steve fay Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 The allure of US railroading has been too strong to resist, instead of N I've decided on HO. Seeing videos on YouTube of the J #611 have convinced me to have a go. I'm drawn to the N&W for the degree of independence and apparently they had the nickname among others of British Railways in America. I've just had some Peco Code 83 track delivered and I've ordered some various Freight Cars including some nice Rapido Meat reefers. I've just ordered a six pack of Broadway coal hoppers which should be here in about 3 weeks. So far I've only been shopping in the UK and I'm after a little advice, I can only find N&W cabooses in blue with black & white chevrons yet in all the mid 50's pictures I have they are all in Red livery so is the blue a later option. I've ordered some books for reference material as well I only have about 16 foot length plus the loops with storage sidings around the back and I'd like to model a small slice of the Appalachian mountains in West Virginia. I'm not looking for masses of stock, a mixed manifest, a long coal train & 1 or 2 passenger trains, the Pocohontas and possibly one of the Southern trains that used the route. I've been searching and so far I haven't found any GP9's in N&W so I might have to get a Broadway undecorated example and paint and decal my self. I've had no luck in finding any ACL leased E units either. As most of this layout will be steam I've put in a preorder for a Broadway Y6B and hopefully with all the news surrounding 611. The J and A might make a reappearance from them as the new Broadway Thunder sub woofer system looks very appealing! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fay Posted June 6, 2015 Author Share Posted June 6, 2015 Did any other railroads have trackage Rights over the N&W in the mid to late 50's ? Or did the express trains that used the route change over the N&W power Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave1905 Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 In the 1950's trackage rights was relatively rare. The N&W would use its power on its trains on its tracks. Same goes for passenger power, they would have swapped out power on any through trains, with N&W engines handling the train over the N&W. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted June 6, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 6, 2015 Livery depends on era and plenty of crossover. Have a search of http://www.railpictures.net/index.php Go to railroads and scroll down until you find fallen flags and keep going to Norfolk & Western. I'd recommend using the tabs for selecting photos only and about 60 per page under the find photos button. There's also a date filter. Enjoy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fay Posted June 6, 2015 Author Share Posted June 6, 2015 Excellent thanks for the link, looking at the pictures I think the blue is too late for me as it was introduced on diesels and passenger cars in the mid too late 60's Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikjd Posted June 7, 2015 Share Posted June 7, 2015 Excellent thanks for the link, looking at the pictures I think the blue is too late for me as it was introduced on diesels and passenger cars in the mid too late 60's Caboose's were painted blue between 1966 and 1971, when if repainted they reverted to red. Trying to find a correct N&W caboose is another matter altogether. A quick useful group of pictures are here http://www.krunk.org/~joeshaw/pics/nw/caboose/ . In general the N&W liked to do things their own way, and built a lot of stock in-house, buying relatively little 'off the shelf'. Many model's lettered for the N&W are not unfortunately of N&W prototypes. In the sixties with merger's they did pick up 'typical' freight cars of the period. The N&W Historical Society http://www.nwhs.org/index.php has a lot of info available, with literally thousands of photos and drawings available, from a widget valve to a station building or a track plan. While some are only available to order others can be accessed by anyone. You only have to look at Winston Link's photographs (staged or not) to feel the atmosphere in rural Virginia in the days of steam ..... Mick. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fay Posted June 7, 2015 Author Share Posted June 7, 2015 Thank you, I have one of O Winston Links books arriving some time this week with a few more on order plus some DVD's Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted June 7, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 7, 2015 Glad to see a transition-era US model for a change. Most of the US layouts we see on RMweb tend to be more modern. Until recently, brass models of less-popular prototypes were more expensive than many of us would consider reasonable, but the brass market in the US is in some decline, and you might pick up the odd bargain if you look carefully, e.g. on ebay.com. It would help if the £ were stronger against the dollar right now. Keep us posted on progress, please. