned back to my carriages:

 

The Sunshine brake 3rd D121 was soon onto the bench - seen here with painted and glazed droplights ready to go on.

I always work right to left and each section was secured before moving onto the next. Initially I thought the space was going to be tight, but I needn't have worried, there was plenty of space for the droplights and the plain glazing next to them.

 

 

To avoid confusion - I have marked which window is a droplight - obvious really until you get to the guards compartment. Its as well to mark it out.

 

The fully glazed carriage - the droplights need a careful touch up as some of the paint came off in handling.

 

 

Seen here with the 61xx 2-6-2T no 6132 and the E153 Brake Composite.

 

 

The short train is seen arriving into Platform 2 at Henley-on-Thames:

 

 

The brake 3rd D121 (Furthest carriage) together with the all 3rd C70 (not shown) are both now virtually complete. They just need door furniture and some paint touching up and they will be complete.

 

Not bad for carriage kits I bought some 40+ years ago!

[The Stationmaster]

22 hours ago, john dew said:

 

Nice photo Neal. I wonder how many GWR modelles around the world have been dusting down their parcels trains with the arrival of the Accurascale Siphons.

 

Certainly the case in Vancouver!

 

Could you or @The Stationmaster jog my memory about the position of the PBV occupied by the guard in such a train?

 

I cannot remember how many PBVs were permitted to trail the van occupied by the train guard.

 

I assume that the guard had to be from the same company as the loco and that he had to occupy a company PBV.

 

 

 

 

Right sir here is an extract of something I posted back in 2020 in a thread about the number of vehicles permitted behind the brakevan.  I think this is the o nformation you need but if not please ask further and i will do my best to sort any queries.

 

 

 

 

[Tim Dubya]

9 hours ago, Neal Ball said:

 

 

 

Not bad for carriage kits I bought some 40+ years ago!

 

Those are absolutely gorgeous, who was the manufacturer?

 

[john dew]

5 hours ago, The Stationmaster said:

Right sir here is an extract of something I posted back in 2020 in a thread about the number of vehicles permitted behind the brakevan.  I think this is the o nformation you need but if not please ask further and i will do my best to sort any queries.

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks Mike that is great - bearing in mind the dearth of RTR GWR PBVs its a big bonus and rather more relaxed than I imagined. Basically only one GWR PBV required in the centre of a  5-7 van parcels train - excellent

 

Thanks for once again taking the time to help me out.

[Neal Ball]

12 hours ago, Tim Dubya said:

 

Those are absolutely gorgeous, who was the manufacturer?

 

Thanks Tim, They are long out of production by a company called Westdale.

 

The diagram is available as a kit from Comet Models, sold by Wizard: https://www.wizardmodels.ltd/shop/carriage/w48k/

 

Available as a full kit, or just the sides. Usual caveats apply!

Edited July 8, 2023 by Neal Ball

[Coach bogie]

I made a couple from Westdale many years ago. I was reunited with the name, when Westdale started marketing the Hayes range. As I missed out when they first came out I was able to acquire the Dreadoughts was after. In the 90's, when I was buying Hayes from them, They appeared to mainly 7mm at that time. I had a Westdale GWR B set in 4mm which remained unbuilt. I had come into some BSL E145's which were not in the original BSL list, which were built instead and the Westdale were given to a friend. I must ask him if he ever built them. I have a Westdale H53, nearly finished back in the UK. As far as I am aware Westdale were the only supplier to have produced it,  an oddball diner, half buffet/half 3rd compartments. Body fits straight onto a Bachmann C77 underframe.

 

Nice looking builds.

 

Mike Wiltshire

 

Edited July 8, 2023 by Coach bogie

[Tim Dubya]

5 hours ago, Neal Ball said:

They are long out of production by a company called Westdale.

 

Thanks, I do see these pop up on eBay now and again.  Are they aluminium, like the BSL/Phoenix kits?  If so, what do you use for a primer?

 

Cheers 👍

[Coach bogie]

6 minutes ago, Tim Dubya said:

 

Thanks, I do see these pop up on eBay now and again.  Are they aluminium, like the BSL/Phoenix kits?  If so, what do you use for a primer?

 

Cheers 👍

Car spray etched primer.

