Old Gringo

Often my first choice for checking routes and locations on the old network and previously recommended by others on the Forum, British Railways Pre-Grouping Atlas and Gazetteer, published by Ian Allan, had two similar volumes with which to compare the situation pre-and-post the immediate effects of the Beeching Report. British Railways Sectional Maps, published by Ian Allan (1952), is a paperback book based on the Official Railway Clearing House maps and shows the position of the railway network at Nationalisation in December 1947. The scale of the maps is 7.5 miles to the Inch [ii] and the pages are overlaid with a grid of 10 mile squares. The dark green cover has 'Royal Scot' No. 6133, "The Green Howards" (in LMS black livery with British Railways lettered in full on the tender) and two pages of the North of Scotland were missing from the print run! This paperback was reprinted by Ian Allan in 1981 and this edition has all the pages included, plus a very bright cover of yellow, red and green horizontal bands: ISBN 7110-1156-7 (£2.95 in 1981). The Sectional Maps of British Railways, was also republished by Ian Allan in 1967. However, this version was comb-bound using cheap white plastic binding; and uses the Pre-Grouping Atlas map layout, but with a scale of 8 miles to the inch, again overlaid with a ten-mile grid. Each page shows the railways of the area all displayed in the Six B.R. regional colours, with all the closed lines shown in yellow - "portraying the situation as existing in the Spring of 1966". The cover has a posterized view of an Electric locomotive No.3097 on service IM91. The 1967 book is therefore a direct comparison of the railways of 1922 to those of 1966 and when used in conjunction with a copy of map 9A (shown in Apollo's post 42) the immediate effects of the Beeching Report can be seen. Of course the route casualties begun by the Beeching Report didn't stop in 1967! many editions produced from 1958 [ii] matching the original RCH scale of the folding maps.

D, whilst the layout is paused, you might like to look out for this new book (?) - which I spotted on a stand at Burton Railway Collectors' Fair earlier today. James Hudson (the late Bill's son) said it had only just been published and had it not been £45 I might have bought one! The Lynton & Barnstaple Railway - A Celebration, by Tony Nicholson, 2017, Crecy Publishing: a landscape format album (I'm guessing 11.5" x 8.5") with some good full page photographs. All the best, John. P.S. James (Bill Hudson Transport Books) is based at Matlock Station and supports many model exhibitions.

"At Sandon, both the style and quality of the structure in general and the extravagance of a porte-cochère in particular may be ascribed to the wish to please an, unnamed "local magnate" and North Staffs shareholder mentioned in Railway Architecture". - post 6064. Following on from the above, I found a quote in 'Britain's Historic Railway Buildings' by OPC. On page 325, Gordon Biddle says: "Approached by an avenue of trees from the entrance of the Earl of Harrowby's seat at Sandon Park, the building reflects the style of the twin gate lodges . . . . and most notably a two-storey porte cochere for the convenience of the Earl." Built in 1848/49 and to a design believed to be by the architect Henry Hunt, Sandon station has been fully restored since the photograph on the rear of Binney and Pearce's book, and is now a private house. A lovely building and makes a fine model too.

Although getting away from the current discussion regarding track, here's something connected to the history of part of the Midland & Great Northern Railway and its infrastructure. I have just obtained a copy of a book about a section of the M. & G.N.R. and I'm sure that I discovered the title somewhere here on RMweb. Was it mentioned in this topic, perhaps? If so, apologies, but IMO well worth a look at and hence the (overlong!) post. Purchased through an Amazon connection (Books etc., 8 Kings Road, Fleet, Hampshire, GU51 3AD) "Building a Railway, Bourne to Saxby", Edited by Stewart Squires and Ken Hollanby (including a reprint of Bourne to Saxby, by John Rhodes) was published in 2009 for the Lincoln Record Society, by Boydell & Brewer Ltd., Woodbridge, Suffolk. Measuring 13" by 9.5" and containing 152 pages, ISBN 978-0-9015038-62, it is a hard-backed volume with a selection of black & white, sepia and colour images. The dust-flap says: "Charles Stansfield Wilson (1844 - 1893) was the engineer who supervised the civil works on the railway line from Bourne to Saxby. A keen amateur photographer, he took a series of photographs during the construction phase of the line between 1890 and 1893, 72 of which were mounted in an album: this is a priceless survival indeed, as photographs of the construction of a railway in Victorian England are extremely rare. "This volume presents a selection (64) of these illustrations accompanied by full and extensive captions which tell the story of the construction and detail the work of the men and machines involved. There are pictures of the various stages of construction, of temporary and permanent engineering structures and of the locomotives themselves. "The volume also includes other contemporary photographs of the Wilson family; colour photographs of what can be seen today; explanatory text describing their significance in railway and social history; a biography of Wilson; a history of the line and its construction and a new edition of the John Rhodes' 1989 history of the line; plus a select bibliography". Although a not overlong work, it is very well produced and AFAIK besides "The Making of a Railway", by L.T.C. Rolt, 1971, (using the photographs taken by S.W.A. Newton - the Newton collection is currently held by Leicester Museums), I cannot recall another volume with this number of images of the Victorian railway under construction. Newton did for the Great Central Railway (London extension) what J.C. Bourne did for the London & Birmingham Railway and later the Great Western Railway, but, of course Bourne did it with engravings from pencil drawings. Anyway, I found the Bourne to Saxby book rather good and maybe relevant to your eclectic interests James. All the best, John. NB: I have no connection with any of the persons, or companies mentioned.

