Combe Martin

Anyone considering renumbering a Bachmann Fowler tender version of the 4F should be carefull if you want to be accurate and correct. Bachmann's loco is based upon a preserved 4F which has the tender water vents behind the rear coal plate (instead of inside the coal space), ok not too difficult to modify. But also it has the later version of the Fowler tender with coal doors on the tender's cab (leading) side that split the tool box. Many 4Fs in the '60s still had the earlier Fowler tender with just a 'coal hole' there and wide tool box above it. You need to check a photo of your chosen subject, though most are the wrong angle to show the tender front !!. But as an example, most of the right hand drive 4Fs on the Somerset & Dorset line in the '60s (including the Armstrongs) didn't have this tender ! The tender front should be like the Johnson tender front as fitted to the 3Fs.

Thats a very cynical view, but I accept possible. It depends upon the quality of the programming & testing. The problem with the 511 is that it's memory is full, and the software is written in a language that's now difficult to modify because it's gone out of fashion, and few people know it. Dont forget, the new ZTC company is completely different from the old one. Neil Kinison has invested a lot of his own money in restoring ZTC, and developing a new mother board with complete software re-write and new features dosn't come cheap ! I know that his predecessor (Dave Nicholson) upset a lot of people, but you shouldn't tar Neil with the same brush !

Its worth pointing out, that the upgrade (ie the 611) will have a completely new mother board made using more modern components and with much larger capacity memory chips. The software is being completely re-written from scratch in a more modern programming language which will make it much easier to add new enhancements and maintain. So 511 software bugs wont move to the 611.

I can't help but agree with this. Where are all the 'knockers'. Why arn't you slagging off Bachmann like you did when someone in China fitted the wrong bogies to Hornby's B set coaches. Yes, Bachmann have responded quickly, but so did Hornby. I'm afraid there's a lot of bias being shown here. Come on all you Hornby knockers, here's an opportunity to show you'r not biased by crucifying Bachmann. But you won't will you, because you'r biased.

I have no problem getting to ZTC using http://www.ztccontrols.co.uk/

This is a standard problem with the Bachmann decoder. The default values for Back EMF just arn't suitable for their steam locos. They're for diesel locos fitted with much larger motors and/or flywheels. Even Bachmann's own recommended Back EMF CV values are no good, in fact I could be very rude about them. I couldn't get any of my 3 S&D 7Fs to run properly with the Bachmann 21 pin decoder, all ran jittery at slow speed. One now has a Lenz Standard and the other 2 a ZTC258, but I did have to use a 21 to 8 pin adapter, and cut down the mounting posts for the 21 pin socket to lower it. I finally put the Bachmann 21 pin decoder in a 3F, and by setting CV54 to 1 and CV55 to 60 it's not too bad. But of course this loco has very few potential spots in it's mechanism for binding. It's only a 6 coupled, and no valve gear. You could try the same CV values, it won't hurt.

This is an old common problem with the Bachmann decoders. The default values for Back EMF are suited to diesel locos with larger motors and maybe with flywheels too. They just do not suit Bachmann steam locos with their small motors, and maybe binding valve gear at all. Even Bachmanns own suggested values for individual locos do not work well. The defaults are CV54=32 and CV55=24. I've changed them drastically ! I have a Bachmann 3F which now runs nice and smoothly, but I've set CV54 to 1. and CV55 to 60. Of course, this loco has no valve gear to bind, but then neither does a Hall !

A high window 8 compartment Corridor 2nd, I've used a BR green one because I model the 60s, or the "yet to be produced" Open 2nd again in BR green, sometimes even 2 of these !. Not a Composite, I've never found a photo of one of them as a strengthener.

Does anyone know when the R4538/7 Maunsell Open 2nd (3rd) will be available. It's been available in converted form for a while now in the push pull set, but not as the separate loose coach.

I'm not sure this will be the case. Don't forget the Airfix/Hornby and Bachmann locos are models of different versions of 4F. The Airfix/Hornby is a left hand drive loco with plain splashers whereas the Bachmann is a right hand drive with beaded splashers. If you want a RHD loco with plain spashers, I think it'll be easier to convert an Airfix/Hornby to RHD (if you can ignore the boiler backhead) than try to carve the splasher beading off the Bachmann model with the potential for creating a big mess ! And there will still be people that want an Airfix body to fit to a Comet chassis, and plenty of people will still want a cheap loco for kids.

Well having been to the NEC today, the 4F sample on the Bachmann stand has tender coal rails, so let's hope it stays that way.

Thats interesting, well fingers crossed then ? And if does come with the coal rails, the ones I remove I can add to a Hornby/Airfix left hand drive loco. The S&D had all the variations.

Unfortunately that dosn't help if they havn't been fitted to start with. I'd like it with them, then I can buy 2 and have one with coal rails and one without, renumbering both into S&D Armstrongs.

Does anyone know whether the Fowler tender version is to be produced with tender coal rails or not ?. The photographs of the model on here are without, but the prototype pictures on Bachmann's web site show it with them !

The roof and body are a one piece moulding

Well this does seem to be a 'new one'. No-one I know of has ever mentioned this one before !

