A Thompson Trio

[31A]

A few days ago I showed a picture of my modified Bachmann Thompson BSK, on the 'Thompson Vestibuled Main Line Stock' thread:

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/69243-thompson-vestibuled-main-line-stock-retooled/page-3

 

and some interest was shown in what I'd done.

 

I set out several years ago to see what could easily be done to improve the appearance of these coaches.  As well as the BSK that I posted the picture of earlier, I'd also done a red / cream BCK.  Pictures of each of these are below.  I replaced the glazing with the South Eastern Flushglaze kits, and replaced the gangways with MJT items.  I also removed the moulded representations of the torpedo ventilators from the roof, and replaced them with white metal items, noting that ventilators above compartments (including Guards' compartments) were offset from the coach centreline, to be above the centreline of the compartment, but this doesn't apply to those above luggage compartments, or toilets s far as I could tell.  As the picture of the BCK shows, I replaced the vestigially moulded representations of the water tank filler pipes and alarm gear, using wire.  I think the South Eastern Flushglaze worked reasonably well with the large windows, but perhaps less well with the smaller ones such as the sliding ventilators.

 

 

 

There were a few other things I could have done but didn't, including replacing the destination board racks with more substantial versions from microstrip, and I didn't attempt to alter the roof profile, but when I'd finished these two I though the biggest let down was the incorrect positioning of the battery boxes, which have been moulded as if their outer faces are flush with, and attached to, the underframe bracing trusses.

 

My next subject was a full brake (BG) and as well as the above modifications, with this one I decided to see what could be done about the battery boxes.  I initially thought I'd have to replace the underframe trusses and the battery boxes completely and bought replacement items from the MJT range.  However when it came down to it, I thought with careful cutting I should be able to preserve the moulded trusses, and in fact for the BG I was able to re-use the moulded battery boxes as well.  I cut away the section of the floor which includes the battery boxes, and filled in the hole with plastikard.  Since this vehicle only has battery boxes on one side, I glued the removed battery box mouldings back to back which gave a single unit of suitable depth for one side, and glued this to the new floor, together with the retaining strap which passes underneath it from a strip of thin metal.  I've also replaced the brake cylinders and v-hangers with something better looking (can't remember where from!), and replaced the dynamo; I think this came from one of the early Hornby super detail Gresleys which quirkily came with two dynamos at first!

 

The pictures below show this vehicle.

 

There is no South Eastern Flushglaze kit for the full brake, but there were some droplight mouldings left over from the other two which I used for the Guards' doors, and I glazed the narrow toplights from a strip of clear plastic, cut to length for each opening and held in place with Johnson's Klear.

 

 

 

The MJT gangways work well on my coaches; I replace the 'bellows' with new ones folded up in the same way but using thinner black paper, and add loops of black cotton running vertically through the outer and inner folds to keep the gangways 'in check', so that they look OK on an uncoupled vehicle.  However I didn't want to use these for the BG as they represent gangways with the outer shields fitted, which I thought might be less likely for a full brake, especially as it spends a lot of its time in parcels trains.  About this time, Chris Pendlenton described method for making 'floating' gangways in MRJ, and I decided to give this a try.

 

I had some cast whitemetal gangways (Westward I believe - who remembers them?) and the process involved gluing these to a backing of 60 thou plastikard of the same dimensions, then another piece of plastikard (wider and higher) was laminated to this.  A hole is cut in the coach end to the outline of the gangway which can then be passed through it from the inside, and the bigger piece retains it from passing right through.  Springs are arranged on the inside in the form of 'fingers' from thin phosphor bronze wire.

 

The system works reasonably well even on my layout which I'm sure has much sharper curves than the designer intended; however the main drawback was that the hole in the coach end had to be appreciably larger than the gangway to allow it to slide and swivel without getting jammed, which is fairly obvious on this design of coach.

 

I think the above modifications, which were all quite simple apart perhaps from the BG's gangways, were well worthwhile in improving the appearance of the coaches.  I've got three others on the layout and intended to that them similarly, but with the announcement of re-tooled versions, to be honest I probably won't proceed with them.  Nevertheless, I hope this is useful for anybody who may want to upgrade their existing vehicles.

 

 

 

 

 

[John Tomlinson]

This looks really good, and could be an example to all who have a few of these and are loathe to cough up for a new version.