As I posted before, the book recommended by Theheretic (in post 3) and now by the Duke, British Railways Pre-Grouping Atlas and Gazetteer, published by Ian Allan, has always been my own first choice to look up any location in England, Wales & Scotland and to trace back its origins. If you decide to purchase a copy, try to get one with a spiral binding it's so much better to use and with care will last a lifetime. However, if you want to compare, the before and after results of Britain's first 'Corporate Raider', Beeching, then there's nothing better than laying two single sheet maps side by side. And it's possible to do this with a couple of maps, one of which was reprinted as recently as 2005. The British Rail Passenger Network, as at 4th September 1967, yet another version of B.R. 86601, size 16.5" x 24", published by British Railways Board and printed by George Philip Ltd. Branded with the 'barbed wire' symbol, and at an approximate scale of 30 miles to One inch, the remaining railways are shown in red on a white ground surrounded by a pink sea. This network is what was left immediately after Beeching's return to ICI, but still has the Waverley route and several other lines yet to become history! Stretch out next to it one of the earlier versions from the 1949 Holiday Guide and see what we lost in 20 years, or use the P/60 version for just the span of Beeching and Marples. For a much longer timespan and to appreciate what has been closed since the railways were at their peak, there are a lot more alternatives and some reprints from around 2005, published by a company in Devon, Old House Books, Moretonhampstead. The first and (IMO) the most useful is Grouping System Railway Map of the British Isles 1923. This map is based on the excellent Philips version of the RCH maps, combining The RCH small England, Wales & Scotland with the Ireland map on a single sheet measuring 33.5" x 27" and using a scale of approximately 22 miles to the Inch. The 23 major E.W. & S. pre-1923-grouping companies' systems are shown in colour plus the 6 main Irish companies and because it's a bit crowded in some areas, detail maps displayed around the edge, using parts of the old RCH district maps (e.g. London, Edinburgh & Glasgow, Lancashire & Yorkshire Manufacturing Districts, etc.). The map I believe was used by Old House Books was originally designed and published by George Philip & Son, Fleet Street, London (probably?) during the early 1930s, using the title Philips' Railway Map of the British Isles, showing the Grouping System. Early copies up to 1938 have only a plain Green card cover and I've not found a date on them. However, my copy is copyright 1945 and has an illustration of the fabulous LMSR 'Coronation Scot' on the cover card. The Philips' Map is slightly larger at 40" x 31" (ii) with a scale of 18 miles to the Inch and is therefore a clearer copy than the reprinted version by Old House Books. They turn up at second-hand fairs, rarely in fine condition but a superb single-sheet reference. The second single sheet (perhaps worth a look at ) has again had a version reprinted by Old House Books and is 'Bradshaw's Railway Map of Great Britain & Ireland, 1907. This map was first published as a fold-out in the back of Bradshaw's Railway Guide. Why they would pick 1907, rather than 1922 edition that David & Charles reprinted in 1985, or perhaps that was the reason? (iii) That reservation said, the Old House version size 34" x 24" is well laid out and much easier to read., with black railways on a cream ground at a scale of approx. 20 miles to the Inch. But ,obviously, it doesn't show the system as fully developed as it was at The Grouping of 1922/23 as the Philips version and the Pre-Grouping Atlas will. As before, I hope some of this helps you in your research into the railway network of the British Isles. All the best, John. (i) Ran to at least 8 editions, so should be easy to find. (ii) not 42" x 33" as advertised on the cover, but there was a cloth version at Six shillings and one mounted on rollers too for 9s 6d! (iii) Bradshaw's July 1922 Railway Guide, 1166 pages, republished by David & Charles, 1985 and also Guild Publishing for Book Club Associates. The definitive book for the final year of pre-Grouping railways' services, with a 30" x20" fold-out map in the back.

