Henley-on-Thames - GWR in the 1930's

[gwrrob]

I don’t need anymore either unless Accurascale announce one obviously.

[Penrhos1920]

On 27/10/2022 at 05:29, Neal Ball said:

H25....

I don’t suppose you have a drawing of the roof layout do you? I’m about to start drilling for the vents etc.

 

Thanks again, Neal.

 

 

Theres a good roof photo on www.gwrcoaches.co.uk

 

[Neal Ball]

2 hours ago, Penrhos1920 said:

 

Theres a good roof photo on www.gwrcoaches.co.uk

 

Thanks Richard, your site is a regular go-to for information.

[Neal Ball]

On 27/08/2023 at 14:36, gwrrob said:

I don’t need anymore either unless Accurascale announce one obviously.

Ah! Now what will A/s be announcing on Friday Robin? …. Feel free to DM me 😎

[Clearwater]

On 27/08/2023 at 09:33, Neal Ball said:

 

There was the "Produced for the NRM" version that I have, which was done a few years ago (R3237 shown in preserved condition) - now there is the current standard tooling version which is due out shortly.

 

R30328: https://uk.Hornby.com/products/gwr-castle-class-4-6-0-4073-caerphilly-castle-era-3-r30328?_br_psugg_q=4073

 

Standard Castle details, this time with the Collett 3500 gal tender and shirt button livery. No fireman tunnel shown, although Hornby seem to be unclear which locos had them!

When they announced the catalogue, I emailed Hornby with some pictures pointing out the errors relative to sources  (the relatively new Maidment book.). Didn’t get an answer.  As I don’t own anywhere near enough castles, I’ll probably get these despite the flaws and re number to a better example.

[Clearwater]

Any errors of mine, please educate me.  I find it bizarre that they wouldn’t check a new book for pictures.  And then not realise their own tooling is capable of actually delivering a more accurate model.

 

David

[Coach bogie]

Firstly how reliable is the book? Be cautious with the descriptions/captions in the Maidment books. There are some gems across his titles. 

 

Caerphilly also had an additional rainstrip, on the cab roof when first introduced and brakes on the front bogie. Caldicot Castle had the name spelt Caldicott when first entering service, but only for a short time.

 

To be fair to any manufacturer, there were improvements/changes went on all the time. Which version do they choose? One size fits all really does not work here. As I do with kit building pick a date and produce a model for that date.

 

Mike Wiltshire

Edited August 30, 2023 by Coach bogie

[Neal Ball]

7 hours ago, Clearwater said:

Any errors of mine, please educate me.  I find it bizarre that they wouldn’t check a new book for pictures.  And then not realise their own tooling is capable of actually delivering a more accurate model.

 

David

I agree David, they should check….. but was it all to do with a certain gentleman “who might” have thought they were all the same? Thankfully he has now moved on!

 

Im pretty sure that someone else on here also pointed out the errors…

 

6 hours ago, Coach bogie said:

Firstly how reliable is the book? Be cautious with the descriptions/captions in the Maidment books. There are some gems across his titles. 

 

Caerphilly also had an additional rainstrip, on the cab roof when first introduced and brakes on the front bogie. Caldicot Castle had the name spelt Caldicott when first entering service, but only for a short time.

 

To be fair to any manufacturer, there were improvements/changes went on all the time. Which version do they choose? One size fits all really does not work here. As I do with kit building pick a date and produce a model for that date.

 

Mike Wiltshire

You only have to look at Pannier tank locos with and without Topfeed for examples here…. Loco x was given topfeed with its next boiler change in 1942…. Yet a few years later the same loco will be back at Swindon and have a replacement boiler with no top feed. That won’t be easy for a manufacturer.

 

Hopefully though with SK not at Hornby anymore, they might do sensible research and produce some decent Great Western models. 

[Clearwater]

7 hours ago, Coach bogie said:

Firstly how reliable is the book? Be cautious with the descriptions/captions in the Maidment books. There are some gems across his titles. 

 

Caerphilly also had an additional rainstrip, on the cab roof when first introduced and brakes on the front bogie. Caldicot Castle had the name spelt Caldicott when first entering service, but only for a short time.

 

To be fair to any manufacturer, there were improvements/changes went on all the time. Which version do they choose? One size fits all really does not work here. As I do with kit building pick a date and produce a model for that date.

 

Mike Wiltshire

Hi Mike

 

Per above, I took the approach of comparing a picture in the book to a mock-up.  Personally, I feel they’re excellent albums for exactly the exercise you describe.  However, if I was a company like Hornby and relying on the pictures/caption for my own professional work, I’d want to do some verification / diligence of the photos/captions to check they show what they think they do.  

 

David

[Coach bogie]

1 hour ago, Clearwater said:

Hi Mike

 

Per above, I took the approach of comparing a picture in the book to a mock-up.  Personally, I feel they’re excellent albums for exactly the exercise you describe.  However, if I was a company like Hornby and relying on the pictures/caption for my own professional work, I’d want to do some verification / diligence of the photos/captions to check they show what they think they do.  

