Hitchin Junction

I always notice the internal reflecting edges of cast plastic windows. I think it's a manufacturing/cost issue to make windows that way. Some really good hand-made models don't seem to have the same problems. Tim

According to my limited drafting skills, I can get two E1's to pass safely on roughly 200 mm and 160 mm radius curves. I think I'll start going that way. If I have trouble with any larger cars, I can always have some interlocking to avoid both cars being on the same curve at once, I looked at some tracks in Florence and even their modern double track centres in the older streets seem to be a similar distance apart, at least on the striaghts. Tim

I must say , I don't understand the obsession with spending a fortune on making moulds for building plastic models of obscure prototypes, when the likely production run is only a few hundred, and the all the fabulous details get knocked off, and the plastic gears all wear out if you actually use the things. And of course, if it's a one-off, crowd funded model, there are no spares or after sales service for fixing any damage. And in 5 years time, new customers are back to the same situation that there are none available. I don't remember Hornby Dublo models only being available as limited run items. And a heck of a lot of them are still going strong, having been passed down through maybe 4 or more generations. But then I'm just an old chap with a cynical attitude about free lunches and a few metal working tools in my shed. But I haven't lost any money and the tools keep on working. That's what we used to call "modelling". ;) Tim

Wasn't there a kit at least partly produced around that time? Tim

Your example seems to be a simulation of synchronized oval wheels. That reminded me of an old animated video where that was put to music very tunefully. I thought originally you were talking about using the power and speed of the CPU to realistically mimic the true movement physics of the vehicles going over the various bumps, crossings and rail joints. Tim

This is very impressive and powerful stuff. But if you are concerned with the Physics, it's bumpy track, modified by the particular vehicle's suspension design (or no suspension in many model cases) that causes the 3 axes movements of the vehicles. Both real and model railways use round wheels as much as possible to mitigate that ;) However, if you do end up simulating the motion and results of various model working suspension designs, then I suspect the Scalefour society would love to hear from you. Tim

Wow. The whole system seems to be asphalt paved. (or wet concrete if I'm misreading the pictures). So much for my worrying about scribing lots of model setts Tim

My concern with crowdfunding has always been the incredible high risk (and cost) funding someone who has no prior accurate design and model or kit building track record nor any relevant industrial qualifications and experience of specifying and managing the complex and expensive stages of a design through manufacturing process of a highly detail injection moulded product. (and it's mechanism). (sorry for the long sentence- but such projects are a long and many stage process too). Add to that the cost of tooling has to be divided among the limited number of models actually paid to be made and you end up with a likely much higher model cost that one produced through an established model manufacturer/supplier. And if the crowd funding also is to also establish the crowd funders as a business, then you have to add their take to the project costs as well. There have been a huge number of short run brass and/or white metal kits of the more obscure UK prototypes over the past 70 years. None of which were produced by crowdfunding AFAIK. But most produced by modelling entrepreneurs who knew their prototype and were keen, skilled (and thrifty) enough to produce their own drawings and the subsequently far less expensive tooling. If there is some unavailable model I'm desperate for, I'll draw it myself, do a combination of etching some parts and buy a suitable 3D printer for making what used to be castings, and make it for myself for a fraction of the cost. That will soon be something any 14 year old will be able do and afford. Tim

Do you realise the scope of what you are asking? Posting a picture of just a few percent of all the prototype tram versions from around the world would make this topic several hundred pages long and impossible to search and find a particular picture. You'd need a gallery website with a really good indexing system. I think Jan's Strassenbahn site has a small one for German trams. Tim

You don't mention what you are controlling the tram with. Assuming it's a simple DC controller, you might want to try some automotive parking light bulbs in series with the track power wires. Tim

I took a quick look at Recreation21 drawings, but I didn't notice any parts or instructions for the moving point (or points for Germany), or adding the inside part of the rail flange way. Are they coming? Tim

I wouldn't use any plastic for small rods that have any mechanical stress. Never mind the dimensions changing. Tim

I kind of assumed that the designer would need to know how accurately his or her model for sale was going to be reproduced. Just seeing a catalog of 3D mock-ups doesn't tell a potential customer whether they are going to get door handles or just suggestive blobs. Tim

Question. What is the finest x, y, z resolution of a shapeways print? Tim

I'm curious. Are the "Setts" in the track real, or just moulded concrete to look like setts? Tim

Great idea! I hadn't thought about comparing the radius to buses turning circles.. Looks like I should see if I can come up with a bogie chassis that can come somewhere close. I think I'll be gone for a while working on that Cheers Tim

Colin, Re the radius, sorry, I took your 20 x40 board size literally. I always think of track radius as at the track center line. My E1's hail from Tower Models a long (long) time ago. So they are the plastic ones. But I'm going to try cooking up my own chassis, so turning radius and weight will be pretty much what I end up making them as. Since I'd like to acquire some of the modern Euro style trams eventually, I'm going to stick with 16.5 mm gauge and perhaps run them closer on the straights, to make the spacing look more London like. But I do want to stretch the layout out longer than just a plain oval, so that I can have some typical fancy tram pointwork and 2 or 3 different routes. I don't have any 4 wheelers, so I've not seen the rail climbing issue. But it does seem strange that they would have less of a problem than free turning bogies on curves. Tim

I think you are somewhat answering my radius question. For your 20 " ends, your outer track has to be 9" radius or smaller, and the inner therefore around 1.5" radius less than that, to clear two E1's passing. That would definitely show up the difference between trams and model trains that i'm looking for. Tim

I followed up on the picture measuring idea using a web photo I found of the down incline into the Kingsway underpass. That gave a centre clearance width of around 47 inches between two standard gauges of 56.5 inches. So the Twin Tracks centre to centre comes out at say 104 inches, or 8ft 8". That's definitely not a safe space for even a skinny human between two cars, but should look fine on a model. Curves of course are different matter. The unexpected fly in the realism ointment however is the 4mm "00" narrower gauge. The real track shows up as a wider gauge than the spacing, whereas, using 16.5 mm "00" track, it's obviously the other way round. I'm not sure there's an easy answer to that. Tim

Anyone know the figures for the above? I'm getting ready to make up some old 4mm London E1 kits and I want to make sure I can run them realistically and around tight corners, but without any collisions on curves. Tim