Apologies for my over-long post last night, which attempted provide some alternatives, following on from the previous answers and also add a little background to the history of railway maps. However, it's back to school for me, as it does help to answer a question, if you read it properly and Deonyi asked, "Is there any BR pre-Beeching map of the entire railway network anywhere? I thought the Handbook of Stations might have had one but it seems not". And the simple answer is - there are several comprehensive Single-sheet maps, which cover the entire railway network, pre-Beeching. Here's a few examples: A British Railways system map as at Nationalisation. Published by British Railways in 1948 and printed by W.&K. Johnston Ltd. Size 24" x 15", Scale approximately 1:2,000,000 (57 miles to 2 inches). This is a beautiful map containing all the lines in England, Wales & Scotland, with a portion of Ireland (split North to South, from Londonderry to Waterford). White land areas are set in a pale blue sea, with red railways in E.W. & S. and black railway lines in Ireland. It folds out from the back of the 'British Railways Holiday Guide' 1949 edition - Western Region. One of a series of paperback books (5.5" x 8.5") priced at One Shilling and containing information on the areas served by the region (in this case the ex-GWR including the Channel Islands and running to 572 pages!). This series of books was published throughout the 1950s and had been 're-organised' certainly by 1952 into five regional volumes, all around 250 pages. The 1952 Holiday Guide for Area 1: Scotland has a similar British Railways system fold-out map at the back. However, the map is now published by the Railway Executive, 1950, printed on cheaper paper by a firm in Nottingham and the design reduced to a grey sea but still with red railways in E.W. & S.! Same size, same scale, not so attractive, but just as useful for viewing the whole network on one sheet of paper. This version of British Railways network map does turn up as a single sheet at book-fairs and I have a later reprint dated 1958; this time published by British Transport Commission, Ref: BR 86601. It is almost the same as the 1950 edition, with E.W. & S, plus 50% of Ireland and similar colours, but just a few routes are now missing in the Scottish borders, the Highlands and no doubt obscure places in England and Wales, if I spent a couple of hours looking! The flip-side of this BR 86601 edition has a full map of Scotland, but with no scale bar. Perhaps, it was printed for handing out in the Scottish region? This 24" x 15" system map was redesigned and reprinted again in 1960 by the British Transport Commission, with a new ref: P/60. Printed in Great Britain by Waterlow & Sons Ltd. There is a change in presentation with straight lines for the railway routes between stations. The diagram is presented on a greenish land set in a bright blue sea, with brown railways. The same section of Ireland appears on the left, however Northern Ireland has the same ground colour as E.W. & S. A few more railways have disappeared, most obvious is the Midland & Great Northern system closed in 1959. Again, it is a single-sheet and was probably a leaflet, or insert to be used with promotional material. All these books and maps are out there at the Book-fairs in Britain and probably, either somewhere on e-bay, or book dealers' sites on the internet. Hope some of this was also interesting and proves useful. All the best, John.

