Tallpaul69

Hi Everyone, I am currently working up a design for an 00 gauge layout based on Thame in Oxfordshire in the early 60s. An important part of the facilities was a BP tanker discharge facility built c1958. I am trying to find out details of such facilities. Unfortunately ,so far, I have not been able to find a close up photo of the Thame facility. One of the first things I need to know, is were the tracks concreted, or were they normal ballasted? A photo of a tanker Loading facility in R Tourret's "Petroleum Railtank Wagons of Britain" suggests the track was normally ballasted, but I don't wan to include these tracks in my ballasting, if, in most cases they were not ballasted! This photo was taken during the War, and I wondered if practices may have changed in the 15 years until the Thame Facility was built? Also, the above photo suggests that the discharge pipes came down onto the tankers from steel structures running beside the tracks. However another photo in the same book from a later date suggests discharge pipes coming out of the ground beside the tankers? Any assistance gratefully received. Regards Paul

Unfortunately, as a small town general goods yard Thame doesn't handle enough coal to warrant the expense of things like gantry cranes. The nearest gantry crane was that employed to unload timber in High Wycombe's North Yard - a feature i won't be modelling even though my second station is High Wycombe. This will have room only for a few sidings adjacent to the Station, so North Yard will not exist. Instead my High Wycombe shunter will periodically trip from the station sidings round to Thame, swap wagons and trip back again to mimic the trips the real shunter made to the North Yard! Same goes for ideas of wagon tipping equipment often found at ports or NER type coal drops which I don't think the GWR ever used! Keep the ideas coming? Cheers Paul

Yes, I would have been there as well! Cheers Paul

Will do when its finished!- Probably tomorrow.

Thanks to all of you who have confirmed that my idea along these lines was not so daft! I am thinking of using something a bit more solid for the vertical element of the system. Maybe, a solid piece of wood or dowl rather than a fishing line. Please keep the comments coming, and I will post more details once I have mocked up and trialed my ideas! Best regards Paul

Good Afternoon One and All, In the 12ftx 4ft first stage of my WR 1960/2 layout, I need to empty coal wagons or remove coal loads from wagons that are 2ft 6ins away at the back of the goods yard. Reaching them is a little difficult as the station buildings could catch on my clothing. Any brilliant solutions to this problem? I have used wagons disappearing behind backscenes previously, but for a number of reasons this isn't possible this time! Many thanks Paul

A point of information Kevin:- Are the eyes at either side of the front of the match truck mounts for a rod across the truck that the hook hooks onto, or are they lifting eyes, or what.....?? Hooks can be dangerous if not fixed in any way? Great model by the way! Cheers Paul

Here we are again! Had a good morning today, received, checked and signed off the latest version of "Thame", so we have a track plan to go! I didn't expect it until maybe Monday. I think they are getting fed up with me, so have turned the last two changes corrections around quickly! I have made a start on the signal diagram. I thought it would be easier to amend the official diagram rather than starting from scratch, but it is taking longer than I expected. The tricky bit is getting the disc ground signals right. I think I will run my effort past Mike (stationmaster), before I send it off to Stephen to quote against. Just come back from having my annual flu jab. The town seems full of road works, so I have sent a message to Geoff, our eldest son, warning him as he may be collecting the grandchildren (and friends) from school and he could get caught out if he goes the obvious way! I have started playing around with possible ways to empty full coal wagons on Thame. In Lower Thames Yard I had drawn in two sidings which disappeared off scene into the fiddle yard, so coal wagons could be "swapped", full for empty and the full ones reappear on a later coal train. I don't have room for this on Thame, so I am thinking about removable loads with magnets underneath, and pulling them out of a wagon with another magnet on an wooden arm. It is a bit far to reach them easily to remove them by hand. No idea if this will work, might pose the question on the Modelling Forum? Take care everyone, Best regards Paul

Hi there, While an entirely different proposition to the yard you are interested in, you might find my thread "Lower Thames Yard" of interest regarding the problems and pitfalls when modelling multiple periods. I am modelling a location in 1960-2, 1990-2 and 2016-22. The most modern period is quite wide as I am not yet sure on the best recent years to home in on! Have fun, Best regards Paul