 

Mike Wiltshire

[Neal Ball]

2 hours ago, Coach bogie said:

I made a couple from Westdale many years ago. I was reunited with the name, when Westdale started marketing the Hayes range. As I missed out when they first came out I was able to acquire the Dreadoughts was after. In the 90's, when I was buying Hayes from them, They appeared to mainly 7mm at that time. I had a Westdale GWR B set in 4mm which remained unbuilt. I had come into some BSL E145's which were not in the original BSL list, which were built instead and the Westdale were given to a friend. I must ask him if he ever built them. I have a Westdale H53, nearly finished back in the UK. As far as I am aware Westdale were the only supplier to have produced it,  an oddball diner, half buffet/half 3rd compartments. Body fits straight onto a Bachmann C77 underframe.

 

Nice looking builds.

 

Mike Wiltshire

 

 

Great story Mike thank you - although it does beg the question... how many carriages do you have? 😎 

 

The impression is that you have loads!

 

39 minutes ago, Tim Dubya said:

 

Thanks, I do see these pop up on eBay now and again.  Are they aluminium, like the BSL/Phoenix kits?  If so, what do you use for a primer?

 

Cheers 👍

 

The only time I have seen these carriages was when I bought them.... to show how long ago it was... There was a model railway event at the London Transport museum - when it was at Syon Park*, before moving to Covent Garden 😎 

*1973 to March 1980.

 

The roof and sides are a one piece Aluminium pressing, with separate aluminium (basic) end with a separate rubber corridor connection.

 

The floor was a piece of Hardboard! I presume it came with BSL bogies, which will be worth taking apart to see if I can get them to run better.

The only part of the kit I have used is the body/roof combo. Everything else has come from the Comet models range, apart from the bogies which are Bachmann 9ft Collet bogies.

 

33 minutes ago, Coach bogie said:

Car spray etched primer.

 

Mike Wiltshire

 

Interestingly, I used the Vallejo white primer on this and all my kits - sprayed with my spray-gun, completed with Railmatch acrylic paints. Two coats of Primer / Cream and then the Chocolate.

[Tim Dubya]

Sorry, to be more specific I see Westdale kits on eBay, but being of the LSWR/SR persuasion I couldn't tell you their diagram numbers 👍

[Coach bogie]

11 hours ago, Neal Ball said:

 

Great story Mike thank you - although it does beg the question... how many carriages do you have? 😎 

 

The impression is that you have loads!

 

 

My kit builds are in the hundreds now, only due to collecting the kits before I was in a position or skilled enough to make them. Shaggy dog story time!

 

First of all. I only really needed to make the coaches. My Dad was a master at loco building but had no interest in coaches, so we became a good team. I made the coaches - he made the locos to pull them, even If I did have to make several LMS and LNER trains for his varied tastes. I started making in my teens when Dad bought me a couple of Westdale shells, then a Mopok Hawksworth to cut my teeth on.

 

I tend to model complete trains based on photographs. When I moved to the North East I was lucky to find one of the Great Western in the 30's authors living local and my education really started and I was able to make up a plan with accurate train formations.

 

I did not model much, in my early 20's due to careers, house, car, wine women and song etc but I did start acquiring kits and bits. I was too late for the first run of Hayes but in trying to find them I discovered other ranges, such as Micro rail clerestories and Hammond. The to 'build pile' had begun. I was able to get most of the Tony Hammond sides and became obsessed with TPO trains due to the large range of TPO sides he produced enabling me to build the complete 1910 and 1934 trains.

 

I always new about the BSL range but, pre internet information relied on ads in mags. I had bought some from shows but was fairly ignorant about the range. When a friend started farming near Swindon, we had day off rail trips and ended up in Eames of Reading one day who had almost the entire range on the shelf. I bought the complete Torbay express over time and that was the first full train I built. As these with glue construction, I started making them at work lunch time, rather than going to the pub. A week of lunch drinks = 1xBSL money wise. I had an hour a day for over twenty years making BSL's at work. When my work colleagues got bored with mocking me, one of my finished artists kindly drew up the coach interiors (he also introduced bow pens to me) based on the old Peco ones, which I had printed up on card. More time saved and could be made up at lunch. I learnt a lot about light and shadows from the ads I was producing which highlighted how important, door hinges etc were, as your eye  picks up the shadow rather than the hinge itself. This is when my modelling really started. Finishing was advanced courtesy of my brother, being a motor mechanic, bringing a spray tin of Triumph honeysuckle home, asking 'is this the same as GW Cream?' He showed how important primer was and I have used car sprays ever since. When painted I used to line them at work with a discarded bow pen, which I am still using 40 years later. Owned a air brush for a short time but not for me.

