gazwire

That's a bit harsh though and overly critical of customer's natural instincts.

Is it me being harsh though? In all fairness, I'm just questioning why a few posts on this topic seem to be targeting this so called 'advisor'. I'm not having a go at Oxford Rail; If anything I'm taking away the blame as it seems to me they would have employed this 'advisor in good faith.

Out of curiosity- for what reason would someone wrongly advise on the colour scheme? Or, has Oxford Rail unwittingly employed some blagger who sounds like they know what they're talking about, but doesn't really know?

I think you may have misunderstood my post: I haven't stated or insinuated theoretically that the top spec 86 is faster than the 87. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the top spec 86 is 5000hp and 110 max speed- identical to the 87. Therefore, my bracketed statement (in relation to the paragraph) is supposed to be a recognition of the fact that: 'I wouldn't/shouldn't have noticed a difference in performance between the (2 windowed) class 87 and (3 windowed) top spec 86 (which I wrongly thought was numbered 864**)- and this would be the case as they have identical/near on same performance characteristics. That probably makes it even more unclear!

When the train was late, I was certain I could hear the extra clatter over points as the 87 made that 'spirited running' to make up time. Before I was aware of official stats for locos, I always had a sense that the '2 windowed' electric engine travelled faster than the 3 windowed one (although I don't think this would have been the case with the latter 86s- numbered 864**).

Going back a a good few years when I used to travel up and down the west coast mainline;it was certainly not uncommon to have to be waiting for a delayed class 87.

This is slightly off topic but related to the Bachmann colours; I've ingested a few pints and have lined up, on my window cill, a full 9 carriage rake of raspberry ripple Bachmann mark 1s with a cracking looking loco in the newly released 'Titan' class 47. It all looks fantastic straight out the box- I always feel you can trust the efforts Bachmann make- it does make such a difference.

Hi Dave, I placed my order for a 14 car set a couple of weeks ago. I still haven't received any demands for the deposit yet, but I really would like to go to the scanning. Have I missed the boat (no transport pun intended)?

I really like the look of the Dapol ohle and even more so the gantries from N-brass locos. A few years down the I'd really like to use both.

Yes, they look absolutely fantastic. Can't wait to receive mine.

I've just stumbled across an advert for this and thought WOW!- so I've ordered a 10 car set. I might ring up tomorrow and change it to the 14 car set as my model railway, when built a few years down the line in my garden, will have a helix in the corner and the 2 powered cars may be handy. I'm really excited about this- what a time to be a modeller of the ac electrics and now this- just fantastic! Good luck Dave with everything.

Do people think that at long last Hornby will make a descent reproduction of the mark 3 after Oxford have shown the way. I fear, once again though that they'll just do a quick 'that'll do' job which would be a real shame as the class 87s look fantastic.

Thanks 'Tractor_37260' for the advice. I've just packed up my relatively new Hornby and lima mark 3s and am going to do part exchange for the Oxfords. Overall, they are really good coaches to me and I'm sure I can get my mind over the roof ribs and silver window rims which are not necessarily accurate as you say. Also, as'Big Jim' perceptively pointed out- you get used to the features of your own models.

Yesterday I went to have a look at some of these coaches in the flesh. While they are really good coaches, I find the shallow ribboned lines on the roof and the lack of silver window rim so frustrating. These could have been wonderful coaches, especially with their detail. I feel it's a case of 'so near, but so far', as my old Lima ones will look more life like from a viewing distance of any more than a metre. Also, my viewing angle will be predominantly from above the horizontal downwards- therefore the lima roofs make more sense. My head says part exchange for the Oxford. My heart says look into buying lazerglaze windows- the only problem is I'm a novice modeller and fear trying to remove the roof/windows from the base without breaking the coach. Any thoughts would be much appreciated.

Just had a look at some photos of the real thing and there appears to be a secondary curve which is more pronounced depending on the photographic angle/light, so I don't think we need to worry.

If Hornby can do the 86 to this high standard then I hope they make a killing,(not literally!)- I'm so Impressed with both. This must be the start of most satisfying modelling era, ever, for us West coast line fans.

Wow! They both look fab. Can't wait to purchase them. I would love it if Hornby produced a large logo one like 'cock of the north'.

They look amazing. Is there any news on the lighting?

To say I'm over the moon is an understatement so I've ordered both. With the OR mark 3s and Bach Mark 2f it's going be an expensive 2 years but it's a nice problem to have. I'm 40 now and my railway memories were based on travelling up and down the WCML during the 80s so all of these new models during this era have got me more excited than ever before. Sod the pitched roof extension upgrade-it's a once in a lifetime opportunity to aquire quality models of trains I've always dreamt of. A big thank you Hornby, Oxford Rail and Bachmann. Further down the line, I would like to buy the N Brass locos wide portal and Peco catenary system. Both look really impressive. At some point I intend to construct a garden railway which runs into the garage after I have finished the garden landscaping. I intend to have the railway running over a large rockery and water feature including Hackbrucken bridges which I have already purchased and look fab. Fairly soon I'll post the photos of the garden to hopefully get some ideas and expertese from you guys out there.

Absolutely stunning and a work of art. As a local to the area I can vouch for its realism. Well done and very inspiring. Hopefully I can juggle a few things and make the short trip to Wigan. Any chance of a special service from WBQ to Old Trafford if Warrington get to the Grand Final?!

Cheers Simon, I'm going to try and get down.

Absolutely fantastic. I'm from Warrington so I have a keen interest in this masterpiece. Will it be going to any shows? If so I'll try and get myself down.

This layout looks fantastic. I'm from Warrington and live in Penketh (district of Warrington) and am fascinated to see the wonderful progress you've made.