Hi Clive, But isn't part of the fun going back a few days (or weeks, or months, or years, or decades even!) later and putting the mistakes right? Not too experiences with Resin- can you melt it???? I guess the only way back then is to buy another of the same kit....... Now where is that brass horsebox of mine that is more solder than brass? I really ought to take my own advice, but it's easier said than done!! Meanwhile, I'll just carry on with the Kaydees on Bachmann wagons (50, 51, 52......) Hope everyone is keeping well, and doing their bit to keep the Virus at bay? Cheers Paul

Good Afternoon All, It became apparent that before I could progress the High Wycombe Track plan and settle the how many through tracks? issue, I needed to look at the WTTs. As recorded earlier I have a 1962 passenger WTT but only 1954 and 64 freight WTTs. Fortunately yesterday evening I located and down loaded a 1960-1 issue and printed off the dozen relevant pages. I am currently going through the two and recording the conflicting movements, which so far are not too many! Nick Gough's suggestion of using the more modern alignment of up and down platform roads with a space in between where the through tracks were, bearing in mind that I am modelling more modern eras as well as the 60s, has attractions. Watch this space! Meanwhile on the Thame side of things I hope we have reached a final layout. After a revised plan sent to me last night, the only issue was the Fuel Depot layout. This morning I seized the bull by the horns and sketched a version of Thame with a dedicated head shunt for the fuel trains behind a fence at the back of the yard, rather than the previous scheme of using one of the yard sidings as the head shunt. This enabled me to move the entrance to the discharge sidings further back in the scene and allowed the discharge sidings to be straight and longer than previously. I sent this off to the layout builders just before starting this post, so I will have to wait to see what they think! The next job will be to get some details off to Stephen Freeman for him to quote for the signals. These will be simpler than the Maidenhead ones he quoted for, but needing two sets, Semaphores and Colour lights, with the appropriate set plugging in and out simply, makes them still a tricky proposition! While i could get away with only semaphores in Thame as I am inclined to keep the signal box, I think HW will have to have the appropriate signals for each era, particularly if I adapt the modern track layout! On the NG front I hope this weekend to dig out some of the photos I took at last year's 50 year gala, with engines all over the place. Just a memory now, unfortunately, but lets hope the railway can get back to something like its usual program next year? Best regards Paul

Hello, One and All, Not got much done today on the modelling front, but did find time to unpack a 1962 WR London Division section A passenger WTT that arrived from the Bay yesterday. Up to this point I had been using a 1958 version plus a part download curtesy Robert Carroll's site of a 1961 version, - but changing from Maidenhead to Thame and High Wycombe meant I needed the Paddington to Banbury pages rather than the Paddington-Reading _ Oxford pages. I had been summoning up the energy to down load and print those pages when I saw the 1962 full book at a sensible price so pounced immediately! I have also been pondering the representing High Wycombe with less than four tracks problem:- The simplest version is three tracks- two up and one down or two down and one up! Nick Gough's suggestion of one down and two up changing to ftwo down and one up between the staggered platform ends has attractions but would need quite a lot of length so that I could use large radius points to avoid fast moving trains swaying too un prototypically over the points! The really space saving idea is of course to only have two tracks, but I don't think that would look right. So I must settle down with the timetables and see how often trains were overtaken in the platforms. Unfortunately, this will not be a precise examination as the only freight timetables I have for High Wycombe are 1954 and 1964! Maybe someone will look kindly on me soon and post a 1960, 61, or 62 Freight section A on the 'Bay? Kind regards ,

Thanks Nick, Yes that is a possibility! An initial look at the timetables suggests that some slight changes to the timetable could mean the down platform loop could be omitted and the platform put beside the down main. For instance there is a train from Maidenhead via the branch that arrives at HW at 2.39pm, moving on towards Princes Risborough at 2.49. Meanwhile a Paddington to Birkenhead express passed (on the down main) at 2.42pm. If I run things so that the train from Maidenhead arrives at 2.45 , after the express has passed, then both trains can use one line! I have to do more work on the timetables but I am hopeful of finding a solution. Cheers Paul

Yes Nick, they are a must! Fortunately they help with the width problem. I will have to look at the timetable to see the impact of only a single down track. The alternative is to reduce the number of tracks behind the "Brick Wall" in the fiddle yard. I could make the middle track bidirectional but this would complicate the points at both ends of that section, so might not be advisable! At the moment I am planning in the fiddle yard on having three up, three down and one reversing (for the ER local trains). I really want to get three trains on each of the up and down fiddle yard roads, but it well require careful train composition to get them in . The reversing track may only take two trains. Fortunately the 5 track fiddle yard for "Thame" will help as all the trains held there will also go through High Wycombe although trains will leave Thame for Oxford and then appear in High Wycombe from the Princes Risborough direction and vise versa, but that is a compromise I can live with! Regards Paul