 

The most coach bizarre link came when through work. It was still the days of letter press zinc blocks. I was at the processors one day and the chap etching the blocks for the ad being worked on, told me about a guy he made train bits for, when he worked in Birmingham using zinc blocks. He kindly made some calls and then the Trevor Charlton range (how many new of him?) expanded my toplight range significantly. Ironically my Dad knew and had worked with Trevor but the train connection was never made. My first Charlton was a H13 and no-one else has ever made it as far as know. This started a new obsession with dining cars- I  have built over 30 now. 58 diagrams - still a few to go. Example of Charlton zinc below-toplight D45.

 

Another milestone was moving jobs to Macclesfield and bumped into Derek Lawrence who lived not far from there. we had conversed before, at shows and I was invited to his workshop where he introduced me the the BSL range NOT listed including the entire GWR articulated train which he eventually sourced for me.

 

I have to give a very special mention for Allen Doherty of Worsley works. I would not have the variety of clerestories if it were not for him. My recent output increased significantly with his range of body etches (note not kits). Several in his list came about because I asked if he would consider producing with some drawn specifically to fit rtr bodies  speeding up building time -  Thanks Allen.

 

I am quite nocturnal and for decades I was able to model was done when everyone else had gone to bed. An hour or two a night and progress can be swift. Whilst exiled in Oz, I have all day to model and am turning out a coach week, without painting. For the first time, I am off plan as I keep coming across kits at very reasonable prices that I cannot resist. They have 'table sales' here and some real gems turn up.  then next one is July 30th, in Brisbane with nearly 70 booked tables, I am told, so the unbuilt pile might get bigger. Time to raid my wife's purse.....cash only at these doos.

 

So yes- I probably have loads

 

Mike Wiltshire

[Neal Ball]

3 hours ago, Coach bogie said:

 

My kit builds are in the hundreds now, only due to collecting the kits before I was in a position or skilled enough to make them. Shaggy dog story time!

 

First of all. I only really needed to make the coaches. My Dad was a master at loco building but had no interest in coaches, so we became a good team. I made the coaches - he made the locos to pull them, even If I did have to make several LMS and LNER trains for his varied tastes. I started making in my teens when Dad bought me a couple of Westdale shells, then a Mopok Hawksworth to cut my teeth on.

 

I tend to model complete trains based on photographs. When I moved to the North East I was lucky to find one of the Great Western in the 30's authors living local and my education really started and I was able to make up a plan with accurate train formations.

 

I did not model much, in my early 20's due to careers, house, car, wine women and song etc but I did start acquiring kits and bits. I was too late for the first run of Hayes but in trying to find them I discovered other ranges, such as Micro rail clerestories and Hammond. The to 'build pile' had begun. I was able to get most of the Tony Hammond sides and became obsessed with TPO trains due to the large range of TPO sides he produced enabling me to build the complete 1910 and 1934 trains.

 

I always new about the BSL range but, pre internet information relied on ads in mags. I had bought some from shows but was fairly ignorant about the range. When a friend started farming near Swindon, we had day off rail trips and ended up in Eames of Reading one day who had almost the entire range on the shelf. I bought the complete Torbay express over time and that was the first full train I built. As these with glue construction, I started making them at work lunch time, rather than going to the pub. A week of lunch drinks = 1xBSL money wise. I had an hour a day for over twenty years making BSL's at work. When my work colleagues got bored with mocking me, one of my finished artists kindly drew up the coach interiors (he also introduced bow pens to me) based on the old Peco ones, which I had printed up on card. More time saved and could be made up at lunch. I learnt a lot about light and shadows from the ads I was producing which highlighted how important, door hinges etc were, as your eye  picks up the shadow rather than the hinge itself. This is when my modelling really started. Finishing was advanced courtesy of my brother, being a motor mechanic, bringing a spray tin of Triumph honeysuckle home, asking 'is this the same as GW Cream?' He showed how important primer was and I have used car sprays ever since. When painted I used to line them at work with a discarded bow pen, which I am still using 40 years later. Owned a air brush for a short time but not for me.

 

The most coach bizarre link came when through work. It was still the days of letter press zinc blocks. I was at the processors one day and the chap etching the blocks for the ad being worked on, told me about a guy he made train bits for, when he worked in Birmingham using zinc blocks. He kindly made some calls and then the Trevor Charlton range (how many new of him?) expanded my toplight range significantly. Ironically my Dad knew and had worked with Trevor but the train connection was never made. My first Charlton was a H13 and no-one else has ever made it as far as know. This started a new obsession with dining cars- I  have built over 30 now. 58 diagrams - still a few to go. Example of Charlton zinc below-toplight D45.