 

I tried my hand at a couple some years ago, but didn't move the battery boxes, which makes a great improvement. I did however alter the roof profile by filing, a messy process set out in the Coaching book by Tony Wright published by Irwell. These does give another level of improvement, but if I did some more I would glue some reinforcing plastic strip inside the roof where the removal takes place, as this becomes quite thin when filed. The other downside is that you need to do all your stock of this type, otherwise the inconsistency is rather obvious!

 

John.

[31A]

Thanks, John!  An interesting point about reinforcing the inside of the roof before reprofiling it.  I hadn't thought of that, but was deterred as I thought it might be difficult to maintain the same profile over the whole length of the vehicle.

[John Tomlinson]

Steve, keeping the profile isn't too difficult, provided you draw the file lengthways as per Mr Wright. I seem to remember I made a little cardboard template taken from a drawing (Campling?) that fits over the roof to show the bumps and inconsistencies - ie its a negative. I do remember cutting a couple of scrap cardboard strips to cover the sides of the coach using an elastic band in case the file slipped. At the end you need to replace the rainstrips with plastic strip as they are affected by the filing. 

 

One thing your photos show in my opinion is that the error in the moulding looks a lot less with a good dose of matt weathering. I found the same with the Bachmann Mk1's and their oversize roof ribs - having bottled sanding or scraping them down, they looked far less pronounced when weathered.

 

Your layout looks fascinating - is there anywhere else I can see more pictures?

 

John.

[davidw]

Thanks Steve, I've an 8 coach (10 including the mk1's) Elizabethan rake. Southern pride on Bachmann donors.

 

I've debated replacing the lot wit the new Bachmann offerings. The potential cost is off putting but as an alternate you've given me food for thought. 

[micklner]

Southern Pride conversions. I have scraped the roofs back and redone the board brackets. I stopped at doing the roof rain strips as  pain to redo could have a bit more off the curve. The BG is a similar shade to the others bleached out by the flash. I removed the Battery boxes on one side and used the new NRM type Bachmann bogies.

 

 

 

[31A]

Steve, keeping the profile isn't too difficult, provided you draw the file lengthways as per Mr Wright. I seem to remember I made a little cardboard template taken from a drawing (Campling?) that fits over the roof to show the bumps and inconsistencies - ie its a negative. I do remember cutting a couple of scrap cardboard strips to cover the sides of the coach using an elastic band in case the file slipped. At the end you need to replace the rainstrips with plastic strip as they are affected by the filing. 

 

One thing your photos show in my opinion is that the error in the moulding looks a lot less with a good dose of matt weathering. I found the same with the Bachmann Mk1's and their oversize roof ribs - having bottled sanding or scraping them down, they looked far less pronounced when weathered.

 

Your layout looks fascinating - is there anywhere else I can see more pictures?

 

John.

 

Thanks, John.  Interesting that you were happy to re-profile the roofs, but not remove the 'ribs' from Bachmann Mk1s - I'm the other way round!  in the picture of the maroon BSK, the set of coaches standing behind it is a rake of Mk1s with the roof ribs removed.

 

Some more pictures of my layout here:

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/83030-train-spotting-at-finsbury-square/

 

although I must confess I haven't put any more on for a while.

 

 

Thanks Steve, I've an 8 coach (10 including the mk1's) Elizabethan rake. Southern pride on Bachmann donors.

 

I've debated replacing the lot wit the new Bachmann offerings. The potential cost is off putting but as an alternate you've given me food for thought. 

 

I keep meaning to send for a set of Southern Pride 'Flying Scotsman' buffet car sides (BR rebuilt version), but haven't got around to it yet.  I wonder whether it'll be worth waiting to see what the re-tooled underframes are like, to use as donors (although that does sound horribly expensive)?

 

 

Southern Pride conversions. I have scraped the roofs back and redone the board brackets. I stopped at doing the roof rain strips as  pain to redo could have a bit more off the curve. The BG is a similar shade to the others bleached out by the flash. I removed the Battery boxes on one side and used the new NRM type Bachmann bogies.