Good Afternoon All, As promised yesterday, here are the best shots from my latest pics of the NGR Engineers Train.:- We start with two members of staff taking their lives in their hands to stop the traffic on one of the three vehicle level crossings, none of which have road gates! Once they had control of the traffic the two Simplexes soon zoomed their train across! At first glance it looks like the chaps maning the crossing have a long walk in front of them to Pages Park. If you look carefully above the head of the middle fella you can see the back of the train which has run wrong road into the passing loop! And finally we come to the sad sight of the remains of a Simplex which has been marooned with the wreck of an old fashioned sand wagon in the entrance to one of the old sand workings. This is now covered by a housing development, which has been there some 40? years, so a good job was made of filling in the old workings! Nothing much to report on the modelling front today, except have sketched out first rough of High Wycombe that will run in front of the fiddle yard on the opposite side of the railway room to Thame. Looks like I can only get in two up tracks and one down, the loop for the down platform will have to go! As it is the whole thing is a tad wide for comfort, although the outward opening room door helps with access at the Princes Risborough end. I can't make up my mind whether to have the Goods Yard in its correct location which will make the duck under into the room quite long, or whether to turn it round and have it beside the curve at the Beaconsfield end , which makes a bit of a nonsense of the historical facts of the Goods Shed being the first High Wycombe station! Hope everyone's models are going well? Regards Paul

And here is the latest news on the adventures of the engineers train, and a not so fortunate Simplex....... Here is the wreck of the unfortunate Simplex marooned at the neck of one of the old sand pit entrances. Cheers All Paul

Hi Everyone, I have just emailed my response to the latest plan from my layout builders which surprisingly arrived yesterday afternoon! It is good news from the point of view that most of the amendments I made to their previous plan have been adopted. However, the goods yard has needed some work because the run of the sidings did not allow the run of the main road and approach road that I wanted. But to be fair, I hadn't sent them a plan with these details on. So in a good old fashioned British compromise, I have moved the road a bit, and suggested they move their sidings a bit! The most difficult problem with the goods yard has been moving the BP Fuel Depot form the down side beyond the road bridge adjacent to the station to the up side beyond the Chinnor Road Bridge, which is only possible by accessing it off the goods yard. This in turn means that there needs to be a head shunt in the goods yard to allow the reversing of the tanks into the depot. Also the layout builders had not realised that the sidings for the discharge needed to be straight because of the complex pipework involved , so had plotted them curved ignoring my plot of them straight on my amendment to their previous plan. At least I assume that the pipework is the reason, as I have never seen a plan of one with curved sidings .(stands aside for the avalanche of posts siting examples of curved discharge sidings!) It looks like my thoughts in my last post as to how I will run the modern era version of the layout will have to be the basis of what is run. That is judging from the initial responses to query I posted on the Prototype forum! Changing the subject, I again accidentally , but in a different place, came across the NG Engineers train this morning. I will post some photos tomorrow, including one of a Simplex in not such an advantageous location! Best regards Paul

Yet another soggy day! However, I did unexpectedly this morning receive the latest version of the Thame plan from the layout builders. I am pleased to say that we are nearly there, just need to sketch on this latest plan where the road at the platform end of the station goes, so that they can understand the alterations I want to the sidings. I also need them to realign the two petrol depot sidings as they have them curved and a little short, and all the depots I have seen plans or photos of have straight sidings because, I think of the nature of the discharge equipment? Next job will be a version of the plan showing the signal locations. I would do the signals myself as they are simple:- Fixed Distant, Home, Starter and Advanced Starter in each direction but for the fact that I want sets of semaphores and colour lights, which can be swapped between eras! The Dapols sound attractive, but I have heard that the unplug feature is not robust. I am also thinking round what would be best for the modern era. The GW & GC seems to be mainly Chiltern 168s etc. plus a few 68s and Freightliner/Colas 66s and 70s plus unusual haulage on specials or diversions. So I will have to work out a story for regular visits by other locos. A possibility is to use the GWR locos, units, and stock I already have, is shared use between Chiltern and GWR with GWR running trains off the Cotswold line to Paddington via High Wycombe, and maybe locals to Aylesbury. However to do this will mean HS2 being delayed so that the access is available to Paddington from the GW & GC! Hope you are all making progress with your model worlds? Best regards Paul