 

Another milestone was moving jobs to Macclesfield and bumped into Derek Lawrence who lived not far from there. we had conversed before, at shows and I was invited to his workshop where he introduced me the the BSL range NOT listed including the entire GWR articulated train which he eventually sourced for me.

 

I have to give a very special mention for Allen Doherty of Worsley works. I would not have the variety of clerestories if it were not for him. My recent output increased significantly with his range of body etches (note not kits). Several in his list came about because I asked if he would consider producing with some drawn specifically to fit rtr bodies  speeding up building time -  Thanks Allen.

 

I am quite nocturnal and for decades I was able to model was done when everyone else had gone to bed. An hour or two a night and progress can be swift. Whilst exiled in Oz, I have all day to model and am turning out a coach week, without painting. For the first time, I am off plan as I keep coming across kits at very reasonable prices that I cannot resist. They have 'table sales' here and some real gems turn up.  then next one is July 30th, in Brisbane with nearly 70 booked tables, I am told, so the unbuilt pile might get bigger. Time to raid my wife's purse.....cash only at these doos.

 

So yes- I probably have loads

 

Mike Wiltshire

The range of emoji to add after your story isn’t sufficient- I need to be able to use more than 1 😎

 

Fascinating story Mike, thanks for sharing. You've certainly led an interesting live as far as collecting and making kits is concerned. I’ve not heard of some of the ranges / people you speak about….

 

30 + restaurant carriages is some going….

 

Interesting that you mention Worsley works kits, I reckon to increase the variety in my stock they will be the next ones I focus on, after the 70ft ones from Comet. My stock is too “modern” at the moment!

 

Where we lived when I was a teenager, Reading had no appeal strangely, so although I knew of Eames I never went there.

 

Train spotting days were always London based, which resulted in several visits to Kings Cross models - both that and Eames, of course long since gone.

 

The idea of making models at lunchtime though sounds great and it’s no wonder you have so many carriages…. Presumably then, you have an equally impressive range of kit built locos to haul them.

 

Thanks for sharing your story, enjoy the rest of your weekend.

 

As a footnote, you can never have too many carriages.

Edited July 9, 2023 by Neal Ball

[ChrisN]

16 hours ago, Coach bogie said:

 

My kit builds are in the hundreds now, only due to collecting the kits before I was in a position or skilled enough to make them. Shaggy dog story time!

 

First of all. I only really needed to make the coaches. My Dad was a master at loco building but had no interest in coaches, so we became a good team. I made the coaches - he made the locos to pull them, even If I did have to make several LMS and LNER trains for his varied tastes. I started making in my teens when Dad bought me a couple of Westdale shells, then a Mopok Hawksworth to cut my teeth on.

 

I tend to model complete trains based on photographs. When I moved to the North East I was lucky to find one of the Great Western in the 30's authors living local and my education really started and I was able to make up a plan with accurate train formations.

 

I did not model much, in my early 20's due to careers, house, car, wine women and song etc but I did start acquiring kits and bits. I was too late for the first run of Hayes but in trying to find them I discovered other ranges, such as Micro rail clerestories and Hammond. The to 'build pile' had begun. I was able to get most of the Tony Hammond sides and became obsessed with TPO trains due to the large range of TPO sides he produced enabling me to build the complete 1910 and 1934 trains.

 

I always new about the BSL range but, pre internet information relied on ads in mags. I had bought some from shows but was fairly ignorant about the range. When a friend started farming near Swindon, we had day off rail trips and ended up in Eames of Reading one day who had almost the entire range on the shelf. I bought the complete Torbay express over time and that was the first full train I built. As these with glue construction, I started making them at work lunch time, rather than going to the pub. A week of lunch drinks = 1xBSL money wise. I had an hour a day for over twenty years making BSL's at work. When my work colleagues got bored with mocking me, one of my finished artists kindly drew up the coach interiors (he also introduced bow pens to me) based on the old Peco ones, which I had printed up on card. More time saved and could be made up at lunch. I learnt a lot about light and shadows from the ads I was producing which highlighted how important, door hinges etc were, as your eye  picks up the shadow rather than the hinge itself. This is when my modelling really started. Finishing was advanced courtesy of my brother, being a motor mechanic, bringing a spray tin of Triumph honeysuckle home, asking 'is this the same as GW Cream?' He showed how important primer was and I have used car sprays ever since. When painted I used to line them at work with a discarded bow pen, which I am still using 40 years later. Owned a air brush for a short time but not for me.