 

1 thom.jpg

 

2 thom.jpg

 

5 thom.jpg

 

Nice work, Mick.  Ah, the bogies!  I was going to replace the BG's bogies with 8' w.b. ones until I measured the Bachmann bogies and found they scaled out at 8' w.b. anyway!  Also they seem to need non-standard length axles; the red/cream BCK is on its second set of bogies as it originally had plastic wheels and to get rid of them I had to replace the bogies!  Not sure what you mean by 'new NRM type Bachmann bogies'?

 

Cheers,

Steve

[micklner]

Sorry typo should be NEM version. You need to move the coupler out on them too !!.

[31A]

Sorry typo should be NEM version. You need to move the coupler out on them too !!.

 

Ah, I see!  I didn't realise there was an NEM version, but while taking the pictures of the BG I remembered I'd had to make a plastikard bracket to set the couplers (small type, screw fixing) further outboard on that one so that they would work!

[John Tomlinson]

Many thanks for the link to your layout thread - I can only repeat the comments of others that you've really caught the atmosphere of that part of London before the City went into overdrive after 1986!

 

On the subject of Mk1 roofs, I kept the ribs at least in part due to laziness. However I must add that after looking at a few "in the flesh" as well as studying umpteen photos, the conclusion I came to was that the often visible marks resembling ribs are in fact weld seams. Some of them are very neatly done and scarcely visible, and others a lot more obvious. So the totally accurate modelling answer is probably to sand or scrape but not perfectly, leaving something still visible, but a lot less than moulded by Bachmann. Nothing is ever simple!!

 

John

[davidw]

Many thanks for the link to your layout thread - I can only repeat the comments of others that you've really caught the atmosphere of that part of London before the City went into overdrive after 1986!

 

On the subject of Mk1 roofs, I kept the ribs at least in part due to laziness. However I must add that after looking at a few "in the flesh" as well as studying umpteen photos, the conclusion I came to was that the often visible marks resembling ribs are in fact weld seams. Some of them are very neatly done and scarcely visible, and others a lot more obvious. So the totally accurate modelling answer is probably to sand or scrape but not perfectly, leaving something still visible, but a lot less than moulded by Bachmann. Nothing is ever simple!!

 

John

 

I've deribbed all the ribbs on my mk1's (50+). It makes a huge difference. I take the coach apart and then the roofs are sprayed with either Matt black or matt grey (humbrol rattle cans), I've said before Steve that I'm impressed by your gangway connections.

[John Tomlinson]

David, my comment wasn't to doubt for a minute that removing the Mk1 ribs makes a difference, nor to question that Bachmann's moulding of them is too pronounced. Without repeating myself, next time you see some Mk1's in close up, and there are squillions around our preserved railways, take a look at the roof and I think you will see what I mean about the weld seams which are quite visible.

 

Coming back to the "re-tooled" Thompson coaches, we don't as yet know how these will stand up to scrutiny. Lets hope they are better than Hornby's eagerly awaited Gresleys, or else there will be an awful lot of people out with the files and saws on the older, cheaper versions!

 

John.

[davidw]

No offence intended...

[31A]

Many thanks for the link to your layout thread - I can only repeat the comments of others that you've really caught the atmosphere of that part of London before the City went into overdrive after 1986!

 

On the subject of Mk1 roofs, I kept the ribs at least in part due to laziness. However I must add that after looking at a few "in the flesh" as well as studying umpteen photos, the conclusion I came to was that the often visible marks resembling ribs are in fact weld seams. Some of them are very neatly done and scarcely visible, and others a lot more obvious. So the totally accurate modelling answer is probably to sand or scrape but not perfectly, leaving something still visible, but a lot less than moulded by Bachmann. Nothing is ever simple!!

 

John

 

Thanks, John!

 

Despite appearances in the photo, the ribs usually remain visible on my Mk1s, just greatly reduced - as you say, in reality they were weld seams and hardly ever truly invisible.  So I usually just reduce them a bit then repaint the roof; the ease of disassembly of the Bachmann Mk1s makes this a doddle.   My main tool is actually the square end of a small steel rule which I use as a scraper, pushing it over the roof taking the bulk of the 'rib' with it.  Just need to be a bit careful around ventilators, periscopes etc., and usually just need to use an emery board to clean up where they meet the gutter.

 

Edited to correct a typo - flipping auto correct!

[billbedford]

Weld seems? you'll be wanting some of these then