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikjd Posted June 7, 2015 Share Posted June 7, 2015 Thank you, I have one of O Winston Links books arriving some time this week with a few more on order plus some DVD's I forgot to mention Morning Sun books, their Color Guide To Freight & Passenger Equipment is very useful, but mainly includes pictures from the 60's onwards, although many of the prototypes are earlier. They do other books on the N&W steam era, which if as good as their color guides should be very good. They are not cheap, and tend to go up in price if you're not careful, but good secondhand ones can be found in the UK (I just picked up both Chessie & N&W guides for the price of either new ). Mick. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted June 7, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 7, 2015 I've got both the Link books and they are superbly evocative and the main reason I've not patted with all my US steam stuff even though I don't have a layout big enough for 2-10-4's and Duplexs! The N&W A class is a superb model bought after watching the various videos and is be very tempted by 611, but then I'd need coaches too The Morning Sun books are a fantastic series if you find what you want then search around they do pop up at sensible prices. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikjd Posted June 7, 2015 Share Posted June 7, 2015 I've got both the Link books and they are superbly evocative and the main reason I've not patted with all my US steam stuff even though I don't have a layout big enough for 2-10-4's and Duplexs! The N&W A class is a superb model bought after watching the various videos and is be very tempted by 611, but then I'd need coaches too The Morning Sun books are a fantastic series if you find what you want then search around they do pop up at sensible prices. I don't wan't to worry you but I'm sure there are more than three books ...... Mick. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bigbee Line Posted June 7, 2015 Share Posted June 7, 2015 I borrowed a video once. It had clips of J's with two or three coaches. Quite exiting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fay Posted June 7, 2015 Author Share Posted June 7, 2015 Pocohontas glory volume 7 & pillars of smoke in the sky are both available in the UK to purchase so they are on the list. My last DVD player was multi region so buying direct from the states was no problem unfortunately my newer one isn't so Pal it has to be. Father's Day is also on the way and a nice O Winston link book is on that list. Plenty of reference material before I start any boards although I do have a good idea of what I want to model. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pointstaken Posted June 7, 2015 Share Posted June 7, 2015 Norfolk and Western always preferred to "roll their own", except of course when they bought mass produced diesels. I'm keeping my N gauge 'J' class out of sight. I didn't need it, but I liked it, so there ! Dennis 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allegheny1600 Posted June 7, 2015 Share Posted June 7, 2015 Hi Steve, It's interesting following this topic as I used to follow the Chesapeake and Ohio RR in just your era! I can't add much information to what has already been stated but I always found US railway DVD's to be region 0 so would play on any player anyway. Hope this helps, John E. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted June 7, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 7, 2015 I don't wan't to worry you but I'm sure there are more than three books ...... Mick. Oh yes but most are out of print, the two collection albums are still easily available. I've found several older books but the other two come up everywhere Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomMarkert Posted June 7, 2015 Share Posted June 7, 2015 (edited) N&W was always one of my favorites as their 1964 merger with the Nickel Plate brought them through my hometown. Another source of information you may consider would be an employee timetable from the era you are modeling. They are often available from various online dealers and of course, eBay. Not easy to come by, but they are out there... http://www.ebay.com/itm/N-W-Norfolk-Western-Railway-Co-Radford-Division-4-April-26-1953-/161726794278?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item25a7ab0a26 A book of rules may help with some signaling and operational questions...even with a later date, it would still be useful as rules were pretty much the same right up through the 1980s... http://www.ebay.com/itm/Norfolk-and-Western-Railway-Company-Operating-Rules-Eff-1-1-67-/221778432928?