 

The most coach bizarre link came when through work. It was still the days of letter press zinc blocks. I was at the processors one day and the chap etching the blocks for the ad being worked on, told me about a guy he made train bits for, when he worked in Birmingham using zinc blocks. He kindly made some calls and then the Trevor Charlton range (how many new of him?) expanded my toplight range significantly. Ironically my Dad knew and had worked with Trevor but the train connection was never made. My first Charlton was a H13 and no-one else has ever made it as far as know. This started a new obsession with dining cars- I  have built over 30 now. 58 diagrams - still a few to go. Example of Charlton zinc below-toplight D45.

 

Another milestone was moving jobs to Macclesfield and bumped into Derek Lawrence who lived not far from there. we had conversed before, at shows and I was invited to his workshop where he introduced me the the BSL range NOT listed including the entire GWR articulated train which he eventually sourced for me.

 

I have to give a very special mention for Allen Doherty of Worsley works. I would not have the variety of clerestories if it were not for him. My recent output increased significantly with his range of body etches (note not kits). Several in his list came about because I asked if he would consider producing with some drawn specifically to fit rtr bodies  speeding up building time -  Thanks Allen.

 

I am quite nocturnal and for decades I was able to model was done when everyone else had gone to bed. An hour or two a night and progress can be swift. Whilst exiled in Oz, I have all day to model and am turning out a coach week, without painting. For the first time, I am off plan as I keep coming across kits at very reasonable prices that I cannot resist. They have 'table sales' here and some real gems turn up.  then next one is July 30th, in Brisbane with nearly 70 booked tables, I am told, so the unbuilt pile might get bigger. Time to raid my wife's purse.....cash only at these doos.

 

So yes- I probably have loads

 

Mike Wiltshire

 

Mike, What an interesting story.  I tried modelling at lunch time but my staff thought I was skiving.

 

The Worsley Works etches for clerestories.  I have looked at his site but it is not clear what you get.  Could you explain please and what do you have to do to the chassis?  I intend to use my Silhouette cutter to make  coaches and I have an E25 in progress but I am under orders to do scenery but a quick aside never hurt anyone.  Honest guv.

 

Thank you and thank you Neal for my interruption.

[Neal Ball]

1 hour ago, ChrisN said:

 

Mike, What an interesting story.  I tried modelling at lunch time but my staff thought I was skiving.

 

The Worsley Works etches for clerestories.  I have looked at his site but it is not clear what you get.  Could you explain please and what do you have to do to the chassis?  I intend to use my Silhouette cutter to make  coaches and I have an E25 in progress but I am under orders to do scenery but a quick aside never hurt anyone.  Honest guv.

 

Thank you and thank you Neal for my interruption.

I was going to ask the same question!

 

It’s not 100% clear what is included at the different price points - I’m thinking underframe needs to be sourced separately. I was going to leave it until probably the end of the year, once I’ve done the 70ft carriages and ask Allen then.

[longchap]

On 03/07/2023 at 21:56, longchap said:

 

I must also admit never to have used the bow pens, however I do have a specialist lining device rather like a pen with an airbrush colour cup, with different sized heads for width of stripe. I bought it for the Clifton Downs auto set. Must try it sometime.

 

 

Whilst looking for something completely different today, I came across my 'easi Liner', yet to be used, but a possible contender to a bow pen for coach / loco lining.

 

 

 

I'm looking forward to trying it and a bow pen to see just how lining can be applied to models, other than by transfers.

 

I wonder if anyone has experience of this item?

 

Sorry for the hijack Neal!

 

 

Edited July 9, 2023 by longchap

[lezz01]

I have one of the original ones and it works very well. You need to keep it as close to upright as you can. It runs with un-thinned paint but enamel works best using a fresh tin with a few drops of petrol lighter fluid rather than thinners stirred in.

Regards Lez.   

[longchap]

9 minutes ago, lezz01 said:

I have one of the original ones and it works very well. You need to keep it as close to upright as you can. It runs with un-thinned paint but enamel works best using a fresh tin with a few drops of petrol lighter fluid rather than thinners stirred in.

Regards Lez.   

 

Thanks Lez, that’s reassuring and I’ve even got a tin of Zippo lighter fluid in the cupboard.