Returning to the question posted by Deonyi yesterday, "Is there any BR pre-Beeching map of the entire railway network anywhere?" and the Handbook of Stations, etc. Although it would appear that a good range of maps and atlases have already been suggested, I would like to add a few numbers to the debate and add a couple of alternatives to the list of maps and atlases. The railway network in the British Isles is probably the best served in the World (i) and there are many maps available of the network from inception around 1830 to the peak year of 1926. Various sources suggest figures in excess of 20,250 (i) route miles for England, Scotland and Wales and well over 3,500 miles (ii) for Ireland, and a total track mileage well in excess of 50,000 miles. However, how many thousands of miles of privately-owned industrial railways there have been on these islands is (afaik) unknown, but I would hazard a guess at a minimum of at the least 25,000 miles, as they crop up so frequently on Ordnance Survey Maps (iii). And here's the rub, although railway enthusiasts and historians have been spoiled with a plethora of railway maps and atlases, few have been related to, or use the Ordnance Survey's 'professional' scales. Although there are many early railway maps, including Bradshaws, most maps showing the Pre-(1923)-Grouping railway companies are based on the data from the RCH series of maps scaled at 2.25 or 7.5 miles to the imperial Inch. The RCH 'Official' Railway Maps were those prepared and published for the Railway Clearing House (1842 - 1963), which not only show the pre-or-post grouping railway companies, but also the major industrial railways feeding into the network. All the district and junction RCH maps have the distances between stations and depots marked in miles and chains, so that the clerks could work out rates and charges [e.g. between Abattoir Co.'s siding, Yorkshire and Ystrad, South Junction, Glamorgan: the first and last entries in the RCH Handbook of 1904, reprinted by David & Charles, 1970 (iv)]. Over the years Ian Allan has reprinted several of the RCH maps and in post 4, Theheretic recommends the British Railways Pre-Grouping Atlas and Gazetteer: first published in 1958 and running to at least five editions. My well-used copy is a fifth edition from 1976: a handy, ring-bound, 10" x 7" volume, with maps at a scale of approximately 8 miles to the inch. It is based upon the RCH, England & Wales small edition (1922?) and Scotland map of similar date, with six of the regional district editions also included (of London and the most industrialised areas). I still find it one of the best buys of the last forty years! Theheretic also recommends the Maps available on-line from the National Library of Scotland, another superb and free resource. RCH maps (v) provided the basis for the books by Alan Jowett'; 'Jowett's Railway Atlas of Great Britain & Ireland', [first published in 1989 by Patrick Stephens Ltd.], being the most well-known and IMO the best book of its type. Although Alan superimposed the National Grid over his artworks, he didn't use a consistent O/S scale and therefore it's difficult to give a grid reference and refer back to an Ordnance Survey map to get an idea where the railway exactly was. Otherwise the book is very well produced and a mine of useful information, with tunnels, viaducts and engine sheds included. Highly recommended. A different approach was being taken by Colonel Michael Cobb (1916-2010) in a volume which IMO is the Rolls-Royce of Railway Maps: 'The Railways of Great Britain, An Historical Atlas'. The two volumes are contained in a slip case and were first published in 2003, by Ian Allan. These maps are the result of Cobb's 30-year quest to combine historical data of the railways onto the underlying Ordnance Survey information into a series of maps - all of which were produced to a consistent O/S Scale (One inch to One mile, the precursor to the current 1:50,000 series). This results in maps which can be compared to the underlying geography and also contain all the data (e.g ownership and opening and closure dates) of all the railways that have operated during the last 200 years. Plus, you can trace the industrial connections to every colliery, canal basin and factory. IMO, it is the most useful volume ever produced for anyone interested in railway history, but it comes with a couple of proviso's: It's very expensive and suffers from not being either split into three books, or given a ring binding, or both production remedies, as the binding of the England and Wales volume is susceptible to disintegrate from excessive stress. Also IMO, it is a shame that Michael Cobb used a set of 1970 'Ordnance Survey One-inch' editions as the base undermap, rather than perhaps a 1960 set . And finally, what a shame it doesn't include the railway network of Ireland, which for 90 years of development was part of the total railway investment and subsequent network. Although you can do so much of this on the internet now with RailMaps (see post 3), it's so much better and lots more fun to look at a book! Hope some of this was interesting and proved useful! All the best, John. (i) The Oxford Companion to British Railway History, O.U.Press, 1997, says, "Railway maps in G.B. reflect its position as the best mapped country in the World", p312 and suggests a maximum of 20,267 route miles, p497. (ii) The Railway Year Book of 1919 has a figure of 23,718 for the total route mileage of the railways of the British Isles. (iii) Alan Godfrey reprints of early maps are a good starting point for industrial studies. (iv) The RCH Handbook was produced from 1867 to 1956 and contains information on every station and goods depot, services available, crane sizes, etc. (v) Begun by Zachary Macaulay in 1851, these were expanded and improved by John Airey to cover the whole of the British Isles and the business was purchased by the RCH in 1895. Sets are held in the Brunel University and P.R.O. at Kew and single maps appear occasionally at Book-fairs and Auctions.

Glad that you've found it useful, Garry and that Chris has too. Thank you also 'Johnster' for your very complimentary comment. A couple of other items that it may be worth considering when you start the build: From the photograph, it looks like the roadway over the bridge is on a gradient and these were determined (edit: /consolidated) by the Railway Clauses Act of 1845. IIRC, if it's a public road, it shouldn't be more than 1 in 20 and if it was a turnpike 1 in 30. This may help you determine the angle of the string course above the brick arch. There are minimum widths connected with the importance of the road, but hopefully you can measure that on a site visit. You mention that the line was built to the broad gauge, in which case the height between the top of the rail and the underside of the arch may well be more than those on the 'standard gauge' Stephenson-engineered lines. Again, IIRC, Brunel not only built the first broad gauge routes wider across the total road-bed than the 'waggonway gauge', but also gave a greater headway for the railway bridges crossing over the line. This dimension also depends of course on how accurate you want to be. There's a topic somewhere on RMweb with a lot of the 'standard' B.R. dimensions, which will give you the minimum clearances used (edit: and they've been published from time to time in many of the modelling magazines). However, IMO there is no substitute for a tape measure, or laser-jobbie! All the very best with the build, John.