 

David

Many of the images have been published before, particularly in Great Western Steam in1930's by Geen, Fraser with reliable captions from the original source.  This is the issue with some of the Maidment GWR series. Great use is made of Godfrey Soole images but listed as XYZ collection. The original images are at the NRM for all to see with full details on the rear. Soole had excellent attention to detail. I have some of his originals myself with his hand writing on the back, yet the books appear to rely on best speculation.

 

Here is one of my Soole's taken at Westbury in 1937. Note Speedometer - not every Castle had them at this time. This is the challenge for Hornby and all manufacturers. What date/period is 4074 to represent? When Hornby released 5011 it came with a 4,000 gallon tender. When at Newton Abbott 5011 was retro fitted with a small tender in the 1930's. Hornby were not wrong but correct only for a certain window in time. Nightmare for any manufacturer trying to please everyone.

 

I suspect Hornby have used their model image of 4073 in preserved condition, which is correct with fire iron tunnel, later boiler/chimney etc, and just changed the name and number.

Mike Wiltshire

 

[Harlequin]

When I asked, Hornby told me that the image of 4074 incorrectly showed the fire iron tunnel and that the model would not have it. I.e. It was a graphics department error.

 

Hopefully that has been communicated through to the production process...

 

 

[Miss Prism]

The 3500g Churchward tenders fitted to the initial Castles had longitudinal vacuum tanks. I don't expect Hornby to get that sort of detail right (nor the bogie brakes), but it would be nice if Hornby stopped pretending their products are not what they are actually producing. If producing an early Castle is too difficult for Hornby, then the answer is to stop trying to produce an early Castle.

 

[Tallpaul69]

On 31/08/2023 at 06:34, Neal Ball said:

I agree David, they should check….. but was it all to do with a certain gentleman “who might” have thought they were all the same? Thankfully he has now moved on!

 

Im pretty sure that someone else on here also pointed out the errors…

 

You only have to look at Pannier tank locos with and without Topfeed for examples here…. Loco x was given topfeed with its next boiler change in 1942…. Yet a few years later the same loco will be back at Swindon and have a replacement boiler with no top feed. That won’t be easy for a manufacturer.

 

Hopefully though with SK not at Hornby anymore, they might do sensible research and produce some decent Great Western models. 

Be careful what you wish for!

Many of us remember the last time SK was consigned to the scrap heap (well, the northern wastes of Locomotion, actually)!

It was not pretty.

While we have a more sensitive man at the helm (Bravo Taff!!) this time, he cannot do everything and looking back at the Hornby Programs on TV, I can't remember any obvious candidates to do a better job in SKs shoes? Maybe there are folks hiding at Bachmann, Dapol et al, to nick?

Also, trying to be all things to all modellers is doomed to failure, so where should Hornby concentrate?.......Discuss!!

 

(Grabs coat and beats a hasty retreat)

Cheers All,

[Neal Ball]

1 hour ago, Tallpaul69 said:

Be careful what you wish for!

Many of us remember the last time SK was consigned to the scrap heap (well, the northern wastes of Locomotion, actually)!

It was not pretty.

While we have a more sensitive man at the helm (Bravo Taff!!) this time, he cannot do everything and looking back at the Hornby Programs on TV, I can't remember any obvious candidates to do a better job in SKs shoes? Maybe there are folks hiding at Bachmann, Dapol et al, to nick?

Also, trying to be all things to all modellers is doomed to failure, so where should Hornby concentrate?.......Discuss!!

 

(Grabs coat and beats a hasty retreat)

Cheers All,

 

Indeed quite right Paul - I don't know where the replacement is coming from - but I would guess it will be outside the industry....

 

At the same time I suspect there might be a restructure, but who knows.

 

All I hope is that with a change in direction, brings about less emphasis towards the LNER - or at least as a GWR man , thats how it seems 😃

[Metropolitan H]

1 hour ago, Neal Ball said:

 

>>>>>>>>>..........

 

All I hope is that with a change in direction, brings about less emphasis towards the LNER - or at least as a GWR man , thats how it seems 😃

As a fan of both GWR and LNER, but not so much in 00, I am inclined to think that the GWR fans do as well as any others, especially when the LNER has the GNR, NER, NBR, GCR and GER as antecedents - some of which are very poorly represented. GWR afficianados are fairly well provided for - although a Birdgage 2-4-2 and some of the early 0-6-0STs are under represented.

 

But where are the GCR Sacre 2-4-0Ts, the NER A class 2-4-2\Ts, GER T26 2-4-0 intermediates, GNR Class H3 (LNER Class K2)  "Ragtimer" 2-6-0 and NBR Class K (LNER D34) "Glen" 4-4-0s? - And I haven't mentioned the HBR or the GNoSR??

 

And I haven't got started on my favourite 4-4-4Ts - the NER D Class and the Metropolitan Railway "H" class!

