sir douglas Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 Hi folks, im hoping that someone could advise on the arrangement for the braking system in my O gauge carraige. I've already tried different word combinations in google images but to no avail, all that i am sure about are the brake shoes and the hand wheel inside, at one end of the carraige, but for some reason i cant figure out how everything in between works inbetween. so could anybody help with this void in my mechanics? thank you. sir D. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
billbedford Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 It would help if we knew which carriage you were talking about. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 I think that we can deduce it is some kind of brake vehicle. Other than that you are on your own. Gis a clue mate, we aren't psychic! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium jamie92208 Posted October 20, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 20, 2011 Come down to the club on Friday evening Sam and I'll bring a couple fo coaches in, but it would help me pick the right one if you told me whether it's a bogi, 6 wheel or 4 wheel coach. Jamie Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wagonman Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 Come down to the club on Friday evening Sam and I'll bring a couple fo coaches in, but it would help me pick the right one if you told me whether it's a bogi, 6 wheel or 4 wheel coach. Jamie The principle is the same: a cross shaft operated upon primarily by the vacuum or westinghouse cylinder linkage and secondarily by the Guard's screw brake. Arms from this cross shaft were then linked to the yokes of the brakes on however many axles were braked (ie four for 4- and 6-wheeled stock, presumably eight for bogie stock). I'm sure there are several books (remember them?) around with this information. I seem to remember Russell Volume 1 had a detailed underframe drawing and there's probably one in Parkin's book on BR Mk.1s though it's a while since I've seen a copy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted October 21, 2011 Share Posted October 21, 2011 The principle is the same: a cross shaft operated upon primarily by the vacuum or westinghouse cylinder linkage and secondarily by the Guard's screw brake. Arms from this cross shaft were then linked to the yokes of the brakes on however many axles were braked (ie four for 4- and 6-wheeled stock, presumably eight for bogie stock). I'm sure there are several books (remember them?) around with this information. I seem to remember Russell Volume 1 had a detailed underframe drawing and there's probably one in Parkin's book on BR Mk.1s though it's a while since I've seen a copy. Bogie stock uses 8 bow girders, one for each pair of shoes, broadly speaking you want a crank from the power shaft. The cylinder arm lifts up, rotating the power shaft, so you need a crank from that shaft mounted in such a way that if the cylinder arm went up, the pull rod connected to the power shaft crank pulls away from the bogie it is braking. As a broad rule of thumb, clasp brakes (one shoe on either side of the wheel) use bow girders, whereas push brakes (shoe on one side of the wheel only) uses a push arm. Let me get you some photos. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted October 21, 2011 Share Posted October 21, 2011 Exhibit A - standard wagon brakes, comprising vacuum cylinder, power shaft and push arms for brake shoes. Exhibit B - Power shaft for clasp brakes, this is a single cylinder vehicle, for a bogie coach you would omit one of the pull rods Exhibit C - Pull rod from power shaft to reversing crank, also an illustration of a bow girder, they differ in style but are all roughly similar in shape, note also safety loops for catching the various parts should they become detached. Exhibit D - Detail of reversing crank, which uses the bow girder bolt as a pivot. You would probably have a second small actuator arm (from the primary pivot) to the second girder pair on a coach. On a OO gauge model, you can get away with a length of wire from the power shaft finishing somewhere near the bogie, and possibly a couple of pieces of wire on the outermost brake shoes to represent bow girders. On a brake vehicle, most of the extra handbrake linkage is quite hard to spot aside from a couple of odd bits, so you could probably get away without it. I hope this helps Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir douglas Posted October 21, 2011 Author Share Posted October 21, 2011 @ bilb & boris: the carraige that i'm building in my "other stuff" blog. @ jamie92208 : a four wheel carraige. @ boris's 2nd & 3rd post : its a mechanical brake that im looking for, i wont have any pipe connections for compressed air brake, but thanks for the pics anyway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted October 21, 2011 Share Posted October 21, 2011 Thanks for those pictures Boris. They will come in handy. I have a collection of Bob Essery's LMS and MR Wagon Drawings books which are invaluable for details like brake gear. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baby Deltic Posted October 21, 2011 Share Posted October 21, 2011 If its of any use, here's a link to some MK1 underframe pictures in my gallery:http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/gallery/album/740-mark-1-underframe-details/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted October 21, 2011 Share Posted October 21, 2011 The gods are smiling on me today. Many thanks BD for those pictures. I plan to upgrade a bunch of Bachmann Mk 1 Suburbans so these will be most useful. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted October 21, 2011 Share Posted October 21, 2011 @ bilb & boris: the carraige that i'm building in my "other stuff" blog. @ jamie92208 : a four wheel carraige. @ boris's 2nd & 3rd post : its a mechanical brake that im looking for, i wont have any pipe connections for compressed air brake, but thanks for the pics anyway. The principle is the same regardless whether it is air, vacuum or wind it on yourself. The screw on the handbrake replaces the automatic brake in providing the means of operating the brakes. I would put money on you finding something that works in a similar manner to that which I have detailed, in effect you are looking at the brake mechanism found on most goods brake vans. Because of what it is, this is probably the brake system your inspection saloon would have. A handbrake standard contains a long screw, when the brake wheel is turned a "nut" moves up the screw it produces a vertical pull lift which is then translated into a pull via a translating crank mounted somewhere underneath. Make it simple, bow girders for each pair of shoes, 2 pairs per wheel, something similar to that shown in picture 3 & 4. Add your safety loops and run your wire to a sensible looking point underneath the inspection saloon floor. Don't worry about modelling the underfloor crank system, just show the obvious stuff and you'll get away with it. Somewhere on here I have posted some pictures of the rigging on a 4 wheel LMS brake van, complete with pull rods etc to give you some ideas. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir douglas Posted October 25, 2011 Author Share Posted October 25, 2011 The principle is the same regardless whether it is air, vacuum or wind it on yourself. The screw on the handbrake replaces the automatic brake in providing the means of operating the brakes. I would put money on you finding something that works in a similar manner to that which I have detailed, in effect you are looking at the brake mechanism found on most goods brake vans. Because of what it is, this is probably the brake system your inspection saloon would have. A handbrake standard contains a long screw, when the brake wheel is turned a "nut" moves up the screw it produces a vertical pull lift which is then translated into a pull via a translating crank mounted somewhere underneath. Make it simple, bow girders for each pair of shoes, 2 pairs per wheel, something similar to that shown in picture 3 & 4. Add your safety loops and run your wire to a sensible looking point underneath the inspection saloon floor. Don't worry about modelling the underfloor crank system, just show the obvious stuff and you'll get away with it. Somewhere on here I have posted some pictures of the rigging on a 4 wheel LMS brake van, complete with pull rods etc to give you some ideas. thank you boris, thats the info i'm looking for, ill get started then. thank you to those who have posted, and jamie, ill come down this friday. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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