Turnout Construction

[hayfield]

I have built a turnout today using ply sleepers and C&L chairs and as there has been a couple of threads where some have said that they might try and build a turnout I thought I would take a few photos of each step. The same method of construction is used for both C&L timber tracks and using their plastic sleepers.

 

 

I use 2 strips of double sided tape about 1/8th wide to stick the sleepers to tracing paper, The use of a steel rule keeps the sleepers in line. You can see a crossing unit (yet to be cut to size) above the turnout.

 

 

The crossing is held in place with chairs at each end, I fit the half chairs later but they could be done now

 

 

The straight stock rail is fitted at each end, with gauges at the crossing end and by eye at the other end. Once the chairs are set I glue the rest using a steel rule to keep all straight. I have omitted 2 chairs where the check rail goes.

 

 

Second stock rail is fitted, using gauges at each end, using mk1 eyeball for the curved center.

 

 

I fit the straight switch rail next, the last 3 chairs have to be trimmed to fit next to ther stock rail. Note I have not fitted the last 3 slide chairs, these will be fitted after the tiebar has been soldered to the switch rails to prevent damage to them. The curved switch rail is fitted next.

 

 

Check rails are the next to be fitted, the 2 chairs have to be trimmed a little to allow them to be fitted close to the stock rails. The 3 1/2 chairs are fitted to the check rails, crossing and stock rails to complete. Only the tiebar to fitted.

 

I should have taken a photo of how I solder up the crossing, I will take a photo when I build the next one and add it to the thread. Hope this helps

[hayfield]

Here is a photo of a part finished common crossing

 

 

The V is soldered up in a simple jig, I then solder 2 pieces of brass shim to the V. A wing rail is soldered to one side and the other wing railis soldered to the other side I then solder 2 more bits of brass shim to the wing rails.

This is all done with gauges.

 

I then trim all the rails to size as per the plan after cutting back the brass shim and fileing them smooth

 

Hopes this helps

[signalmaintainer]

Yes, it does help! Thanks, John.

[hayfield]

A quick photo of the finished crossing, where the brass strips have been cut back and filed flat and the rails cut to length

 

 

This how I fix the crossing to the sleepers, one pair of chairs at one end and 3 pairs at the other. Once the solvent dries it is quite firm. I then cut chairs in half and glue them to the remaining sleepers and rail with solvent. This locks the crossing into place.

[craigwelsh]

Second stock rail is fitted, using gauges at each end, using mk1 eyeball for the curved center.

If radii was getting critical i'd recommend getting some railway curves for doing this sort of thing as it means you have a known radii. Laser cutting firms can make them quite easily and i've found them invaluable when trying out track building.

 

The only difference to your build I do is to start with the stock rail forming part of the main route and gauging the crossing off that. The reason for this is that the P+C i've been doing so far is part of a flowing formation and the stock rail had to be exact to fit into that. Note I say main route as it could be the straighter or the more diverging route..

[hayfield]

The only difference to your build I do is to start with the stock rail forming part of the main route and gauging the crossing off that. The reason for this is that the P+C i've been doing so far is part of a flowing formation and the stock rail had to be exact to fit into that. Note I say main route as it could be the straighter or the more diverging route..

 

Craig I used to do this but you must be carefull not go off center with this method (I ended up with a couple of lop sided turnouts)nothing wrong though with your method.

 

When building a formation of turnouts I set the V's first and gauge the stock rails off them, either way is as good as each other and you can get a lopsided turnout if not carefull using my method. I say my method but its been learnt form other members on this site.

[Weekday Cross]

Having built a lot of track in 2mm scale, I find starting with the straightest running rail by far the most reliable method.

 

Starting with the crossing nose is fraught with all sorts of hazards - not the least being that with only 20 or so mm length to play with it is incredibly easy to solder the assembly at the wrong angle. Gauging it off the stock rail means it will always be at the correct angle, unless you have been very careless with locating the stock rail.

[craigwelsh]

Craig I used to do this but you must be carefull not go off center with this method (I ended up with a couple of lop sided turnouts)nothing wrong though with your method.

 

When building a formation of turnouts I set the V's first and gauge the stock rails off them, either way is as good as each other and you can get a lopsided turnout if not carefull using my method.

Not sure what you mean by a lopsided turnout?