To simplify the build process (don't ask!) I am moving the basis of my soon to be built layout from the GW main line to the GW & CG around High Wycombe. One benefit of this is that my modern era running can move forward from 2016 (before the overheads!) to somewhere between 2016- now! However, I am not clear on the locos (I know about the multiple units) that would be found on the line in that time frame? Particularly, what trains did/do class 68, apart from the Chiltern Rail ones, and class70 regularly haul on this line? If no regular runs, what specials did they haul? Many thanks Paul

Royal Blue, Devon General and Exeter Corporation, all thanks to EFE and Original Omnibus, all 1/76 scale, whats not to like? Exeter Central or St.Davids layout any one? Or are they candidates for some cutting and shutting?? Still, I expect Clive has also plenty of Yorkshire buses and coaches? Cheers Paul

Morning All, another soggy day! There was a scheme worked up by Chiltern Railways to rebuild the Thame line as a way to get them to Oxford. So in my model world this was done and the actual (and cheaper) cord at Bicester was never built! My current thinking is to have the Thame trainshed removable, keep the brick built station building for all eras and replace the trainshed by a couple of modern passenger shelters. However there is the small matter of the footbridge! The easy way for this might be to forego the footbridge and put in steps to the road bridge which could do for all eras! I have yet to work out a practical change for the platform lights. Good idea about the signal box, particularly with the goods yard being retained. As well as the dedicated fuel sidings remaining in all eras I think for the later eras I will borrow the engineers sidings that were (still are?) the reuse of the south end sidings on the down side at Princes Risborough. I did think about modelling Princes Risborough, but I just don't have the room. I need to talk to Stephen Freeman who was going to make swapable/removable semaphores and colour lights for the Branch side of Lower Thames Yard about the same sort of thing for Thame. As the signals will be cheaper for Thame I may ask him if can do something for the platform lights . Cheers Paul

Sounds like you are making good progress on the foundations for the branch! Can we have some pics before you hide the infrastructure with the baseboards? I for one will understand better what you have been doing with some pics. And maybe a plan of the branch and how it relates to the rest of the layout (apologies if you have posted these before, just post the relevant page nos.) Best regards, from a soggy UK, Paul

Good Afternoon John and all observers, Once again great photos and good advice via your experiences. Just catching up with this and other threads I follow after a disaster (for me!) with the RMWeb software update. Partly my own fault, I suppose for failing to move with the times on the Browser front. Anyway, now I'm using Edge, things seem a lot better. Best regards Paul

Good Afternoon All, wet as it is here in Bedfordshire! Main problem with RMWeb via Microsoft Edge so far seems to be the non availabillity of my history of viewed site and threads. I do need to work out how to stop receiving notifications when anyone reacts or posts to threads that I watch. I want to limit notifications to my own threads. I spent part of this morning working out the 10 trains and their locos for the first stage of "Thame" in the three eras I want to model. As Thame never existed as a working station in my 90s and modern eras I don't need to worry so much about replacing early 60s features for those eras. I will however have to make the trainshed and goods shed removable, but will leave the station building on its own, as it did exist for a number of years. So the 10 trains in the 60s era are:- Passenger:- up and down diverted expresses, Castle or Hall hauled; up and down local passengers, 61xx hauled or DMUs, a workmans 61xx hauled that came to and from Thame in the Oxford direction; and an auto train or alternatively a class 121 that came to and from Thame in the Princes Risborough direction. Goods:- through up and down Hinksey to Taplow pick ups 61xx or 56xx hauled - these often were only engines and vans past Thame to/from Princes Risborough; a local pick up, 57xx hauled from Hinksey, which shunted and then returned from Thame; and the loaded Petrol tankers that came to the Thame Fuel Depot from the Princes Risborough direction and returned with empties. I will tell you about the later era trains in another post. I am just trying to work out what, if anything I can use the Grain Silo kit that arrived with Octobers Hornby Magazine yesterday Its height would make a good view stopper, but I don't think the eastern part of Oxfordshire produced or used that much grain!

Hi All, Sorry for seeming to ignoring everyone for a couple of days! Couldn't get the new RMWeb software to work. It wouldn't allow me to post, quote , respond to posts (except to "Like". Have changed to Microsoft "Edge" so now seems to work ok. Hopefully tomorrow I can get back to normal. Best regards Paul