This is on page 93 of Legends of the Somerset & Dorset Railway, and shows D7024 halted at Stalbridge hauling what looks like a chocolate & cream ex-GWR inspection saloon some time in 1965. This is the only picture I've ever found of a diesel loco on the S&D prior to 'closure'. I've also posed this question to a number of long time S&D experts (far far greater than me) and none know of any other example prior to closure. Not even a class 33 working up the southern end of the line for a short distance !

It would be nice if Dapol were to also produce these in 00 gauge. As it stands, no-one makes an accurate RTR milk tanker. The ex-GWR ones by Dapol and Hornby both have a number of faults and ommisions.

I've managed to fix a scroll to one side of my Combe Martin now, and it's height up the body side is about correct, but when compared against photos of the real loco it looks a bit high. On a photo of the real loco (1962), if you draw an imaginary line from the base of the cabside numbers across to the base of the smoke deflector, then the top of the scroll sits about 3-4 inches below this. On my loco the scroll is immediately below this line with no gap. I think the problem is that Hornby have placed the cabside numbers too low and the bottom edge of the smoke deflector also looks too low as well. Certainly the shape of the bottom edge of the smoke deflector is wrong for Combe Martin. Hornby have also mounted the nameplates too low as well. I get the impression that no two unrebuilt Bullieds are the same. They might have started out that way, but by the '60s they were all different.

There's no chance of reusing the Hornby ones, they're not transfers but printed on. I removed them by gently scraping them away, by dragging the tip of a non too sharp curved blade across them, gradually reducing the pressure as the paint/ink comes off. If you do it lightly and carefully you can do it without damage. I finished off by polishing just the area of the scroll with a little bit of T-Cut on a cotton bud, but just very lightly to remove any scroll residue. You may not need to do this bit !

I'm afraid they are and you'll have to modify yours. Combe Martin is on Albert Goodalls list of those with high scrolls, and besides, there's dozens of photos of it in the Somerset & Dorset picture books. "For glue how about Araldite? Not fashionable and often misunderstood. However these go off without any gases and are not so brittle which Cyno does. To apply mix up glue and using a cocktail stick apply a thin layer onto the back of the plate. I use a low tack masking tape to mark the position of the plate so you know where you are going to put it." Now I do like the idea of using masking tape. If I put the glued scroll onto the tape first, then just slide it up off the tape into position immediately above the tape, will that work without leaving a visible smear of glue on the body side ?, or will all the glue end up on the tape ?

Which make of matt varnish do you use, it seems to me that some are more matt than others. And do you use a spray can, or thin down the varnish and then spray with an airbrush ?

Being an S&D modeller, I too have a Hornby Combe Martin (from the set), and I found that compared to Wilton, the body sat too high at the cab end. The cab roof was much higher than the tender roof. This may have been due to Hornby modifying the chassis. Wilton has the sprung rear axle whereas Combe Martin dosn't. I fixed this by filing out the top of the holes in the boiler backhead within the cab where the chassis lugs poke through. This allows the body to sit a bit lower at the cab end and the rooves now line up. Also, as I model the '60s era, I've mounted an AWS battery box above the buffer beam, together with it's protective cover which I made out of thin brass sheet. Now comes my question. Combe Martin was one of the locos that had the 'West Country Class' scrolls mounted higher up the body side than where Hornby have placed them, and being a bit fussy, I want to correct this. I've managed to remove the Hornby scrolls cleanly without any body damage and I've got some LFC etched brass ones to replace them, but they are tiny and difficult to handle and manipulate with fingers or tweezers. Can anyone suggest how to best fix them to the body side without making a mess ! My thoughts are either super glue or gloss varnish, but there's bound to be a smear of it left on the body side when positioning them. Will it 'chip' off when dry ? Alternatively, does anyone know of a supplier of transfers for these instead. I've noticed from the pictures above that some of you gentlemen look as though you've managed this successfully.

Having studied every published picture 'under the sun' of S&D 3Fs, I would say that this tender is larger than all the others, so suspect that it's a 3500 gallon one. Note the height of the top beading on the tender side compared to that on the cab side. Also it has the sloping front to the tender coal rails and no front coal plate, which is something that isn't on the 3250 gallon tender but is on the smaller tenders (2750 and 2950), so this tender is almost certainly different.

Well they certainly have lots of photographs of a 'different' sort, all black & white, sometimes a bit dark, and I suppose I would say some are a bit more amateurish (ie not in the Ivo Peters class), but then often I've found details in them that I just havn't seen in any of the more conventional books. I've got 4, Celebration of the ..., Heyday of the ... , Legends of the ... and Splendour of the Somerset & Dorset, but there's also Life, Heart, and Spirit, and so I'm on the lookout for them, so I suppose I would recommend them. The problem with them is that they are all limited editions, only 2500 of each, and some online book sellers quote ridiculous prices for them, though the cover price is £20. If you want to look before you buy, I always browse at exhibitions first. I've always found Kevin Robertson (books) to be very accomodating and helpfull. He does the main exhibitions in the south, and he dosn't over charge either. In fact he oftens gives me a discount now which I've never asked for, but somehow I think he must recognise me.