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item33a30653a0 Good luck with your venture. Tom Edited June 7, 2015 by TomMarkert 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian Wintle Posted June 7, 2015 Share Posted June 7, 2015 For scenery in colour, some of the newer DVDs would be useful - Pentrex's Along the Pocahontas District or Green Frog's Norfolk Southern Volume 4 - Tracks of the old N&W The Pocahontas Division Part 1 and Norfolk Southern Volume 5 - Tracks of the old N&W The Pocahontas Division Part 2. I got the last two as part of an 8-disc set Norfolk Southern Special. Also, there is the bible of Norfolk and Western coal cars - Norfolk and Western Coal Cars from 1881 to 1998 by Andrew Dow (TLC Publishing, 1998, ISBN 1-883089-36-0) Adrian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fay Posted June 7, 2015 Author Share Posted June 7, 2015 Thank you Adrian I have been Watching lots of Clips on YouTube of the Pocohontas division but some of those DVDs could come in handy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian Wintle Posted June 7, 2015 Share Posted June 7, 2015 Thank you Adrian I have been Watching lots of Clips on YouTube of the Pocohontas division but some of those DVDs could come in handy Also, the recent Morning Sun Appalacian... books are very good, although they've only done Virginia and Kentucky so far. The photos are a bit modern for your timeframe, but that doesn't affect the scenery. http://morningsunbooks.com/collections/all-hardcover/products/appalachian-coal-mines-rrs-in-color-vol-1 http://morningsunbooks.com/collections/all-hardcover/products/appalachian-coal-mines-rrs-in-color-vol-2 Adrian 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CraigZ Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 The N&W was iconoclastic...they did things THEIR way despite being heavily owned by the PRR. It can be argued that the N&W steam out of Roanoke Shops was the zenith of US steam locomotive design. As the Lima Locomotives salesman said when asked if he was calling on Roanoke, "What can we tell them about steam engines?" The blue (aka Pevlar Blue named for the company president) was a 1960s livery. In the steam/diesel transition the passenger Geeps were maroon, the freight diesels black with a couple of variations of yellow lettering. GP9s and RS-3s were what the N&W first bought heavily; they never bought an F unit new. RS-11s came later in the 1950s. Cabooses were indeed red...brass or I seem to recall Atlas? When you see the short trains with what looks like a J, be sure to look again; the N&W gave some of their 4-8-2s J-style streamlining...they saw a lot of service on local passenger trains. The model exists in brass. A stand in for an N&W steam shunter is the USRA 0-8-0 from Proto/Walthers. Great running model (look for the second run that had tender pick ups) and the N&W was building 0-8-0s based on the design until the very end of steam. Big huge export coal doc or Roanoke Schaffer's Crossing Yard shunters can be had with the Proto/Walthers USRA 2-8-8-2 Y3 models which, like the 0-8-0, are great runners. Class A, Y6 and J...Broadway Limited. Books - oh boy. The two Withers N&W diesel books are a must have. Jeffries' "N&W: Giant Of Steam" is superb. Richard Prince's N&W book, like all his books, doesn't have the 'diesel' word in it anyplace. Morning Sun's N&W color books are worth having. In West Virginia you're going to need a lot of coal hoppers...a LOT of hoppers N&W K class mountain One of the USRA-based 0-8-0 engines 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robatron86 Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 Interesting stuff Steve as a fellow '50's modeller. I really enjoyed your 7mm stuff on NRM, the level of detail and realism was really impressive, so I know this will be a good looking set up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian Wintle Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 (edited) The N&W was iconoclastic...they did things THEIR way despite being heavily owned by the PRR. I'm not sure why anyone would expect an entity owned by the PRR to not do things their own way - they were just following the example of 'The Standard Railroad of the World'* which liked to do things its own way (signals, locos, passenger cars, freight cars, communications, etc...). *PRR's catch phrase. I have the Withers second gen diesels book, which is quite good. It is a bit late for the period in question, though. Adrian Edited June 8, 2015 by Adrian Wintle Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fay Posted June 8, 2015 Author Share Posted June 8, 2015 (edited) Thank you all for your input. I'm awaiting delivery of my first 3 Freight Cars hopefully tomorrow. The first 6 hoppers are on order as a pack from Broadway limited, I will buy as many as I can get in the storage loop. I think I should really have one full loaded and a train of returning empties. Edited June 8, 2015 by steve fay Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikjd Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 Thank you all for your input. I'm awaiting delivery of my first 3 Freight Cars hopefully tomorrow. The first 6 hoppers are on order as a pack from Broadway limited, I will buy as many as I can get in the storage loop. I think I should really have one full loaded and a train of returning empties. I think I should really have one full loaded and a train of returning empties. At least ....... Says he who currently has NO hoppers for his N&W derived line, mind it is the Cincinnati Belt ........ Mick. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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