It is unfortunate that of the remaining Britannia Class Pacifics in the autumn of 1966, 70004 wasn't selected for that famous last overhaul and repaint, rather than 'lucky' 70013. There are a couple of reasons for making this (possibly) controversial statement, over fifty years after the fact, but here we go: 70004, 'William Shakespeare', was out-shopped from Crewe in March 1951 with an exhibition finish (polished cylinder covers, wheel rims, etc.) and was despatched directly to London, to become an exhibit at the South Bank site of the Festival of Britain. Following the exhibition duties, the locomotive went to Stewarts Lane shed in September, to be joined by 70014, 'Iron Duke'. Both locomotives then worked from Stewarts Lane shed for seven years, and were kept in immaculate condition to work the prestigious 'Golden Arrow' express (London Victoria to Dover and then Paris). With approximate average mileages of only 25,000 miles for the first two years and 30,000 for the next four years of their lives, even by 1960, both 70004 and 70014 had total mileages far less than all the other members of the class, excepting the Scottish members of the last batch built in 1954. (RCTS Vol. 1: p83 and p127). The RCTS also state that no Britannia achieved one million miles in B.R. service and it is estimated that these two locomotives may have only done half of the total mileage of 70013 (given as possibly 900,000 miles, as this was one of the Brits allocated to the G.E. section and intensively used right from the beginning of its B.R. career). Later 70004 was one of five Britannias that were allocated to Stockport Edgeley depot (9B) during 1965 and 1966 ( the others being 70015, 70021, 70026 and 70044) and IIRC according to a couple of drivers, 70004 was the best of the lot. Both 70044 and 70026 were withdrawn from Stockport shed, (44 - 10/66, 26 - 01/67) , with 70004, 70015 and 70021 all transferring to Carlisle Kingmoor (12A) in the summer of 1967. All three went into store for a couple of months upon arrival at Carlisle and all three were withdrawn on the 30th December, when Kingmoor was closed to steam. So, there it is, 70004* hardly used and in near perfect condition - and kept quite clean by Stockport's lads during the World Cup year of 1966. What a waste! It is also unfortunate that my Avatar photo is taken on 70024 'Vulcan' at Speke Junction, rather than 70004 at Edgeley, but the sun was never shining when I climbed in its cab! Great Memories, John. *following the Darlington shopping and repair to a minor collision, out-shopped February 1965; RCTS p128 as Eddie has already pointed out.

Here's a bridge that I built some years ago using SE Finecast sheets with an arch similar to that in your photograph. Between the banter in the topic you can see another way of building a bridge from scratch! http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/64502-black-country-blues-old-gringo-does-a-bridge-and-tunnel/?p=913421 I would be tempted to check how much the height of the path has been changed since the railway has been removed before starting to build, as IMO the arch looks low. Hope this helps, All the best, John.

Emerged from Crewe Works on 2nd February 1967, after major overhaul. (Information from "Oliver Cromwell and B.R. Standard Pacific Locomotives" by Robert Adamson, a Famous British Locomotives paperback by Friends of the NRM, 2007, ISBN 0-9546685-7-X)

Having been a 'lurker' on this topic ever since the start and enjoyed all the discussions, superb modelling and the unusual diversions, I have at last found an entry upon which I can add a (possibly) worthwhile contribution to. That is not just any old Spad pictured in post 5682. Spotting the mark of the "Hat in the Ring" (94th, U.S. Aero) Squadron on the fuselage, it had me checking to see if it was the Spad X111 of American Ace, Eddie Rickenbacker - and it is the plane in which he made many of his 26 confirmed victories between April and October 1918. A mechanic and racing driver before WW1, Rickenbacker first flew the Spad in June, when the 94th was equipped with these excellent machines and he would return to the U.S.A. a national hero. "He had two loves, automobiles and aircraft, and he split his subsequent career between the two; launching the Rickenbacker Motor Company in 1921, but later joining General Motors in 1928 and then Eastern Airlines in 1935". (Information from "Aces and Aircraft of World War 1", Christopher Campbell, 1981, p133>) Hope you don't mind the intrusion and yet another diversion on your entertaining topic. Every success with the layout. John.

Happy to be able to help, lanchester, and use all these flippin' books! I'm guessing that the maps you've acquired are from the Alan Godfrey series; Cheshire Sheet 36.08, Macclesfield North 1907 and Cheshire Sheet 36.12, Macclesfield South 1897 The notes on the back of the maps, by Chris Makepeace, are an excellent starting point for further research of the area. The difference in the layout of the goods yards reflects the changes in the importance and the operation of the railways in the two decades between their construction in Macclesfield (Hibel Road, mid-1840s, MB&M, mid 1860s). In that twenty year period, the railway system matured and developed extensively and moved from innovative, bold new 'upstart' to basic necessity of every modern Victorian town. Hence more land was acquired and better unloading practices employed, etc. A contemporary comparison would be the rise of the supermarket to superstore, through the 1980s and 1990s. Your comment regarding Sedbergh and Ingleton in particular is yet another example of the complicated history behind the railway network that once covered the British Isles. The majority of the system was built by entrepreneurs and businessmen in the era of 'laissez faire' government, free from regulation or controls until made necessary by financial crisis or mismanagement, or disasters with fatal consequences and public outcry. Of course once it was constructed, the (transport) monopoly created by the railway network and associated industry helped to change society in so many ways not fully appreciated. However, like all monopolies it also helped to destroy itself and by the time Government took an active interest it was too late to turn the clock back. Macclesfield is one of the numerous towns in England where the railway is a pale shadow of the former system which existed just over 50 years ago. Oddly, 1967 was the year when the first electric-powered express trains were introduced from Macclesfield to London Euston, reducing the travelling time to the capital city, just at the time the decline of the railway network really took hold. More difficult to shut down once it's got wires (but not impossible, just look at GCR route to Sheffield!!). All the best, John.