 

Best,

 

Bill

 

[1466]

18 hours ago, Coach bogie said:

 

My kit builds are in the hundreds now, only due to collecting the kits before I was in a position or skilled enough to make them. Shaggy dog story time!

 

First of all. I only really needed to make the coaches. My Dad was a master at loco building but had no interest in coaches, so we became a good team. I made the coaches - he made the locos to pull them, even If I did have to make several LMS and LNER trains for his varied tastes. I started making in my teens when Dad bought me a couple of Westdale shells, then a Mopok Hawksworth to cut my teeth on.

 

I tend to model complete trains based on photographs. When I moved to the North East I was lucky to find one of the Great Western in the 30's authors living local and my education really started and I was able to make up a plan with accurate train formations.

 

I did not model much, in my early 20's due to careers, house, car, wine women and song etc but I did start acquiring kits and bits. I was too late for the first run of Hayes but in trying to find them I discovered other ranges, such as Micro rail clerestories and Hammond. The to 'build pile' had begun. I was able to get most of the Tony Hammond sides and became obsessed with TPO trains due to the large range of TPO sides he produced enabling me to build the complete 1910 and 1934 trains.

 

I always new about the BSL range but, pre internet information relied on ads in mags. I had bought some from shows but was fairly ignorant about the range. When a friend started farming near Swindon, we had day off rail trips and ended up in Eames of Reading one day who had almost the entire range on the shelf. I bought the complete Torbay express over time and that was the first full train I built. As these with glue construction, I started making them at work lunch time, rather than going to the pub. A week of lunch drinks = 1xBSL money wise. I had an hour a day for over twenty years making BSL's at work. When my work colleagues got bored with mocking me, one of my finished artists kindly drew up the coach interiors (he also introduced bow pens to me) based on the old Peco ones, which I had printed up on card. More time saved and could be made up at lunch. I learnt a lot about light and shadows from the ads I was producing which highlighted how important, door hinges etc were, as your eye  picks up the shadow rather than the hinge itself. This is when my modelling really started. Finishing was advanced courtesy of my brother, being a motor mechanic, bringing a spray tin of Triumph honeysuckle home, asking 'is this the same as GW Cream?' He showed how important primer was and I have used car sprays ever since. When painted I used to line them at work with a discarded bow pen, which I am still using 40 years later. Owned a air brush for a short time but not for me.

 

The most coach bizarre link came when through work. It was still the days of letter press zinc blocks. I was at the processors one day and the chap etching the blocks for the ad being worked on, told me about a guy he made train bits for, when he worked in Birmingham using zinc blocks. He kindly made some calls and then the Trevor Charlton range (how many new of him?) expanded my toplight range significantly. Ironically my Dad knew and had worked with Trevor but the train connection was never made. My first Charlton was a H13 and no-one else has ever made it as far as know. This started a new obsession with dining cars- I  have built over 30 now. 58 diagrams - still a few to go. Example of Charlton zinc below-toplight D45.

 

Another milestone was moving jobs to Macclesfield and bumped into Derek Lawrence who lived not far from there. we had conversed before, at shows and I was invited to his workshop where he introduced me the the BSL range NOT listed including the entire GWR articulated train which he eventually sourced for me.

 

I have to give a very special mention for Allen Doherty of Worsley works. I would not have the variety of clerestories if it were not for him. My recent output increased significantly with his range of body etches (note not kits). Several in his list came about because I asked if he would consider producing with some drawn specifically to fit rtr bodies  speeding up building time -  Thanks Allen.

 

I am quite nocturnal and for decades I was able to model was done when everyone else had gone to bed. An hour or two a night and progress can be swift. Whilst exiled in Oz, I have all day to model and am turning out a coach week, without painting. For the first time, I am off plan as I keep coming across kits at very reasonable prices that I cannot resist. They have 'table sales' here and some real gems turn up.  then next one is July 30th, in Brisbane with nearly 70 booked tables, I am told, so the unbuilt pile might get bigger. Time to raid my wife's purse.....cash only at these doos.

 

So yes- I probably have loads

 

Mike Wiltshire

A fascinating account , Mike .

It reinforces two of my core beliefs.
First,  how much “chance” plays in our in our lives . A chance encounter ; a question asked or not asked can send us off in a different direction . My “career “ started when I moved from one side of a corridor to the other.

Secondly , what an effective time management technique you use to  model in lunch hours and one or two “nocturnal “ hours . Little and often gets the job done .