[brossard]

I built a bunch of Timber Tracks points about a year ago. I used the crossing assembly method detailed above. I got them to work but I found the end with the tiebar (heel?) to be pretty flimsy. There's not a lot of support, what with loose slide chairs and all (do you glue them to the stock rail?). I felt that the points wouldn't last (I was building the layout for a friend) so I ended up re-doing with copper clad. I will have another go with C&L plastic timbers, using copper clad at strategic locations, for my next layout.

 

John

[hayfield]

Not sure what you mean by a lopsided turnout?

 

 

Craig it was a longer length of sleeper outside the stock rail on one side than the other. I used a well known (I now know to be poor quality) plan, by laying the straight stock rail first then the V using gauges everything was moved over to one side a bit. OK it was the plans fault and mine for not spotting the error earlier, but I was new to building turnouts and accepted the plan as gospel. Had I fitted the V first this would have ballanced out the inaccuracy in the plan

[hayfield]

Having built a lot of track in 2mm scale, I find starting with the straightest running rail by far the most reliable method.

 

Starting with the crossing nose is fraught with all sorts of hazards - not the least being that with only 20 or so mm length to play with it is incredibly easy to solder the assembly at the wrong angle. Gauging it off the stock rail means it will always be at the correct angle, unless you have been very careless with locating the stock rail.

 

 

I accept what you you say, but by using a good quality plan and setting the point of the V and the 2 ends carefully in place its just as easy to line it up as starting with the V or crossing first. I make them on small building boards and can turn it around with ease and work on it from any angle

 

I know that there are 2 camps of thought, and each camp has good enough reasons for doing their way. In the end whichever way suits the way you build them is the best for you. I used to go along with the straight stock rail first, I now prefer doing it with the V/crossing first. The old saying measure twice and cut once, in this case view from every angle then glue.

[hayfield]

I built a bunch of Timber Tracks points about a year ago. I used the crossing assembly method detailed above. I got them to work but I found the end with the tiebar (heel?) to be pretty flimsy. There's not a lot of support, what with loose slide chairs and all (do you glue them to the stock rail?). I felt that the points wouldn't last (I was building the layout for a friend) so I ended up re-doing with copper clad. I will have another go with C&L plastic timbers, using copper clad at strategic locations, for my next layout.

 

John

 

John, I use the solvent to glue the slide chairs to both the sleeper and rail, once the track is in place they will all be held in place. On the curved stock rail then a slight tension in the curve will hold it against the chairs, with the straight stock rail make sure there is no slight bend in the rail which will push it away from the chairs. If you are worried just very slightly bend the rail so the tension holds it against the chairs.

 

Jim of this parish adds a couple of copperclad sleepers just to hold all in gauge, do this if you think its better.

[Siberian Snooper]

If radii was getting critical i'd recommend getting some railway curves for doing this sort of thing as it means you have a known radii. Laser cutting firms can make them quite easily and i've found them invaluable when trying out track building.

 

I notice that John is using Templot templates and therefore a fixed radius curve jig will not work as the curve in the turnout comprises of several radii especially in a regular crossing which has a short section of straight through the nose as per prototype.

 

Cheers SS

[3 link]

I notice that John is using Templot templates and therefore a fixed radius curve jig will not work as the curve in the turnout comprises of several radii especially in a regular crossing which has a short section of straight through the nose as per prototype.

 

Cheers SS

 

Hi SS,

 

You beat me to it, like you say every curved stock rail (prototype) has more than one radial measurement leading to the important straight section through the nose of the vee. B).

 

ATB, Martyn. P.S. Personally I prefer to use the straight stock rail as a datum point , although like Hayfield says there are more than one camp of thought on the subject.

[craigwelsh]

The maximum length of straight is about 80mm but that wouldn't be in any running lines where the straight bit seems to just be across the planing of the splice rail (GWR at least) as you can get away with using a curve. You can combine two curves if you need to if the track isn't a perfect combination of crossing and switches.

 

I put a picture of the curve I was using to 49" I think it was on the outside of the track here http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/blog/61/entry-5840-more-track-progress/ The radii of the switches on this one was slightly different but that is on the divergence.

 

Note the goods loop in that link where the tighter road to the right is the main with the headshunt diverging pretty much straight on. The splice rail is in the opposite position to where you normally expect it.