Following on from the earlier post, regarding the banking of trains up and over Macclesfield Moss on the Manchester to Stoke route (ex-L&NWR / NSR), here's a few additional notes, regarding Macclesfield's railway history. Although it's true that during the early years of the two companies, relationships between the huge London & North Western Railway and the 'small octopus' of the North Staffordshire Railway were fractious, they were "consolidated on a friendly basis by an Act of August 1859". A further agreement, consolidated by an Act of July 1867, "gave the L&NWR running powers over the whole of the NSR, in return for NSR running powers over routes to Birmingham, Wolverhampton, Liverpool and Manchester. The L&NWR historian, Wilfred Steel described the agreement as an excellent one for both parties". (ref: The North Staffordshire Railway, R. Christiansen & R. Miller, David & Charles, 1971, p60). Therefore the extensive running powers (from the Act of 1867) allowed the NSR to run "its own passenger and goods trains over the L&NWR from Manchester, through Stockport, to Macclesfield, etc.. . . and for many years the NSR stationed both a goods and a passenger locomotive at the L&NWR's Longsight shed", situated just to the south of the London Road Terminus. (ref: Locomotive and Train working in the 19th Century, Ahrons [1915-1925] published by Heffer, 1951, p144). From these snippets, we can deduce that as the stock for the London-bound expresses became heavier during the last decade of the 19th Century and banking would have been required over the two miles of 1 in 102 and half mile of 1 in 146 to Macclesfield Moss summit (Manifold, p145). From the available photographs, the practice was continued up until at least 1957 and possibly right up to the closure of Macclesfield shed in July 1961, when the remaining allocation of Fowler class 4 / 2-6-4Ts were transferred, or withdrawn. List of references over the two posts: 1. An Illustrated Historical Survey of ManchesterLondon Road Station, by John Hooper, Challenger Publications, 1995 - page 30. 2. Railways of Macclesfield, by Basil Jeuda, Foxline, 1995 - page 5. 3. Railways of the Macclesfield District, by Basil Jeuda, Wyvern Press, 1984 - page 58. 4. The North Staffordshire Railway in LMS Days' Volume One, by Basil Jeuda, Lightmoor Press, 2010 - pages 37 and 38. 5. The North Staffordshire Railway, by Manifold, Henstock, 1952. Gradient profile, p145. 6. The North Staffordshire Railway, by Christiansen & Miller, David & Charles, 1971, p60. 7. Locomotive and Train Working in the 19th Century, E.L. Ahrons, Heffer, 1951., p144.

Lanchester asks, "Due to the gradient, London-bound trains leaving Macclesfield from the town's other station, Hibel Road, in the age of steam, usually had a banking engine to assist them to the top of the Moss" (which was over a mile or so south of Macclesfield Central, the current station). Anyone know anything ? As a 'once upon a time' local to the Macclesfield area, I have a few books on the railways of north-east Cheshire and have found the following regarding banking on the section of line south of Macclesfield. First, a note regarding the line through Macclesfield: From Macclesfield Hibel Road station (L&NWR, with NSR running powers) through Macc. Central (NSR, with MB&M powers) to Macclesfield Moss signal box there was a gradient of 1 in 102 for approximately two miles. The main line ran from Manchester to Stoke, then Colwich and London. However, the section through Macc. Central, (now the site of the present Macclesfield station), was near level (edit: actually 1 in 440). Central was where the MB&M, (Macclesfield, Bollington & Marple Railway, a joint venture by the North Staffordshire Railway and the Great Central Railway) joined the main line, having first made a detour around the gas-works! Before the Grouping, relationships between the L&NWR and the NSR regarding the working of trains from Manchester to Stoke and London were quite cordial. "London trains were often powered by NSR locomotives from Manchester (London Road, now Piccadilly) to Stoke, where the NSR locomotive would be exchanged for a L&NWR engine". (ref: p30, An Illustrated Historical Survey of Manchester London Road Station, by John Hooper, Challenger Publications, 1995) The picture is around 1910 and there are several other instances of NSR locomotives at the head of expresses at London Road. Apparently, the heaviest London bound expresses (the 8:50am ex-Manchester and the one timed around lunchtime) often required banking from Macclesfield Hibel Road station to the summit of Macclesfield Moss. No stop was required at Macclesfield Central; if you wanted 'the London', you walked to Hibel Road! Basil Jeuda says (p5, Railways of Macclesfield, Foxline, 1995), "Two NSR D Class 0-6-0T locomotives were shedded at Macclesfield (between 1914 and 1918) engaged on shunting duties and providing banking assistance on the 1 in 102 climb to Macclesfield Moss". Later in LMSR days the Fowler and Stanier 2-6-4Ts and 2-6-2Ts could be found on these duties. " Fowler 2-6-4T, No. 42369 is pictured beside Macclesfield. Moss signal box, after banking a Euston express in 1957" (p58, Railways of the Macclesfield District, by Basil Jeuda, Wyvern Press, 1984). Macc. Moss box closed on 19th March 1965. Two more photographs of London-bound trains being banked through Macclesfield in LMS days appear in 'The North Staffordshire Railway in LMS Days', Volume One, by Basil Jeuda, Lightmoor Press, 2010. On p37, Stanier 2-6-2T, No. 77 is banking on 21st September 1938 and on p38, Circa 1947, a London & North Western Railway, Prince of Wales, 4-6-0 hauling a Manchester to Stafford train. In both cases the trains are hammering through the middle road at Central. Quite how the banking assistance worked in practice is guesswork, as the exit from the engine shed was so close to the tunnel at the throat of Hibel Road station. However, the Up (south-bound) platform extended a long way underneath Hibel Road and alongside the coal-yard / gas-works sidings, so attaching the banker immediately in front of the signal box beside the tunnel mouth would be possible. As the NSR and LNWR were working together, a path back through Central station could be easily arranged, especially so as four lines passed through the station, until the rebuilding by British Railways in the early 1960s. The Bollington line (MB&M) left Central almost on the level around a very tight, check-railed, curve to pass behind the gas-works. The track was perched on a viaduct built over the River Bollin. Motive power for the trains on the MB&M was supplied by the Great Central, later LNER, and until just before WW2 serviced at another engine shed located in the MB&M sidings complex. The whole site has long since been covered by tarmac and tin sheds! It would be interesting to discover how the LNWR / NSR / GCR and later LMSR / LNER worked the goods traffic in Macclesfield and how they co-operated with each other, as (IMO) the MB&M yard was a far better layout than the LNWR depot, which had the added complication of the tunnel and the gas-works sidings. Hope some of this helps to answer some of your questions. All the best, John.