Thanks for sharing .

 

[Coach bogie]

5 hours ago, ChrisN said:

 

The Worsley Works etches for clerestories.  I have looked at his site but it is not clear what you get.  Could you explain please and what do you have to do to the chassis?  I intend to use my Silhouette cutter to make  coaches and I have an E25 in progress but I am under orders to do scenery but a quick aside never hurt anyone.  Honest guv.

 

 

Depends on what you are buying. Here is a E48 brake compo. It is how the B sets were born as certain divisions coupled them in pairs and Paddington developed the idea further.

Roof, sides, ends, droplights, look outs, floor and solebars. Major bonus on all the roof sections is the rainstrips etched in. Door hinge holes etched through. Note all this is flat and you will have to form tumblehomes etc. Slot and tab underframe makes assembly easier. This was a request from David Geen and myself. Even other kit producers use him.

 

 

 

Here is a similar for the Dreadnought tea car - note the extra doors. No roof with this one. The truss rods are not appropriate to the Dreadnought but I asked Allen to include so I could add to Comet 70ft underframes for the correct four sets. This was a request from me from minimal information. Try finding this is the books but two of them existed.

 

 

Full clerestory bodies give you the parts to produce as here before any other parts were added. Of note, the clerestory roof is slot and tab with strengtheners and  rainstrips etched in. By far the simplest clerestory roof sections I have ever made. I do not have a close up but you should get the idea from the lower image. The underframe is assembled from the Worsley clerestory body parts etch. The castings v hanger, truss you have to add yourself. I used Hornby Deans on this one.

 

 

 

 

 

Finally there is the sides/ends etch to use on rtr. This is the D33, another request from Jason Brumby and myself. Allen even produces as this, as here, to fit the Hornby body, or a full body if you prefer. This coach had three phases in its' life and Allen produced all three including plated over panels for the final version based on an image I had supplied. What A guy.

He also produces the sides for C16 to fit the Hornby and make it look how it should for post 1910. Hornby used the original drawing and the original window layout did not last long. If you are new to this the C16 is a great starting point. I have a chap here who has just made one for the first time. He only used the sides and made a great job of it. Personally I use the ends as well.

 

 

Again, I must stress they are not marketed as kits but body parts. In addition the gauge of brass used is very strong (compared to some I have in stock only slightly thicker than paper-UGH).

Worsley works started as a cottage industry for the 3mm/TT market. The 4mm stuff came about as enough people asked him for 4mm versions.

 

GWR list here

 

http://www.worsleyworks.co.uk/4mm/4mm_GWR.htm

 

Hope this helps

 

Mike Wiltshire

 

 

[Coach bogie]

6 hours ago, ChrisN said:

 

Mike, What an interesting story.  I tried modelling at lunch time but my staff thought I was skiving.

 

It was not the case in Advertising as no one worked 9-5, especially if we had a 'special' on where we did not go home for several days, kipping for a couple of hours in reception. We all had our vices. One of  creative collected scalextric cars and was known to use the studio to change liveries. Another produced publicity material for the Hacienda. (I got them printed in return for free admission). When working in Newcastle one artist produced freelance comic strips during lunch. There was an understanding and appreciation sadly not seen again when I change careers.

 

Mike Wiltshire

[Neal Ball]

5 hours ago, Coach bogie said:

 

Depends on what you are buying. Here is a E48 brake compo. It is how the B sets were born as certain divisions coupled them in pairs and Paddington developed the idea further.

Roof, sides, ends, droplights, look outs, floor and solebars. Major bonus on all the roof sections is the rainstrips etched in. Door hinge holes etched through. Note all this is flat and you will have to form tumblehomes etc. Slot and tab underframe makes assembly easier. This was a request from David Geen and myself. Even other kit producers use him.

 

 

 

Here is a similar for the Dreadnought tea car - note the extra doors. No roof with this one. The truss rods are not appropriate to the Dreadnought but I asked Allen to include so I could add to Comet 70ft underframes for the correct four sets. This was a request from me from minimal information. Try finding this is the books but two of them existed.

 

 

Full clerestory bodies give you the parts to produce as here before any other parts were added. Of note, the clerestory roof is slot and tab with strengtheners and  rainstrips etched in. By far the simplest clerestory roof sections I have ever made. I do not have a close up but you should get the idea from the lower image. The underframe is assembled from the Worsley clerestory body parts etch. The castings v hanger, truss you have to add yourself. I used Hornby Deans on this one.