 

Regards

Chris H

[Neal Ball]

8 minutes ago, Metropolitan H said:

As a fan of both GWR and LNER, .........

 

........some of which are very poorly represented. GWR afficianados are fairly well provided for - although a Birdgage 2-4-2 and some of the early 0-6-0STs are under represented.

 

........

 

Regards

Chris H

 

Thanks Chris,

 

If you look through the recent catalogues of both Bachmann and Hornby, then the GWR is very unrepresented. 

 

At least as far as new tooling is concerned..... in fact Bachmann has not had new carriages for 30+ years in fact the old sunshine carriages hark back to the mainline mouldings from the 1980's

[Metropolitan H]

But how many good models of LNER coaches have ever been offered as RTR in 4mm scale - a lesser number that for the GWR I suspect?

 

Don't forget I too like GWR trains, but consider that railway to be much better catered for than the LNER and others.

 

Regards

Chris H

 

P.S. - While it is much easier to work with a good range of RTR items, I do get most satisfaction from actually making things from kits or scratch.

 

CH

Edited September 1, 2023 by Metropolitan H

[sjrixon]

We 'GWR' people have some amazing locos, trucks etc. But coaches, not a lot. Some interesting things on the horizon, but still very lacking...

[Neal Ball]

15 minutes ago, Metropolitan H said:

But how many good models of LNER coaches have ever been offered as RTR in 4mm scale - a lesser number that for the GWR I suspect?

 

Don't forget I too like GWR trains, but consider that railway to be much better catered for than the LNER and others.

 

Regards

Chris H

 

P.S. - While it is much easier to work with a good range of RTR items, I do get most satisfaction from actually making things from kits or scratch.

 

CH

I disagree about how the GWR is better catered for and a month or so ago I compiled a spreadsheet for my own amusement….

 

It makes interesting reading as the GWR came out the bottom where new loco announcements were concerned. (Again I am talking about new tooling).

 

I chose the timeframe to start with the Accurascale Manor announcement , which was February 2021. It was an interesting exercise……

 

Ps: I agree with your postscript, that’s it’s very satisfying to make / build kits to provide the variety. 
 

As you would have seen in the thread, I have done loads of carriages and so far 1 loco.

 

I have a few carriages to build and am contemplating which loco will be next! 😎

[Neal Ball]

Its here!

 

 

Am I the first in the EU?

[gwrrob]

Dip your bread @Neal Ball

[longchap]

1 hour ago, Neal Ball said:

Am I the first in the EU?

 

If they are posted alphabetically, then likely yes. Sadly, I'm toward the end of that list 😭

 

[Neal Ball]

10 hours ago, gwrrob said:

Dip your bread @Neal Ball

 

8 hours ago, longchap said:

 

If they are posted alphabetically, then likely yes. Sadly, I'm toward the end of that list 😭

 

 

Sorry there were no more photos yesterday. I got caught up in non-railway stuff, which included an inpromptu dinner at a local Italian 😎

 

Hopefully you wont have to wait too long now Bill and @Graham T and anyone else in the EU still waiting.

 

If you only have the AN Post from Dublin tracking details, have a look here for your local carrier: https://www.anpost.com/Post-Parcels/Sending/International-Postal-Carriers Despite our postal service not being very good, I found they were updating the tracking details better than AN Post.

 

PS: There were no broken parts on board and so far I have avoided breaking anything :-) 

[Neal Ball]

It's January 1938 and one of Mr Collett's "new" locos no 7801 Anthony Manor is seen at Henley-on-Thames getting admiring glances from the passengers:

 

Edited September 6, 2023 by Neal Ball

[Neal Ball]

Its been a noisy couple of days at Henley-on-Thames with the arrival of the Manor loco - no 7801 Anthony Manor.

 

Released into Traffic in January 1938 and initially based at Bristol, being withdrawn and scrapped in January 1961.

 

Seen here arriving into Henley-on-Thames:

 

 

 

Then at Platform 3 ready to depart for Twyford:

 

 

Plus the now obligatory Turntable shot:

 

 

Since these photos have been taken, a second lamp has been fitted together with crew and the coal load removed ready to fit a new speaker.

 

The loco has been executed very well by Accurascale, it has the look of a Manor - however, one disappointing area is the sound - its just too quiet.

 

I have already messaged Accurascale and they have advised that the sound can not be turned up any higher, which is obviously disappointing. Having spent so much time recording the right sound etc. it's a shame you can hardly hear it. I am therefore going to look at changing the speaker in the tender for a bigger one - ideally a double speaker, but space is going to be tight.

 

It's not all bad though, there are so many plus points, including the detail in the cab. It's a lovely weighty loco and ran round the railway hauling 6 carriages with no problem.

 

There are reports elsewhere about it struggling with double slips or tight curves - not at Henley - it successfully negotiated all my double slips, together with the approach (off scene) which is probably the tightest curve on the layout.