RMweb Gold Donw Posted November 28, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 28, 2015 Only two options re-visitors: Either we're the most intelligent in the Universe so nobody else has yet arrived. Or there are more intelligent life forms who have visited. Maybe their ancestors "Walk amongst us". They would've obviously have modelled the Midland as it was "The Best Way"............. Perhaps a super-intelligent race goes through the universe seeding life onto suitable planets with the DNA designed to evolve into intelligent life forms. We could be the result of such seeding. Don Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrkirtley800 Posted November 28, 2015 Share Posted November 28, 2015 We can't be all that bright when we go around killing each other because we don't share exactly the same beliefs. Derek Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold ChrisN Posted November 28, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 28, 2015 The problem with space travel is not only the distances but the lack of gravity. I have discussions with my youngest son about this as he believes space travel is possible because he thinks we will invent artificial gravity. Without that our muscles, including our heart muscles will waste away quite quickly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jock67B Posted December 6, 2015 Share Posted December 6, 2015 (edited) Jeff, Just posting to check that your dad is ok with all the terrible weather in his region? Should also enquire if your area and your beautiful landscaping also avoided the worst ravages? Kind regards, Jock. Edited December 6, 2015 by Jock67B 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted December 6, 2015 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 6, 2015 Jeff, Just posting to check that your dad is ok with all the terrible weather in his region? Should also enquire if your area and your beautiful landscaping also avoided the worst ravages? Kind regards, Jock. Hi Jock. I saw your comment in the KL2 thread and appreciate both this and the KL2 post. All is ok, both with dad and with the landscaping. A couple of houses under construction about 100 yards away had their roof struts blown over yesterday, when the wind gusts touched around 70mph. Otherwise, no damage. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peach james Posted December 6, 2015 Share Posted December 6, 2015 As Jeff posted in the KL thread, his dad is several hundred feet ASL, so is fine from most flooding. I am quite sure that what was Granddad's store in Cockermouth is flooded again. Good news- no family connection since 1978. (& its no longer a chemists either...) Next on my list- Electrical mayhem... 1. I was 2 when I decided to see what happens when you stick a screwdriver into a sewing machine motor. Apparently, the jolt to a 2 year old is a bit impressive. 2. Not having learned enough from #1, I decided to make the light on the freezer go on and off. And on and off. And....well, eventually, the smoke came out of the freezer. (it was turning it on and off flash freeze mode). 3. Having moved to Canada, and survived shorting out the odd bit of 12 vdc model railway, I moved up to working on house wiring mostly on 120 vac. Working on one pump (a 240v job), I was sure I had the power isolated, as I had turned it off on the panel. Well, it turns out that it was fed from 2 seperate meter base's... only half the zap of the UK though, but twice the new underwear ! 4. Getting bigger in the world, we come to 440V on ship. First spectacular one is on a Bay class minesweeper, built in ~1956 or so. As the Jr engineer in the Genny room, I go to shut down the 2nd generator at sea. We've just left esquimalt, and the important thing to realize is that to get into the generator room you face aft, and then you turn forward, then you face aft in the space....yep, I turned off the wrong generator under load....brown to black the ship. (not really that spectacular, but still...) 5. YAG 314- we come alongside our home jetty in Esquimalt, and I go to turn on the fire pump for some reason. We're on shore power- so what happens? The pump turns backwards...which is easy to fix, as a StokET, I just need to turn off the power and reverse any 2 leads. Done. Now, flash generator- and the pump turns backwards? Back we go to the way it was- it turns out the jetty was wired backwards, not the ship. (just one box was wired backwards, and we normally ran up the generator to do much electrical on the boats, so it had never been noticed) 6. This one is a bit spectacular- I'm sitting in the control shop on PRO, as we are coming alongside Pearl Harbour, Hawaii. They pipe out specials, and all of a sudden, the ship goes black. Then, about 15 seconds later (about the start time for the Diesel Generator...), I hear an allmighty BANG !. Cue about 10 seconds later- by this point, I'm already moving to the MCR- BANG, and blue flash, and grab a CO2, because my way forward is now past where the blue flash was...and they try again... after the 3rd time, someone else checked to make sure the Turbo-Alternators were actually off the bus. The poor Diesel had been trying to motor up the one TA- the diesel is 1/2 the size, and trying to motor from 0-9556 rpm on the turbine instantly is quite the load. The diesel breaker had been going on its 3 second rating of ~4800 amps @ 440 v (about 2800 hp), from a 1200 hp diesel. -result was > needing a new camshaft & valvegear on 3/12 cylinders. The engine struggled on for about 1 hour after too...even though it was down to 9 cylinders firing. We started the day with 2 TA's, 1 DG and the GT, and finished with the GT only. (Port TA had broken an exciter bolt, and died electrically- starboard TA was motored and shifted the turbine against the labrinth seal, destroying the seal, and the stbd DG is photo'd above) There are a couple of others- I'll post them later if I get the chance. James Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jock67B Posted December 6, 2015 Share Posted December 6, 2015 Thanks James, at least you're still here to tell the tale! A lot of people might be surprised at the amount of power used on board ship, and of course it gets interesting when the deck is metal. I had a lesson in the power of electricity when I was quite young, my dad was trying to mend mum's iron (which drew quite a current) and to save time, he got her to switch the power on and off while he tried different adjustments - you might guess that she got the switching on/off out of sync, just as he had put a reasonably large screwdriver into the heating element area. The bang and flash were quite impressive, and luckily the screwdriver was thrown away from us and through the glass door of the dining room dresser, then through the wooden back panel, embedding itself in the plaster behind! Dad's face was ashen, and I never forgot the lesson - unplug, don't just switch off!! Kind regards, Jock. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allegheny1600 Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 Oh, I've had a healthy respect for electrikery since I was quite young and my granddad told the story of one of his tenants who messed with the mains voltage. Apparently he got held on to the live current and was there for over an hour before he died, just letting out soft moans now and then. Poor sod. An electrician told me that you only get one shock - the last one! Beware! John. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jock67B Posted December 12, 2015 Share Posted December 12, 2015 Evening all, Very quiet on here lately whilst the 'Master' is residing in Cumbria, so I thought I'd throw in some trivia that the non-stargazers might not know - a day on Venus is actually longer than a year on Venus, when measured with the same parameters we use for Earth. it takes 243 Earth days to rotate on it's axis and it pins in the opposite direction when compared to the other planets. It's orbit round the Sun takes just 225 Earth days. Hope you feel enriched by this knowledge! Kind regards, Jock. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted December 12, 2015 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 12, 2015 Good on you Jock. Keep informing the troops! Jeff (aka the "Master"!!!!) 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peach james Posted December 12, 2015 Share Posted December 12, 2015 (edited) Jock, my big lad around here told me the same thing . (10 years old, and fairly clever) Other shocking incidents- 40 Ton/Hr submersible pumps (about 25 hp, as they are ~25A/440V) 1. On ship. The pump weighs 82 lb, and has a rope and a power cord. (and a 2 1/2"/64mm hose). To lower it down, one uses the ROPE to lower or raise the pump. The 'leccy cord is secured in such a way that it is supposed to be able to hold 2x the pump weight. Supposed... When you see the sparks leaving the pump because one of your mates has the pump by the cord and are dragging it running back up the ladder. At least we were NOT in seawater, as it was only an exercise. 2. At the school. The pump's on/off switch comes in at least 2 versions- waterproof and water resistant. Fortunately, the school has a very good GFIC (RCD) on the 440V power supply. I think I got about 5 ma across me. My boss still told me to go see the doc's, because you cannot see internal burns. James Edited December 12, 2015 by peach james Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jock67B Posted December 12, 2015 Share Posted December 12, 2015 James, You have had some scary escapes! When our No1 grandson was around two years old, he was a real gadget boy, poking in to anything mechanical. Unbeknown to anyone, his father (who shouldn't be allowed within a country mile of electrics!) had removed a faulty bulb from the bedside lamp in the bedroom, leaving the bulb socket empty and the lamp still plugged in! Young one came along and played with the switch as usual, and managed to bridge the terminals when they were switched live. Thrown on to the bed with a yell, when his mum rushed in, he exclaimed that "a giant gripped my arm!" which I thought was a lovely innocent way of expressing it! He had a very lucky escape indeed, because it transpires that he had a faulty heart valve he was born with, which was only diagnosed and replaced around twelve weeks ago at 26 years old! Just remember the isolating switch, is what your friend lifting the pump should of course have been instructed. Kind regards, Jock. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeHemmings Posted December 12, 2015 Share Posted December 12, 2015 Evening all, Very quiet on here lately whilst the 'Master' is residing in Cumbria, so I thought I'd throw in some trivia that the non-stargazers might not know - a day on Venus is actually longer than a year on Venus, when measured with the same parameters we use for Earth. it takes 243 Earth days to rotate on it's axis and it pins in the opposite direction when compared to the other planets. It's orbit round the Sun takes just 225 Earth days. Hope you feel enriched by this knowledge! Kind regards, Jock. And it takes Pluto 247.9 earth years to orbit the sun. Mike Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PeterBB Posted December 12, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 12, 2015 2. At the school. The pump's on/off switch comes in at least 2 versions- waterproof and water resistant. Fortunately, the school has a very good GFIC (RCD) on the 440V power supply. I think I got about 5 ma across me. My boss still told me to go see the doc's, because you cannot see internal burns. James Only too true James - good on him - you cannot see internal burns so unless there is an exit ... which means that there is charred tissue along the whole length of the burn within the body ... which of course you still cannot see. Electricity is truly dangerous 'stuff' when mishandled. Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jock67B Posted December 12, 2015 Share Posted December 12, 2015 Evening Peter, I fully agree, as some people that have been struck by lightning, or hit by three phase can testify, if they live to tell the tale. Such tissue damage requires specialist treatment, as often the entry and exit wounds disguise the fact that you can have serious 'internal burns". Often the heart or brain can also receive damage so it is always a good idea to insist on being seen by a specialist. A surprisingly low current, even measurements in milliamperes, can cause considerable damage, and it is also well worth remembering that we are all different, so it's impossible to have a definitive table of dangerous levels! Anyone who doesn't fully understand electricity, should leave it well alone, and I still find it odd that you can still see baseboards carrying mains electricity. Kind regards, Jock. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PeterBB Posted December 13, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 13, 2015 Hi Jock, Totally agree. We had 'open' mains electricity (friction and the passage of time had removed insulation on some wires) on our former layout at Gresley which we discovered when dismantled. Also true 15 milliamperes can do damage and 300 milliamperes - the sort of current that flows through hair straighteners - can cause serious damage and I have seen a number of these with tape on them after having been dropped and bits broken off with the users having no idea how dangerous they can be. Cheers, Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Donw Posted December 13, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 13, 2015 A work colleague dealing with a power circuit duly removed the fuse covering that floor and put it in his top pocket for safety and commenced work. As he work he thought he got a tingle a checked he had the fuse. When it happened a second time he got the meter out a read a full 240v. Investigation showed that some clown had run an extra socket bridging the circuits on two floors. Before touching the bare ends of the wire I usually touch the live and neutral together better a splash then than a shock for me. Don 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeHemmings Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 After isolating a circuit and before commencing any work a test should be done to make sure the circuit is dead. Touching the ends of conductor to make sure there dead could result burns to hands and face from molten copper if the circuit was still alive. Mike Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Donw Posted December 13, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 13, 2015 After isolating a circuit and before commencing any work a test should be done to make sure the circuit is dead. Touching the ends of conductor to make sure there dead could result burns to hands and face from molten copper if the circuit was still alive. Mike Not very likely with Modern consumer units with RCDs and MCBs. If you are working in awkward spots where you have climbed a ladder or crawled across roof joists would you actually bother to go back for your meter. Touching the wires is a fail safe I do NOT expect to get a splash as I will have isolated the circuit and checked the circuit is dead (typically other sockets on the circuit have gone dead a radio of the ring main will indicate if the ring main is live or dead similarly a light on on a lighting circuit). The other side of this is knowing what precautions to take when you have to work on live circuits or equipment Don Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeHemmings Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Only newer house's have mcb rcd consumer units a lot of older properties still have reliable fuse board Mike Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Donw Posted December 13, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 13, 2015 Only newer house's have mcb rcd consumer units a lot of older properties still have reliable fuse board Mike Paying to have a new unit fitted could well save a life. Worth the money. Mind you renters beware it is up to the landlord. Don Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PeterBB Posted December 13, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 13, 2015 Don, Most letting companies these days will not accept a property or demand up-to-date checks before they will take them on so new units are getting into them. Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jock67B Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Only newer house's have mcb rcd consumer units a lot of older properties still have reliable fuse board Mike Mike, One of the first jobs I undertook on this house (just under forty years old) was to change the old fuse box for a new consumer unit with all separate circuits on their own trip and the correct amperage double checked. I also disconnected the garage and garden electrics from the house ring main where the builders had simply tacked on to it! Each now have a unit of their own. Joanna was so worried about the state of our children's and grandchildren's houses, after she listened in to a discussion when I advised our next door neighbour about his ancient existing unit, that she sorted out having their places brought up to date. Guess who paid for them? You simply can't put a price on electrical safety as a scary number of people still die annually both at home and at work! Kind regards, Jock. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 45156 Posted December 14, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 14, 2015 I learned at an early age the dangers of electricity when I was visiting my Grandfather's TV shop's repair shop where I was poking around the EHT output of a TV set, and the engineer told me in no uncertain terms what was what. On an old set he showed the arc of a 15 kilovolt supply shorted to earth - most impressive. However, the current was pretty minimal, but I got the message. When I moved into this house, I knew that the wiring was not up to modern standards, and some of the additions to the circuits by a DIY bodger were pretty abysmal. I had an electrician come in to estimate for putting things right, and one of the horrors that he found was a spa bath with the cables run into a joint box in the ring main without any isolators, and through an old style fuse box without an RCD trip! He was so concerned with what he found that he would only quote for a full rewire, and said that he would not be able to certify any other circuits due to potential messing. He did disconnect the offending bath immediately, and suggested that we get the rewire as a matter of extreme urgency, which we did. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeeleyBridge Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 The aged parent's house was wired by demented amateurs in the 20s and 30s. Finally managed to get it rewired after the old fellow shuffled off in 97 and workmen could finally access the house. For some reason he wouldn't have anything done to the house (or throw anything away for that matter - three skips and a month of clearing out when he'd gone). It's wonderful to have electricity on all four floors (instead of two rooms on the ground and one on the first) without extension cables. Also got the ancient self installed(!) 1960s gas fires condemned and removed and safe central heating and double glazing fitted for Mum. She's as snug as a bug these days. I remember being a teenager and having a huge row with the old man because I replaced the 1½" oval nail in the fuse with fuse wire! Elf n' safety? Didn't exist in our house... 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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