 

 

 

 

 

Finally there is the sides/ends etch to use on rtr. This is the D33, another request from Jason Brumby and myself. Allen even produces as this, as here, to fit the Hornby body, or a full body if you prefer. This coach had three phases in its' life and Allen produced all three including plated over panels for the final version based on an image I had supplied. What A guy.

He also produces the sides for C16 to fit the Hornby and make it look how it should for post 1910. Hornby used the original drawing and the original window layout did not last long. If you are new to this the C16 is a great starting point. I have a chap here who has just made one for the first time. He only used the sides and made a great job of it. Personally I use the ends as well.

 

 

Again, I must stress they are not marketed as kits but body parts. In addition the gauge of brass used is very strong (compared to some I have in stock only slightly thicker than paper-UGH).

Worsley works started as a cottage industry for the 3mm/TT market. The 4mm stuff came about as enough people asked him for 4mm versions.

 

GWR list here

 

http://www.worsleyworks.co.uk/4mm/4mm_GWR.htm

 

Hope this helps

 

Mike Wiltshire

 

 

That’s terrific Mike thank you.

 

It looks like the easy route to dip your toe in the water is a C16 conversion kit then…. Although, with some of the carriages I have done already, it will probably be straightforward.

 

I keep looking at the Toplights: maybe D56; E96/8…. Again the easy route would be as sides only, over the Hornby Collets.

 

If you were to do these as a full kit, or even for that tea car, how would you form the roof curvature? For those kits without a roof, presumably Allen sells them separately?

 

You have spoken about the tea car before, it sounds interesting, but I’m put off the Dreadnoughts due to the inset doors!

 

With my backlog of incomplete kits coming to an end, I just need to bite the bullet and place an order. 
 

Thanks again for the information.

[ChrisN]

17 hours ago, Coach bogie said:

 

Depends on what you are buying. Here is a E48 brake compo. It is how the B sets were born as certain divisions coupled them in pairs and Paddington developed the idea further.

Roof, sides, ends, droplights, look outs, floor and solebars. Major bonus on all the roof sections is the rainstrips etched in. Door hinge holes etched through. Note all this is flat and you will have to form tumblehomes etc. Slot and tab underframe makes assembly easier. This was a request from David Geen and myself. Even other kit producers use him.

 

 

 

Here is a similar for the Dreadnought tea car - note the extra doors. No roof with this one. The truss rods are not appropriate to the Dreadnought but I asked Allen to include so I could add to Comet 70ft underframes for the correct four sets. This was a request from me from minimal information. Try finding this is the books but two of them existed.

 

 

Full clerestory bodies give you the parts to produce as here before any other parts were added. Of note, the clerestory roof is slot and tab with strengtheners and  rainstrips etched in. By far the simplest clerestory roof sections I have ever made. I do not have a close up but you should get the idea from the lower image. The underframe is assembled from the Worsley clerestory body parts etch. The castings v hanger, truss you have to add yourself. I used Hornby Deans on this one.

 

 

 

 

 

Finally there is the sides/ends etch to use on rtr. This is the D33, another request from Jason Brumby and myself. Allen even produces as this, as here, to fit the Hornby body, or a full body if you prefer. This coach had three phases in its' life and Allen produced all three including plated over panels for the final version based on an image I had supplied. What A guy.

He also produces the sides for C16 to fit the Hornby and make it look how it should for post 1910. Hornby used the original drawing and the original window layout did not last long. If you are new to this the C16 is a great starting point. I have a chap here who has just made one for the first time. He only used the sides and made a great job of it. Personally I use the ends as well.

 

 

Again, I must stress they are not marketed as kits but body parts. In addition the gauge of brass used is very strong (compared to some I have in stock only slightly thicker than paper-UGH).

Worsley works started as a cottage industry for the 3mm/TT market. The 4mm stuff came about as enough people asked him for 4mm versions.

 

GWR list here

 

http://www.worsleyworks.co.uk/4mm/4mm_GWR.htm

 

Hope this helps

 

Mike Wiltshire

 

 

 

Thank you Mike,

That is a very comprehensive answer.  I model 1895 Cambrian so mostly I am interested in tri- composites, or actually tri composite brakes.  I have a side project, which is to build the 10:02 from Paddington to Birkenhead, which has a through coach to Barmouth Traeth Mawr, which would be a tri composite brake.  So very useful and it gives me much to think about.