I like the trays idea a lot. I've got one with crisps and a dip and a glass of red wine on right at the moment! All the very best, Johnny prepared.

Hi Mark, 'Which engine shed would have provided locomotives for the services at Willenhall Stafford Street under the LMS?' Here's a few possibilities: The station at Willenhall, on the Midland Railway's branch from Walsall (Ryecroft Junction) to Wolverhampton, was opened to passenger traffic on 1st November 1872. This station began as Willenhall Market Place, to distinguish it from the London & North Western Railway's station, which had been opened in July 1837 (which was also renamed Willenhall Bridge in 1872). Willenhall Market Place would be renamed twice more before its early closure by the LM&SR on 5th January 1931. First it became Willenhall Midland in 1904 and then Willenhall Stafford Street from June 1924 until closure. Most of Willenhall Stafford Street's trains would pass through both North Walsall and Ryecroft Junctions and the locomotives for its local services would have been duties handled by the Midland Railway's engine shed at Walsall, Pleck East Junction. This three-road shed was opened in 1880, designed to accommodate 12 locomotives and a sub-shed of Saltley shed. See photographs on page 246 of LMS Engine Sheds, Volume 2, Hawkins & Reeve, published by Wild Swan, 1981: ISBN 0-906867-05-3. "The 1892 allocation at Pleck shed included six 0-4-4 passenger tanks and four 0-6-0 locomotives". However, soon after the Grouping of 1923, rationalisation of engine sheds began to take place and Pleck shed was closed. Its duties passed to the ex-LNWR shed at Walsall, Ryecroft on 2nd September 1925 and fourteen locomotives were transferred to the twelve-road shed situated in the fork of Ryecroft Junction and which was built in the standard LNWR 'north-light' pattern in 1878. See pages 215/216 of LMS Engine Sheds, Volume 1, Hawkins & Reeve, Wild Swan, 1981: ISBN 0-906867-02-9. Later, Ryecroft would become a sub-shed of the well-known Bescot depot, constructed in 1892. However at the period when Willenhall Stafford Street station was open, it is more likely that all local services were duties of Pleck and then later Ryecroft sheds. Other services coming over the Midland route from Castle Bromwich direct to Wolverhampton would probably be Saltley diagrams. Surprisingly, following closure, Pleck shed was used for many years for stock storage purposes and the building survived well into the late 1960s. Just over the bridge from the shed was the famous Jupiter Cafe, serving superb bacon sandwiches. Walsall, Ryecroft shed had a chequered history, with modern coal and ash apparatus installed in 1937 and a new roof planned as early as 1948. However in 1955, after a succession of revisions Ryecroft would be one of the first sheds to be chosen for dieselization and was converted into a diesel only servicing depot by June 1958. Diesel shunters and railcars took over duties and the coaling plant was demolished. (The remaining steam locomotives had been transferred to Bescot and Aston sheds). But, Ryecroft was situated in the wrong place at the wrong time and was closed in the early 1970s. Hope some of this helps, All the best, John.