 

See what you mean about sleeping but I normally cut them down and make them look right after.

 

I think Templot is great but getting a whole formation to flow is more important than trying to build each bit by eye off the paper. Having a set curve you can work one rail too can help here and multiple curves can manage a transition I think.

 

The results are the most important though and I hope Hayfield's guide inspires others.

[hayfield]

Craig great bit of track building, like the spliced in rails on the V. Geoff at our club is building some turnouts the same way on our 0 gauge layout, he goes into a cold sweat seeing my V's. But then he takes 30 times plus longer in building them.

 

Totaly agree with you on the flow of the track both for looks and more importantly running qualities. Sometimes we get too hung up on certain things, look at old photos (before track laying machines) of trackwork, it was far from perfect with kinks and out of square sleepers etc.

[3 link]

I think Templot is great but getting a whole formation to flow is more important than trying to build each bit by eye off the paper.

 

 

 

Craig,

 

I don't know if you are familiar with Templot, but one of the main applications on Templot is to create "flowing" trackwork and turnouts, not just to design and print out templates.

 

Martyn.

[craigwelsh]

Craig,

 

I don't know if you are familiar with Templot, but one of the main applications on Templot is to create "flowing" trackwork and turnouts, not just to design and print out templates.

 

Martyn.

Yes I realise that but many people tend to chop up their plan and build each turnout elsewhere and that can lead to a 50p piece which is great in a siding but leads to odd looking running in 4mm or smaller if its supposed to be a fast line.

 

I know real track can be quite bad but generally not when its high speed mainline and also pictures can make it look worse due to the lens compression.

 

I've got a siding propped up with pit props to attempt in the colliery exchange sidings due to subsidence but you have to balance appearance with electrical pickup on an 0-4-0 Peckett in this case, the latter will be harder than the track though I think!

 

John I can certainly agree with taking a while, that bit still isn't finished as its a right faff fitting cosmetic chairs to ply and rivet! That was a proving exercise I wont repeat now i've proved I can do it .

[hayfield]

John I can certainly agree with taking a while, that bit still isn't finished as its a right faff fitting cosmetic chairs to ply and rivet! That was a proving exercise I wont repeat now i've proved I can do it .

 

Dont say it too loud, I started a thread about building with ply and rivet, I made the mistake in saying that I thought ply and chair was a better method after attempting to build some ply and rivet track. Well I realy upset a couple of folk.

 

I have all the gear, hole puncher/rivet compresser, rivets and sleepers. I have the feeling that I will only use the sleepers, but in the end I will build a fully rivited turnout in P4 just for the sake of building one. I noticed from your blog that you only rivet some of the sleepers, how did you chose which ones to rivet?

[craigwelsh]

I have all the gear, hole puncher/rivet compresser, rivets and sleepers. I have the feeling that I will only use the sleepers, but in the end I will build a fully rivited turnout in P4 just for the sake of building one. I noticed from your blog that you only rivet some of the sleepers, how did you chose which ones to rivet?

No all sleepers are riveted eventually but I just did enough to at the start to build the point on and filled the rest in after. It means the rivet positions can be a bit more accurate and less waste or grinding. I think trying to rivet every 5th sleeper or something is the worst method of the lot as your not completely constraining movement or allowing for expansion and just stressing the intermediate chairs.

 

The slide chairs are tricky though as trying to fit plastic ones around a rivet is hard work and can cause issues with the blade movement. I have some old Exactoscale etches and lost wax brass slide chairs I started fitting instead and they work well.

[James]

it was a longer length of sleeper outside the stock rail on one side than the other.

I've done that plenty of times!

 

On industrial S&C it's often very desirable as once the chair screws have been bashed about they're removed and the timber slid over so fresh holes can be drilled and thus lengthening the life of the timber.

 

I find starting with the straightest running rail by far the most reliable method.

If building a turnout in isolation this is the easiest method I think - the key thing is knowing exactly where the nose should be. And if it works in reality then for models it should be fine.

[hayfield]

The slide chairs are tricky though as trying to fit plastic ones around a rivet is hard work and can cause issues with the blade movement. I have some old Exactoscale etches and lost wax brass slide chairs I started fitting instead and they work well.

 

Could you just not rivet these and use the plastic slide chairs ?