Chris, What make of brick is it? It looks like a modern type? When was the track-bed converted into the Camel Trail? Is it possible that the bridge was "made safe" for the new use of the track-bed? Edit: Does it matter? If you like it, build it how you like it.

Hope you are all having a great time up there and that lots of visitors are enjoying the exhibition. Sorry I can't make it this year (it's flippin' Gnosall Festival weekend!). Please post some photographs if you get chance, especially some of the cakes! All the very best, John.

S/S; Regarding the ballasting this link http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/28781-treneglos-the-ace-on-the-north-cornwall-railway/page-2 (see post 49) should provide the answer. It was a mixture of three different packs matched to some photographs in one of Peter Gray's albums, published by Ian Allan and a site visit to Okehampton. The problem was that the Javis product re-acted to the dilute PVA and so I had to sprinkle it onto neat PVA applied very sparingly between the sleepers with a fine brush. You'll have to wait for a reply from Chris as to the answer regarding "what he has tried to remove the mouse effluent from the N/S rail". All the best, John

Woodland scenics best!

Thanks boys, Jayne thinks they're hilarious! Merry flippin' Christmas to you all.

David, I've tried searching for the "Memoirs of a Stationmaster" (1864ish), mentioned in your post above, and have come up with two titles dealing with station-masters working on the Great Western around that period. The full title of the book that I think you might be referring to is; "Ernest Struggles, or the comic incidents and anxious moments in connection with the life of a stationmaster by one who endured it", by H.A. Simmons, published in London, 1879, in two volumes (1/240pp, 2/236pp). Simmons was at Windsor station on the GWR and had 15 years service, which would put him at work around 1864 [Ottley 4024]. The other volume is the, "Life of Roger Langdon, told by himself with additions by his daughter Ellen", by Roger Langdon, published in London, 1908 (pp104). Langdon was the stationmaster at Silverton, GWR between 1867 and 1894 [Ottley 3962/5941]. Both titles sound like a good read about a stationmaster's life in the late Victorian period and especially the operations of the Great Western Railway in the broad gauge era. Previously mentioned in post 12 were some other well-known titles of late Victorian railway literature, where the choice is as deep as your pocket, with volumes like; "The Working and Management of an English Railway", by George Findlay, Whittaker & Co., 1889: a classic text-book written by the General Manager of the London & North Western Railway. Dealing with the same railway in a similar period is; "Railway Reminiscences", by G.P. Neele, London, 1904 (pp504). A book which recalls Neele's fifty year career, beginning on the Eastern Counties and the South Staffordshire Railway, but is principally focussed upon his time on the LNWR as a Railway Superintendent [Ottley 6348]. Both Findlay and Neele's careers overlapped with another LNWR employee who wrote about his time on the railway, Stevenson D., "Fifty years on the London & North Western Railway", edited by Leopold Turner, London, 1891 (pp153), memoirs of LNWR life between 1838 and 1890 [Ottley 6327]. And there's plenty more to look out for from around the last two decades of the 19th Century. Happy reading over the festive season! All the best, John.

A few more books which deal with operations on the 'steam' railway. Whilst helping with a book sale held at Kidderminster Railway Museum during October, another couple of books dealing with railway workers turned up. The first was a slightly battered copy of "GWR Steam, My personal encounter", by Douglas Trigg, 1992, published by Pathfinder Books. It's an account of life for a young man on the footplate during the austerity years of World War 2 and I found it a really good read. Then there was "Tales of Old Railwaymen", by Tom Quinn, published by David & Charles, 1988 ISBN 0-7153-0544-1. This unusual book contains a series of reminiscences about life on the railways with photographs and illustrations by Philip Murphy. A range of characters, from shed-master and station-master to fireman and signalman, recount their experiences in this well-illustrated book, although personally I would have enjoyed just a bit more text! Mentioned by 'runs as required' in post 10, was "The LNWR Recalled", by Edward Talbot, OPC 1987: a book highly recommended to all those interested in the LNWR and which has an extensive bibliography on pages 7/8, containing almost every book and reference regarding the London & North Western Railway published up to that date. Another book that is similar in concept is "The North Western at Work" by R. Preston Hendry & R. Powell Hendry, published by Patrick Stephens Limited in 1990, ISBN 1-85260-129-9. A well produced book which also gives a good insight to working life on the railway in the Edwardian era. All the best, John.

Good to meet you yesterday, Martin, at the Warley Exhibition. It was a real pleasure to chat to you and to see your superb layout in operation. Thanks for bringing Mara Harbour to the N.E.C. show, which was one of the highlights for me and no doubt many others. Hoping you have a safe (and less complicated) journey home. All the very best, John.